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5/22-5/24 Red Sox @ Rays Series Thread
radiohix
Veteran
'At the end of the day, we bang. We bang. We're going to swing.' Alex Verdugo
Posts: 6,518
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Post by radiohix on May 23, 2018 21:40:41 GMT -5
BTW, Rafa Devers is starting to draw walks with regularity and narrowing his K zone...Watch out MLB!
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Post by pedrofanforever45 on May 23, 2018 21:43:36 GMT -5
BTW, Rafa Devers is starting to draw walks with regularity and narrowing his K zone...Watch out MLB! Yeah Devers is probably a year or two away from being a force (compared to the elite in baseball). He just needs experience with the strikezone. It takes time, sometimes years.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on May 24, 2018 6:21:09 GMT -5
BTW, Rafa Devers is starting to draw walks with regularity and narrowing his K zone...Watch out MLB! Yeah Devers is probably a year or two away from being a force (compared to the elite in baseball). He just needs experience with the strikezone. It takes time, sometimes years. Easy to forget he only has about 450 ABs above the AA level under his belt.
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Post by patford on May 24, 2018 7:06:13 GMT -5
Another masterful performance by Price but what I enjoyed most was seeing the Yankee bullpen get blown up. I am hopeful years of leaning on their pen has finally caught up with them.
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Post by Guidas on May 24, 2018 7:38:48 GMT -5
Dombrowski is going to trade Swihart for some 7th inning reliever once Pedroia comes back, isn't he? That would make me sick. Trade Nuñez or send down Holt, who they are not using until Nuney needs the DL. Too much potential - and too weak offensively behind the plate to waste Swihart on some Hembree clone.
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Post by Guidas on May 24, 2018 8:00:56 GMT -5
Another masterful performance by Price but what I enjoyed most was seeing the Yankee bullpen get blown up. I am hopeful years of leaning on their pen has finally caught up with them. That was enjoyable, as is any Yankee loss, implosion, misstep, or malfunction. Their starting pitching is more suspect what with Sabathia and Tanaka set for decline, and Montgomery over performing right now. They seem to grow pen arms like kudzu, and they have so much minor league wealth that they could trade for a #2 or even a #1 starter if they choose.
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Post by p23w on May 24, 2018 8:25:28 GMT -5
Another masterful performance by Price but what I enjoyed most was seeing the Yankee bullpen get blown up. I am hopeful years of leaning on their pen has finally caught up with them. I'll be impressed with Price when he does what he did last night to NY and HSTN. Having "masterful" performances against non payoff teams is expected for a guy making a million dollars per start. And rest assured the Yankees will use their prospect depth to secure one or more arms (my guess is Corbin) to their roster. Lot of expectation for both teams this season. All that is needed is a true brouhaha between these two teams to bring back the Fisk/Munson, Varitek/ARod memories. What more can we ask for or anticipate?
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Post by p23w on May 24, 2018 8:25:39 GMT -5
Another masterful performance by Price but what I enjoyed most was seeing the Yankee bullpen get blown up. I am hopeful years of leaning on their pen has finally caught up with them. I'll be impressed with Price when he does what he did last night to NY and HSTN. Having "masterful" performances against non payoff teams is expected for a guy making a million dollars per start. And rest assured the Yankees will use their prospect depth to secure one or more arms (my guess is Corbin) to their roster. Lot of expectation for both teams this season. All that is needed is a true brouhaha between these two teams to bring back the Fisk/Munson, Varitek/ARod memories. What more can we ask for or anticipate? Apologies for the doppleganger. I'm already juiced and it's not even Memorial Day.
