|
Post by beasleyrockah on Oct 16, 2017 14:07:45 GMT -5
Managed for 12 years vs never managed. It's not complicated Bobby Valentine had a ton of experience too.
|
|
|
Post by FenwayFanatic on Oct 16, 2017 14:31:16 GMT -5
Managed for 12 years vs never managed. It's not complicated His decade-plus mediocrity is exactly the reason I don't want him. Edit: not even just vanilla mediocrity either. He was part of a Twins organization that was generally seen as backwards at the time, and that featured weird, inexplicable obsessions with pitchers who never struck anyone out, and hitters who never did anything but slap the ball. The Twins are still trying to dig themselves out of the hole that he helped dig. No thanks. You're starting to scare me.
|
|
|
Post by fenwaythehardway on Oct 16, 2017 15:08:13 GMT -5
continued sorry Indulging veterans, uninterested in analytics. Great unknown: used a docile and supportive media (but probably not a good thing) Sure, turning Farrell's -2.5 games on ingame to a plus 2 would be huge. But a lot of college coaches could do that. Maybe I'm remembering wrong but wasn't Gardenhire also bad tactically?
|
|
|
Post by jimed14 on Oct 16, 2017 15:31:37 GMT -5
Baseball is a young man's game now and I think managers should at least think young and be flexible enough to change quickly. I don't want anyone catering to vets when younger players are better. This has bothered me for quite awhile. So maybe it's just a stupid bias, but I prefer a young manager. Alex Cora is the man. Gardenhire would piss me off from day one.
|
|
|
Post by SALNotes on Oct 16, 2017 16:04:05 GMT -5
FWIW in the AL
Showalter 61 Renteria 56 Tito 58 Hinch 43 Yost 62 Scioscia 59 Molitor 61 Girardi 53 Melvin 57 Servais 50 Cash 40 Bannister 53 Gibbons 55
59 would be on the old side but not crazy
|
|
|
Post by Guidas on Oct 16, 2017 16:09:21 GMT -5
FWIW in the AL Showalter 61 Renteria 56 Tito 58 Hinch 43 Yost 62 Scioscia 59 Molitor 61 Girardi 53 Melvin 57 Servais 50 Cash 40 Bannister 53 Gibbons 55 59 would be on the old side but not crazy And most of these guys I wouldn't want near any team I root for.
|
|
|
Post by grandsalami on Oct 16, 2017 16:25:26 GMT -5
|
|
|
Post by soxfansince67 on Oct 16, 2017 16:26:07 GMT -5
Please...NOT Gardenhire! So far, OK with Kapler or Cora of the names being floated....
|
|
|
Post by Don Caballero on Oct 16, 2017 16:30:54 GMT -5
His decade-plus mediocrity is exactly the reason I don't want him. Edit: not even just vanilla mediocrity either. He was part of a Twins organization that was generally seen as backwards at the time, and that featured weird, inexplicable obsessions with pitchers who never struck anyone out, and hitters who never did anything but slap the ball. The Twins are still trying to dig themselves out of the hole that he helped dig. No thanks. That is not an entirely fair assessment of Gardenhire's run with the Twins, they were a Moneyball-lite team during that time considering they won a lot of games with a smaller payroll. It ended poorly, but from 2002 to 2010 they were legit. I would much rather have Cora or Martinez for a lot of the reason everyone in this thread have already pointed out, but let's not make stuff up.
|
|
|
Post by SALNotes on Oct 16, 2017 16:38:01 GMT -5
|
|
|
Post by soxfanatic on Oct 16, 2017 16:47:58 GMT -5
|
|
|
Post by pedrofanforever45 on Oct 16, 2017 16:52:27 GMT -5
Now looking at the other 2 big names that have popped up, it better be Cora that the Sox hire or I'll feel just as worse as I did with Farrell as a manager.
|
|
|
Post by jmei on Oct 16, 2017 17:53:56 GMT -5
I get the feeling that Dombrowski is interviewing a few old friends of his as a favor but will ultimately hire Cora.
|
|
|
Post by fenwaythehardway on Oct 16, 2017 18:07:22 GMT -5
His decade-plus mediocrity is exactly the reason I don't want him. Edit: not even just vanilla mediocrity either. He was part of a Twins organization that was generally seen as backwards at the time, and that featured weird, inexplicable obsessions with pitchers who never struck anyone out, and hitters who never did anything but slap the ball. The Twins are still trying to dig themselves out of the hole that he helped dig. No thanks. That is not an entirely fair assessment of Gardenhire's run with the Twins, they were a Moneyball-lite team during that time considering they won a lot of games with a smaller payroll. It ended poorly, but from 2002 to 2010 they were legit. I would much rather have Cora or Martinez for a lot of the reason everyone in this thread have already pointed out, but let's not make stuff up. They did have a good run, but I still wouldn’t want any of the architects of those Twins clubs running my team.
|
|
|
Post by jimed14 on Oct 16, 2017 19:29:02 GMT -5
I'm curious if Castillo has a role next year or is the guy going to be in AAA forever simply because of luxury tax issues? He probably could play somewhere in the majors one would think. Is he our 4th OF or not? Yet another potential reason to trade JBJ as Castillo gives us a guy who could play RF or CF on a 4th OF. If they hire Cora as the new manager, it will be interesting if they add Castillo to the 40 man as Cora managed him in Puerto Rico and had good things to say about Castillo over the years. Cora on Castillo 2015
Cora on Castillo 2016
Cora on Castillo 2017
Cora has good things to say about everyone. He's great at making players believe in themselves. That's the best part about him.
