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Post-Draft Discussion Thread
jimoh
Veteran
Posts: 4,202 
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Post by jimoh on Jul 13, 2016 14:40:27 GMT -5
Hansen and Bowden were there in 2005 as well. Bowden wasn't yet in the category with the rest but Hansen absolutely was considered there. That was some outstanding upside and depth. 1997 BBA rankings 17 Carl Pavano rhp (Pre-1998: Rated #9) 44 Brian Rose rhp (Bowden-like) 46 Chris Reitsma rhp 60 Jeff Suppan rhp also in the minors: Tony (traded for Pedro) Armas (Pre-2000: Rated #27 Prospect), Justin Duchscherer (454 mlb innings), Derek Lowe (Pre-1994: Rated #63 Prospect), Rich Garces, Rafael Betancourt (695 mlb ip), Matt Kinney (389), Ron Mahay (568) This was in about Duquette's third or fourth year, when on the field they in milb they had Nomar, Trot Nixon, Coleman, Stenson, Sadler, Veras, and Arquimedez Pozo, which seemed like a lot more than two good players. |
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Post by telson13 on Jul 13, 2016 15:06:08 GMT -5
With that trio, the Sox will have their best pitching prospect collection arguably ever. Very exciting. 2005: Lester, Papelbon, Sanchez, Buchholtz That's why I used "arguably." That all four of those guys became good to occasionally transcendent MLB pitchers is pretty tough to top. A 1a/2, an elite closer, and two 2/3 starters is pretty ridiculous. Upside-wise, though, this trio would be better. |
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Post by telson13 on Jul 13, 2016 15:07:27 GMT -5
Hansen and Bowden were there in 2005 as well. Bowden wasn't yet in the category with the rest but Hansen absolutely was considered there. That was some outstanding upside and depth. 1997 BBA rankings 17 Carl Pavano rhp (Pre-1998: Rated #9) 44 Brian Rose rhp (Bowden-like) 46 Chris Reitsma rhp 60 Jeff Suppan rhp also in the minors: Tony (traded for Pedro) Armas (Pre-2000: Rated #27 Prospect), Justin Duchscherer (454 mlb innings), Derek Lowe (Pre-1994: Rated #63 Prospect), Rich Garces, Rafael Betancourt (695 mlb ip), Matt Kinney (389), Ron Mahay (568) This was in about Duquette's third or fourth year, when on the field they in milb they had Nomar, Trot Nixon, Coleman, Stenson, Sadler, Veras, and Arquimedez Pozo, which seemed like a lot more than two good players. Ron Mahay...awesome name from the past. |
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Post by vermontsox1 on Jul 13, 2016 16:00:06 GMT -5
48 hours.
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Post by telson13 on Jul 13, 2016 16:26:49 GMT -5
One of Eddie Murphy's best. |
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Post by RedSoxStats on Jul 13, 2016 22:10:07 GMT -5
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Post by sammo420 on Jul 13, 2016 22:14:27 GMT -5
Let the dominoes start falling. |
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Post by grandsalami on Jul 13, 2016 23:35:14 GMT -5
Wonder what that means for Groome |
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Post by ramireja on Jul 13, 2016 23:40:47 GMT -5
Wonder what that means for Groome Probably that they agreed....and at a number the Sox are comfortable with to get the rest of the top 10 done. |
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Post by bjb406 on Jul 14, 2016 0:06:36 GMT -5
Possibly, but judging by the numbers thrown out the other day, I think this probably doesn't effect it, and that whether and for how much we sign Groome has more direct consequences with Quintana than anyone.
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Post by adiospaydro2005 on Jul 14, 2016 5:37:41 GMT -5
I wouldn't be surprised if Shawaryn signed for slot or slightly under underslot. Looking at videos of him he appears to need some work to clean up his mechanics as that 3/4 delivery has to put a lot of strain on his arm. He needs to clean that up to avoid injury or perhaps move to the bullpen.