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Post by redsox04071318champs on May 24, 2018 8:33:23 GMT -5
Another masterful performance by Price but what I enjoyed most was seeing the Yankee bullpen get blown up. I am hopeful years of leaning on their pen has finally caught up with them. I'll be impressed with Price when he does what he did last night to NY and HSTN. Having "masterful" performances against non payoff teams is expected for a guy making a million dollars per start. And rest assured the Yankees will use their prospect depth to secure one or more arms (my guess is Corbin) to their roster. Lot of expectation for both teams this season. All that is needed is a true brouhaha between these two teams to bring back the Fisk/Munson, Varitek/ARod memories. What more can we ask for or anticipate? Apologies for the doppleganger. I'm already juiced and it's not even Memorial Day. FWIW, Price last October was the last guy the eventual champion Astros wanted to see. They knew they couldn't hit him last October.
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Post by patford on May 24, 2018 9:09:53 GMT -5
I'll be impressed with Price when he does what he did last night to NY and HSTN. Having "masterful" performances against non payoff teams is expected for a guy making a million dollars per start. And rest assured the Yankees will use their prospect depth to secure one or more arms (my guess is Corbin) to their roster. Lot of expectation for both teams this season. All that is needed is a true brouhaha between these two teams to bring back the Fisk/Munson, Varitek/ARod memories. What more can we ask for or anticipate? Apologies for the doppleganger. I'm already juiced and it's not even Memorial Day. FWIW, Price last October was the last guy the eventual champion Astros wanted to see. They knew they couldn't hit him last October. Exactly. I know a lot of people just don't like Price because he makes a lot of money. And because of that many fans want to believe Price is soft. The fact is when he is fully healthy he is a fantastic pitcher. He is often not fully healthy and that is a big problem.
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radiohix
Veteran
'At the end of the day, we bang. We bang. We're going to swing.' Alex Verdugo
Posts: 6,518
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Post by radiohix on May 24, 2018 9:40:48 GMT -5
Hanley ramirez WPA last night was -.236 (He was second to only Colome last night lol) His OPS for the season is .724, he's been a liability in the field and on the basepath too and in 191 PA he gave the team exactly 0 WAR. His GB% for the season is 50.3%, for the month of May it's almost 60% despite playing next the poster boy of launch angle and being coach by a proponent of the air ball. Giving him AB (not even batting 3rd) so his year option could vest is borderline mal practice.
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Post by p23w on May 24, 2018 11:20:17 GMT -5
FWIW, Price last October was the last guy the eventual champion Astros wanted to see. They knew they couldn't hit him last October. Exactly. I know a lot of people just don't like Price because he makes a lot of money. And because of that many fans want to believe Price is soft. The fact is when he is fully healthy he is a fantastic pitcher. He is often not fully healthy and that is a big problem. I sincerely doubt Houston believed that David Price was the last pitcher they wanted to see last October. Price was pitching out of the bullpen last October. Price has a less than stellar post season track record. The Astros are 10-7 against LHP this year. (The Yankees are 12-4 against lefties). Price's previous track record against Houston was "padded" against some pretty poor Houston teams. It's 2018. Houston is the reigning world champion. I'll be "impressed" when Price pitches 7 innings of 3 hit one run ball against the reigning world champs (or the NYY). Shutting down a sub .500 team is nice, but not impressive.
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Post by huskies15 on May 24, 2018 11:20:23 GMT -5
Hanley ramirez WPA last night was -.236 (He was second to only Colome last night lol) His OPS for the season is .724, he's been a liability in the field and on the basepath too and in 191 PA he gave the team exactly 0 WAR. His GB% for the season is 50.3%, for the month of May it's almost 60% despite playing next the poster boy of launch angle and being coach by a proponent of the air ball. Giving him AB (not even batting 3rd) so his year option could vest is borderline mal practice. Yup. It's hit the point in the season where things are more predictive and not simply SSS noise. Cora's been surprisingly stubborn with things when it comes to playing time and the batting order. Moreland and Holt should absolutely play against righties (I won't touch on the catching situation). Hanley should not be in the 3 spot regardless.
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ianrs
Veteran
Posts: 2,444
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Post by ianrs on May 24, 2018 11:40:09 GMT -5
BTW, Rafa Devers is starting to draw walks with regularity and narrowing his K zone...Watch out MLB! Then it comes out today from Speier that Cora is motivating him with gift certificates to Chipotle ($50 for a walk, $100 for an oppo HR). Amazing.
