Boston Celtics 2016-17 Season Discussion

He didn't trade all his assets,  he kept Rondo for example.  Also in 2008 he built a team that was clearly one of the best if not best in league.  Getting Hayward and then making smaller win now moves doesn't do that.  Does Ainge use future assets to try and win now when it most likely doesn't get you a title?  He didn't this year and adding Hayward while really helping you, doesn't get you to the Cavs or Warriors level in my opinion. So the narrative is anything but silly.

I just think the timeline of keeping the picks is off. Adding Hayward and keeping this group together plus hitting on the picks can possibly give you a contender in 2 years.

Sure it could, but that means Brown and Fultz develop very fast.  My personal opinion of Brown is that he takes a slow development curve.  Just remember Smart,  everyone thought he was a future star after his rookie year.  To be fair Smart had a better rookie year in my opinion than Brown.  Now Brown is totally different,  but he is also more raw.  Look at Smart last night.  Man those two shots he got off after being fouled just stood out for me.  They were heady plays,  the type of thing Smart needs to take his game to another level.  How quickly Brown can develop things like that will be key to how long it takes him to develop. 

Fultz may develop faster, he sure seems more skilled.  We really won't know till he plays in NBA though.  The other thing to remember is roster fit and that impact.  Getting Hayward pushes out Crowder, its not like you are replacing Brown with Hayward.  Same thing with Fultz he is going to push out Bradley, Thomas or Smart.  Not all upgrades are the same.  

Personally I think the number 1 pick right now is being undervalued a little, and I want to make the case that the Celtics should keep the pick and select Fultz. Right now Fultz is for the most part a consensus #1 pick. Going back to 1979 there have only been 6 guards taken #1 (5PGs), with 0 busts --> Every one is an all-star or will be one in the future (Wiggins) and 3 are MVPs
Here they are with their rookie year stats:


I think it's highly likely Fultz will be just as good his rookie year and has a very high chance of becoming a franchise, multiple time all-star.
Sure his counting stats might not be as high because he's actually being drafted by a team that's not garbage, but I will continue...

Now the 2 people most talked about are Paul George and Jimmy Butler. To trade for either of those players, the other teams will ask for the #1 pick and other assets. I think it's pretty clear that George will leave after 1 year and therefore is not worth it.

Now Butler on the other hand, will have 3 years remaining at about 18.5M salary and is already a great player averaging 23.9/6.2/5.5. By making this trade it's likely you will have a better team next year and maybe the year after if it takes Fultz a while to develop. However, I think the Celtics would not be good enough to beat the Cavs after this trade anyway as the Cavs are currently constructed. The only way this can happen is with a major injury on the Cavs, and I think if a major injury did occur, the team will already be good enough to contend with them to make the finals. So: I think the Celtics should take Fultz, as it gives them a chance at a legit franchise player with a chance to be an MVP candidate in a few years. 


Also, I don't think it's unreasonable to suspect that Fultz will develop very fast. Looking at the players in that list, they all start out as good players and are all-stars within 2-3 years. 

What is the incentive to trade before the draft? If I am DA, I tell Chicago that I am holding the pick until free agency. Once I see what happens in free agency, maybe I will trade Fultz.

Eh, that is a risk I am willing to take if I am Danny. There are a few good PGs in FA this year, but they cost big bucks, and a young stud will always have a ton of value. If not from the Bulls, there will be someone else.

Was thinking more about this... the Celtics should be able to move him easily if they want by giving a team say 2 second round picks for Jackson and one second round pick and you solve this "issue".

Rip that's were we differ on opinions. I see the biggest need as a rim protecting rebounding big. With our second biggest need being another go to scorer. I also don't see 3 point shooting as a need. Our starting 5 has 4 good 3 point shooters, only Johnson is not one. With Horford and KO you always have a big that can shoot on floor for the most part. I'm so sick of watching guys get easy layups in the paint. The Bulls, Wiz and now Cavs have all done it. No one fears Horford, Johnson or KO.

I am high on Zizic, I think he can help. The question is to what level? I also don't think he's a great defender and certainly not a great shoot blocker. It's why I'm in love with Jordan Bell. He's athletic, can rebound, block shoots and is just an overall great defender. That's what this team needs. If you go Vet route it's a player like Chandler.

I'm not trading Fultz for Butler. Main reason even if you get Hayward and Butler I'm not sure you can win a title having to beat the Cavs and Warriors. It would need to be a Anthony Davis type player. You add Hayward and David to our team and I like our chances against Cavs and Warriors. That's like getting your KG, a do everything big, that fills your biggest need and is an elite player. Now that's just not happening, so I'm not trading Fultz. Nevermind I think Butler is a lower tier superstar. Look at what pg13 did against Cavs. He kept every game close, in a way I just don't think Butler can. Very good player, just not enough to challenge the LeBrons, KDs and Curry's of the world.

I also think chemistry is this teams biggest value right now. The thing is you have no clue what adding all these players will do to that. Nevermind the ones you most likely have to trade away. Say what you want about Crowder but he's the ultimate team first guy like Smart. He does a bunch of little things to help you win. He's a very heady basketball player. Brown for example isn't that way right now. The Celtics play team Basketball, when they do it well they can beat anyone. Just look at the second half of the last game. That's were I think Brown is going to need a bunch of time to develop. He's a very smart guy, but his basketball IQ is not what you would think it should be for a guy like him. Right now his game is 100% based of his physical skills.

I don't understand why LeBron isn't just taking over the game...

Nice shot Jonas

Hopefully Jerebko doesn't play anymore

Not for long but it's been a good effort

Crowder gets taken out shooting a 3 - no call.

Then a horrendous makeup call two plays later.

Refs are morons.