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Post by sibbysisti on Jul 14, 2016 5:46:43 GMT -5
Let the dominoes start falling. Could it mean that Groome won't sign and the team is spending his money? |
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Post by adiospaydro2005 on Jul 14, 2016 6:31:32 GMT -5
Let the dominoes start falling. Could it mean that Groome won't sign and the team is spending his money? I don't think so as Shawaryn projects to be a backend starter or more likely a reliever so I don't see the Red Sox overpaying for him. However, I would think differently if they announced the signing for Quintana before Groome which would signal they are using available slot money (including permitted 5% excess) on post 10th round picks. |
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Post by sammo420 on Jul 14, 2016 7:34:00 GMT -5
Could it mean that Groome won't sign and the team is spending his money? I don't think so as Shawaryn projects to be a backend starter or more likely a reliever so I don't see the Red Sox overpaying for him. However, I would think differently if they announced the signing for Quintana before Groome which would signal they are using available slot money (including permitted 5% excess) on post 10th round picks. Yeah, if they sign anybody after round 11 I'd start to worry. I still there's a small chance they squeeze Quintana in, so that wouldn't both excite me and worry me a little bit. Daibec and Groome are getting done. |
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Post by soxfn24 on Jul 14, 2016 12:36:27 GMT -5
I don't think so as Shawaryn projects to be a backend starter or more likely a reliever so I don't see the Red Sox overpaying for him. However, I would think differently if they announced the signing for Quintana before Groome which would signal they are using available slot money (including permitted 5% excess) on post 10th round picks. Yeah, if they sign anybody after round 11 I'd start to worry. I still there's a small chance they squeeze Quintana in, so that wouldn't both excite me and worry me a little bit. Daibec and Groome are getting done. DaLbec, man DaLbec. No "I" in there. Also, Groome's in Boston today per Rotoworld: According to Evan Drellich of the Boston Herald, first-round pick Jason Groome is in Boston to take his physical with the Red Sox.
Which is a pretty good indication that the two sides have agreed to terms, or are getting very very close. Groome fell to the Red Sox at No. 12 overall last month due to makeup and signability issues. The 17-year-old left-hander from New Jersey has already turned down a well-over-slot offer from the Sox, but it looks like the two sides will have something finalized soon. |
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Post by kman22 on Jul 14, 2016 15:22:51 GMT -5
If Groome gets $3.75M, does that leave enough to get Quintana signed too?
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Post by greatscottcooper on Jul 14, 2016 15:25:09 GMT -5
If Groome gets $3.75M, does that leave enough to get Quintana signed too? I'd say yes but who knows. Everyone thought the Sox would sign someone else in 2013 with Sheffield and Boldt at the front but they left close to 1 million on the table. |
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Post by jimed14 on Jul 14, 2016 15:28:15 GMT -5
If Groome gets $3.75M, does that leave enough to get Quintana signed too? I'd say yes but who knows. Everyone thought the Sox would sign someone else in 2013 with Sheffield and Boldt at the front but they left close to 1 million on the table. I'm pretty sure it was a lot less than that. I remember they offered around $400K to each of them IIRC because they only had $300K left. I could be wrong, but it was nowhere near $1M. That was also the first year of the draft cap so strategies were not finalized yet. |
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Post by greatscottcooper on Jul 14, 2016 15:32:45 GMT -5
I'd say yes but who knows. Everyone thought the Sox would sign someone else in 2013 with Sheffield and Boldt at the front but they left close to 1 million on the table. I'm pretty sure it was a lot less than that. I remember they offered around $400K to each of them IIRC because they only had $300K left. I could be wrong, but it was nowhere near $1M. That was also the first year of the draft cap so strategies were not finalized yet. with the 5% it looks like they had $7,171,710 and they spent a total of $6,239,900 which means they left about $931,810 on the table. |
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Post by mannofsteele on Jul 14, 2016 15:41:29 GMT -5
It would be quite interesting if it were Dalbec who was the one to not sign with Groome likely almost wrapped up.