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Post by redsox04071318champs on May 24, 2018 11:55:05 GMT -5
Exactly. I know a lot of people just don't like Price because he makes a lot of money. And because of that many fans want to believe Price is soft. The fact is when he is fully healthy he is a fantastic pitcher. He is often not fully healthy and that is a big problem. I sincerely doubt Houston believed that David Price was the last pitcher they wanted to see last October. Price was pitching out of the bullpen last October. Price has a less than stellar post season track record. The Astros are 10-7 against LHP this year. (The Yankees are 12-4 against lefties). Price's previous track record against Houston was "padded" against some pretty poor Houston teams. It's 2018. Houston is the reigning world champion. I'll be "impressed" when Price pitches 7 innings of 3 hit one run ball against the reigning world champs (or the NYY). Shutting down a sub .500 team is nice, but not impressive. The Astros totally raked Red Sox pitching last October. David Price is the only guy who put a stop to them and he overpowered them. He didn't get lucky. He was dominant out of the pen in Sept and Oct. But until he has a strong (and winning) start in the post-season he'll keep his reputation of being a soft pitcher who can't win the big games. Won't argue that point. I think Price can shut down any team - as long as he's completely healthy. If not, it can get ugly in a hurry. But I totally understand if you don't believe in Price until he dominates a team in the post-season. I'm there myself. I think he can do it, but I'll believe it when I see it.
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Post by redsox04071318champs on May 24, 2018 11:59:31 GMT -5
Hanley ramirez WPA last night was -.236 (He was second to only Colome last night lol) His OPS for the season is .724, he's been a liability in the field and on the basepath too and in 191 PA he gave the team exactly 0 WAR. His GB% for the season is 50.3%, for the month of May it's almost 60% despite playing next the poster boy of launch angle and being coach by a proponent of the air ball. Giving him AB (not even batting 3rd) so his year option could vest is borderline mal practice. Yup. It's hit the point in the season where things are more predictive and not simply SSS noise. Cora's been surprisingly stubborn with things when it comes to playing time and the batting order. Moreland and Holt should absolutely play against righties (I won't touch on the catching situation). Hanley should not be in the 3 spot regardless. I think Hanley will get hot again. I don't think his numbers are that far off where they were two years ago at this point. He had a blazing second half that season. I think Hanley will get hot again, and cold again, etc, but overall he'll be productive. But while he's hitting like crap I'm fine with seeing him move down in the lineup. I think 6th or 7th is a better spot for Hanley anyways. Right now I'd switch Bogaerts and Hanley. And if it were me when Pedroia comes back I'd lead him off and move Mookie to 2nd in the order and bat Benintendi or Bogaerts 3rd and 5th respectively with Devers 6th and Hanley 7th, but Cora is sticking with Mookie 1st so we could see Pedroia 2nd, 3rd or 7th when he comes back. One weird thing is that Hanley has been DHing more lately with JBJ struggling. It could be a coincidence but it seems to me he hits a lot better when he plays 1b. Don't know why, but it could be a thing?
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Post by pedrofanforever45 on May 24, 2018 12:01:04 GMT -5
Meh, I think Price is closer to Rick Porcello these days, but he is paid 10 million dollars more. Price is a tiny bit more pin point with his command, but he needs to be perfect since he doesn't have plus stuff anymore. He's ideally a number 3 starter on a excellent team.
He's going to have his stinkers, but he'll have games where he cruises through 7 without giving up much of anything.