|
|
|
Post by Don Caballero on Oct 16, 2017 19:32:54 GMT -5
They did have a good run, but I still wouldn’t want any of the architects of those Twins clubs running my team. I agree 100% there and I would be disappointed with Gardenhire. I just think we might be underrating him just a tad because we all love Cora and because the last notorious manager that came to town was legendarily awful.
|
|
|
Post by redsox04071318champs on Oct 16, 2017 21:29:36 GMT -5
They did have a good run, but I still wouldn’t want any of the architects of those Twins clubs running my team. I agree 100% there and I would be disappointed with Gardenhire. I just think we might be underrating him just a tad b ecause we all love Cora and because the last notorious manager that came to town was legendarily awful. Why do we all love Cora? I'm not saying I don't want Alex Cora as Red Sox manager. He might be an awesome manager. I guess I'm trying to ask why does everybody seem to want Cora if we have no idea what kind of manager he'd be? Or do some of us have a very good idea? The only thing that sounds definitive to me is that from all accounts he's a players' manager. Ok, that sounds good as long as they don't run him over. Does he know how to manage a game? Who is he with sabermetrics as far as making sound managerial in-game decisions? With Dave does that even matter? Is he somebody who's going to be favoring the bunt more than we'd all be comfortable with? What is his philosophy? We know Farrell's philosophy was run no matter what, even if you get thrown out by a stupid amount at a stupid time. We knew that Francona didn't care for the bunt. I just ask this question because he seems to have so much support but is such a question mark. I don't know a ton about Ausmus other than he's a bright guy who inherited a Tigers team on the way down. I read his philosophy about when to use closers which differs a lot from others around here but is kind of close to the way I feel about it. I don't know much about Gardenhire other than his Twins teams at their best were punching bags for the Yankees teams in the playoffs. He seems like an old school guy. When Theo ran the organization old school guys need not apply, but now, with Dombrowski, I can't imagine that statistical probabilities in game decisions mean as much. I would think he's looking at somebody who can handle the media, not be scared off by Boston, and get along with the players, and everything else is secondary, like running a game, handling the pitching staff, and utilizing the roster properly? From what I've read I wish Gabe Kapler would get a long look, but from what Chris H posted, he probably doesn't want that look now, so that's a no-go, but I was interested in reading about how Kapler learned about the value of the bunt, has the intellectual curiousity, and a way of communicating with players. So where there's smoke, there's probably fire - it does sound like the Red Sox will wait until the day after the Astros season ends and hire Cora to be the next manager. And that could be a great thing, a disappointing thing, or a John Farrell in-between thing. I'm just surprised at how much seemingly unanimous support he has, so I just can't help but wonder why.
|
|
ianrs
Veteran
Posts: 2,446
|
Post by ianrs on Oct 16, 2017 21:33:59 GMT -5
One huge plus I can see with Cora is being more relatable for the young core of the team, having a lot of upbeat energy that matches that core, as well as being able to communicate in Spanish at times to make a greater connection to the players. I don't have a sense of his strategy acumen, but the connection piece really does matter as well.
|
|
|
Post by philsbosoxfan on Oct 16, 2017 22:55:59 GMT -5
|
|
|
Post by redsox04071318champs on Oct 16, 2017 23:25:12 GMT -5
One huge plus I can see with Cora is being more relatable for the young core of the team, having a lot of upbeat energy that matches that core, as well as being able to communicate in Spanish at times to make a greater connection to the players. I don't have a sense of his strategy acumen, but the connection piece really does matter as well. The connection part certainly is important. I hope, if he is indeed hired, he has a good sense of strategic acumen or those game threads next year are going to be insane.
|
|
|
Post by artfuldodger on Oct 17, 2017 3:09:40 GMT -5
While Cora seems to be an impressive person, an important aspect is that he is a minority. There were too many stories last year connecting the Red Sox with either past or present rascism for the Red Sox owners to be comfortable.
|
|
jimoh
Veteran
Posts: 4,121
|
Post by jimoh on Oct 17, 2017 4:59:09 GMT -5
Thanks. Does anyone have other informative videos like this, that suggest what he would be like as a manager? I'm surprised I can find so few, given his work as a analyst.
|
|
|
Post by chud on Oct 17, 2017 5:17:33 GMT -5
[quote Joe AmorosinoVerified account @joeamorosino
Interviewing process going fast for #RedSox & could have new manager by end of the week. More on #7News @11 #AlexCora 7:38 PM - 16 Oct 2017 [/quote] The thing I love most about DD is his conviction and his focus...I remember Cherrington mentioning how a manger search affects the off season planning, think it was before the Valentine hire but could have been the Farrell hire...Either way, DD seems intent to cut to the chase, get things in order and NOT have the manager search effect the off season team building process. Personally, I love the conviction. No one is ever right 100% of the time no matter the profession...and from what I've seen/found is that you can be indecisive because you're scared to make the wrong decision (or weigh the pro's and con's too long under the same scared premise) or sometimes people who are prepared and confident just have that natural conviction knowing they've done their research, they know what's right and feel the decision is obvious so they pull the trigger...So DD isn't always right, no one is, but no reason to delay a decision if you're prepared to make it!
|
|
|
Post by GyIantosca on Oct 17, 2017 6:09:58 GMT -5
Who would be Cora’s bench coach?
Just wondering could a coach be successful being a player coach in mlb. I know Pete Rose did it. Imagine Ortiz’ s was healthy and since he is DH being a player coach with a excellent bench coach. Just thinking out loud.
|
|
|
Post by philsbosoxfan on Oct 17, 2017 7:00:42 GMT -5
Thanks. Does anyone have other informative videos like this, that suggest what he would be like as a manager? I'm surprised I can find so few, given his work as a analyst. This one is pretty good and one I totally agree with:
|
|