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Post by amfox1 on Jul 14, 2016 15:44:49 GMT -5
Updated for Groome at $3.75mm
Spent to date..: $6,045,000
Red Sox Cap....: $6,997,400
Red Sox Cap +5%: $7,347,270
Dalbec slot $0.501mm (assume $500k)
Shawaryn slot $0.376mm (assume $500k)
Leaves $300k to apply to Quintana or other Round 11+ picks (not including $100k "free" from cap)
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ericmvan
Veteran
Supposed to be working on something more important
Posts: 9,027
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Post by ericmvan on Jul 14, 2016 16:29:17 GMT -5
Updated for Groome at $3.75mm Spent to date..: $6,045,000 Red Sox Cap....: $6,997,400 Red Sox Cap +5%: $7,347,270 Dalbec slot $0.501mm (assume $500k) Shawaryn slot $0.376mm (assume $500k) Leaves $300k to apply to Quintana or other Round 11+ picks (not including $100k "free" from cap) Yup, according to BA they have $425,170 over the Dalbec and Shawaryn slots to spend. I'm still skeptical that they can sign them both plus Quintana. Quintana was ranked no lower than 114 (by BA), and slot for that is $521,200. So who else might be in play? 29. Cam Shepherd, SS, Georgia commitment 30. Tyler Fitzgerald, SS, Louisville 38. Austin Bergner, RHP, North Carolina Shepherd and Fitzgerald were the first two well-regarded HS guys they drafted when they stopped going after easy signs. The last guy they signed who was similar was Longhi, who was ranked similarly, was a 30th round pick and cost $340K against the cap. If I had to guess, they get Shepherd in that kind of deal. |
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Post by FenwayFanatic on Jul 14, 2016 16:31:47 GMT -5
Its going to be interesting to hear what happened with the Dalbec pick if it doesnt work out. Not too crazy about that one to begin with.
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Post by ramireja on Jul 14, 2016 16:36:01 GMT -5
Updated for Groome at $3.75mm Spent to date..: $6,045,000 Red Sox Cap....: $6,997,400 Red Sox Cap +5%: $7,347,270 Dalbec slot $0.501mm (assume $500k) Shawaryn slot $0.376mm (assume $500k) Leaves $300k to apply to Quintana or other Round 11+ picks (not including $100k "free" from cap) Yup, according to BA they have $425,170 over the Dalbec and Shawaryn slots to spend. I'm still skeptical that they can sign them both plus Quintana. Quintana was ranked no lower than 114 (by BA), and slot for that is $521,200. So who else might be in play? 29. Cam Shepard, SS, Georgia commitment 30. Tyler Fitzgerald, SS, Louisville 38. Austin Bergner, RHP, North Carolina Shepard and Fitzgerald were the first two well-regarded HS guys they drafted when they stopped going after easy signs. The three guys you mentioned all seem firmly committed to college via various twitter musings. Its possible that one of those guys could be in play but I'd bet the plan is to get our top 10 + Quintana. Quintana was drafted in Round 11 not because he was viewed as a backup plan to Groome but because we thought he was signable even with Groome. The guys you listed are part of a group of guys that I think were viewed as the backup plan to Groome and I think we can say goodbye to them now. I get that Quintana is probably deserving a 500k+ bonus, but I think he will settle for less. He seems to really want to play pro-ball. |
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ericmvan
Veteran
Supposed to be working on something more important
Posts: 9,027
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Post by ericmvan on Jul 14, 2016 16:37:56 GMT -5
Yup, according to BA they have $425,170 over the Dalbec and Shawaryn slots to spend. I'm still skeptical that they can sign them both plus Quintana. Quintana was ranked no lower than 114 (by BA), and slot for that is $521,200. So who else might be in play? 29. Cam Shepard, SS, Georgia commitment 30. Tyler Fitzgerald, SS, Louisville 38. Austin Bergner, RHP, North Carolina Shepard and Fitzgerald were the first two well-regarded HS guys they drafted when they stopped going after easy signs. The three guys you mentioned all seem firmly committed to college via various twitter musings. Its possible that one of those guys could be in play but I'd bet the plan is to get our top 10 + Quintana. Quintana was drafted in Round 11 not because he was viewed as a backup plan to Groome but because we thought he was signable even with Groome. The guys you listed are part of a group of guys that I think were viewed as the backup plan to Groome and I think we can say goodbye to them now. I get that Quintana is probably deserving a 500k+ bonus, but I think he will settle for less. He seems to really want to play pro-ball. I'd love it if that were true ... although it would be kind of depressing if Twitter were that reliable.  |
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