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Post by patford on May 24, 2018 12:16:53 GMT -5
I sincerely doubt Houston believed that David Price was the last pitcher they wanted to see last October. Price was pitching out of the bullpen last October. Price has a less than stellar post season track record. The Astros are 10-7 against LHP this year. (The Yankees are 12-4 against lefties). Price's previous track record against Houston was "padded" against some pretty poor Houston teams. It's 2018. Houston is the reigning world champion. I'll be "impressed" when Price pitches 7 innings of 3 hit one run ball against the reigning world champs (or the NYY). Shutting down a sub .500 team is nice, but not impressive. The Astros totally raked Red Sox pitching last October. David Price is the only guy who put a stop to them and he overpowered them. He didn't get lucky. He was dominant out of the pen in Sept and Oct. But until he has a strong (and winning) start in the post-season he'll keep his reputation of being a soft pitcher who can't win the big games. Won't argue that point. I think Price can shut down any team - as long as he's completely healthy. If not, it can get ugly in a hurry. But I totally understand if you don't believe in Price until he dominates a team in the post-season. I'm there myself. I think he can do it, but I'll believe it when I see it. The same can be said of Sale. Is he considered soft ?
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Post by redsox04071318champs on May 24, 2018 12:45:32 GMT -5
The Astros totally raked Red Sox pitching last October. David Price is the only guy who put a stop to them and he overpowered them. He didn't get lucky. He was dominant out of the pen in Sept and Oct. But until he has a strong (and winning) start in the post-season he'll keep his reputation of being a soft pitcher who can't win the big games. Won't argue that point. I think Price can shut down any team - as long as he's completely healthy. If not, it can get ugly in a hurry. But I totally understand if you don't believe in Price until he dominates a team in the post-season. I'm there myself. I think he can do it, but I'll believe it when I see it. The same can be said of Sale. Is he considered soft ? I don't really see the comparison between Price and Sale. Price is dogged by the reputation of not winning any of his post-season starts and it's a long history. His back and forth with Ortiz in 2013 when Big Papi took him deep twice was a bad look for Price. He was the anti-Schilling when making post-season starts. I honestly think that the law of averages says he'll pitch pretty well in the post-season as a starter eventually. He's already pitched pretty well as a reliever, last year and he was the guy that prevented the Sox from being Champs in back-to-back years in 2008. Just to clear - I don't think he's a "soft" pitcher, but that reputation is there, can't pretend that it's not, and it's going to be there, fair or not, until he pitches well and wins in the post-season. Sale has a very short post-season history. There's one bad start that wasn't surprising given that he was a shadow of his dominating self by season's end and a good relief appearance where he got tagged with the loss that really was Kimbrel's. And it was pretty obvious last year that he was mostly out of gas, which has been his history. Good starts followed by fatigued finishes. Don't know why he'd be considered "soft". Honestly the demeanor of the two pitchers, Sale and Price, couldn't be any different.
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Post by fenwaythehardway on May 24, 2018 12:52:16 GMT -5
And it was pretty obvious last year that he was mostly out of gas, which has been his history. Good starts followed by fatigued finishes. Don't know why he'd be considered "soft". Honestly the demeanor of the two pitchers, Sale and Price, couldn't be any different. What exactly is the difference?
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radiohix
Veteran
'At the end of the day, we bang. We bang. We're going to swing.' Alex Verdugo
Posts: 6,518
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Post by radiohix on May 24, 2018 13:09:38 GMT -5
Yup. It's hit the point in the season where things are more predictive and not simply SSS noise. Cora's been surprisingly stubborn with things when it comes to playing time and the batting order. Moreland and Holt should absolutely play against righties (I won't touch on the catching situation). Hanley should not be in the 3 spot regardless. I think Hanley will get hot again. I don't think his numbers are that far off where they were two years ago at this point. He had a blazing second half that season. I think Hanley will get hot again, and cold again, etc, but overall he'll be productive. But while he's hitting like crap I'm fine with seeing him move down in the lineup. I think 6th or 7th is a better spot for Hanley anyways. Right now I'd switch Bogaerts and Hanley. And if it were me when Pedroia comes back I'd lead him off and move Mookie to 2nd in the order and bat Benintendi or Bogaerts 3rd and 5th respectively with Devers 6th and Hanley 7th, but Cora is sticking with Mookie 1st so we could see Pedroia 2nd, 3rd or 7th when he comes back. One weird thing is that Hanley has been DHing more lately with JBJ struggling. It could be a coincidence but it seems to me he hits a lot better when he plays 1b. Don't know why, but it could be a thing? Last time he was hot was like 2 years ago and those numbers were great just because he feasted on LHP. He's been OPSing in the low .700 for a season and a 1/3 now and we're dangerously getting close to triggering his option. People need to stop thinking about the Marlins Hanley, the version we have sucks and should be benched (DFA'd if you ask me)
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ericmvan
Veteran
Supposed to be working on something more important
Posts: 8,962
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Post by ericmvan on May 24, 2018 14:25:51 GMT -5
I think Hanley will get hot again. I don't think his numbers are that far off where they were two years ago at this point. He had a blazing second half that season. I think Hanley will get hot again, and cold again, etc, but overall he'll be productive. But while he's hitting like crap I'm fine with seeing him move down in the lineup. I think 6th or 7th is a better spot for Hanley anyways. Right now I'd switch Bogaerts and Hanley. And if it were me when Pedroia comes back I'd lead him off and move Mookie to 2nd in the order and bat Benintendi or Bogaerts 3rd and 5th respectively with Devers 6th and Hanley 7th, but Cora is sticking with Mookie 1st so we could see Pedroia 2nd, 3rd or 7th when he comes back. One weird thing is that Hanley has been DHing more lately with JBJ struggling. It could be a coincidence but it seems to me he hits a lot better when he plays 1b. Don't know why, but it could be a thing? Last time he was hot was like 2 years ago and those numbers were great just because he feasted on LHP. He's been OPSing in the low .700 for a season and a 1/3 now and we're dangerously getting close to triggering his option. People need to stop thinking about the Marlins Hanley, the version we have sucks and should be benched (DFA'd if you ask me) Hanley's season. WPA is per 600 PA. (HBP) is when Gray hit him on the wrist in the first and he left the game.
This is stranger than fiction, truly.
Dates G PA wRC+ WPA to 4/12 (HBP) 12 48 160 13.63 4/14 to 4/30 14 62 122 1.16 5/1 to 5/12 10 47 73 -2.81 5/14 to 5/23 8 34 -18 -12.88
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Post by jimed14 on May 24, 2018 15:08:23 GMT -5
Hanley ramirez WPA last night was -.236 (He was second to only Colome last night lol) His OPS for the season is .724, he's been a liability in the field and on the basepath too and in 191 PA he gave the team exactly 0 WAR. His GB% for the season is 50.3%, for the month of May it's almost 60% despite playing next the poster boy of launch angle and being coach by a proponent of the air ball. Giving him AB (not even batting 3rd) so his year option could vest is borderline mal practice. And yet he's still a lot better than Nunez, who is also getting every damn game over Holt.
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Post by p23w on May 24, 2018 15:19:52 GMT -5
The Astros totally raked Red Sox pitching last October. David Price is the only guy who put a stop to them and he overpowered them. He didn't get lucky. He was dominant out of the pen in Sept and Oct. But until he has a strong (and winning) start in the post-season he'll keep his reputation of being a soft pitcher who can't win the big games. Won't argue that point. I think Price can shut down any team - as long as he's completely healthy. If not, it can get ugly in a hurry. But I totally understand if you don't believe in Price until he dominates a team in the post-season. I'm there myself. I think he can do it, but I'll believe it when I see it. The same can be said of Sale. Is he considered soft ? Sales has 2 post season appearances in his career. Price has a dozen. Sale was obviously running on fumes last year. He was 2nd or 3rd in the NP thrown last year, and far beyond his career nigh for NP. In now way do I or would I consider Chris Sale "soft". I do think you could apply this term to David Price. When Price dominates the Astros or the Yankees during the regular season (2018) then I will be "impressed" and even encouraged with regards to his success in the post season. Until that happens I remain exceedingly skeptical when it comes to David Price.
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Post by patford on May 24, 2018 15:20:18 GMT -5
Last time he was hot was like 2 years ago and those numbers were great just because he feasted on LHP. He's been OPSing in the low .700 for a season and a 1/3 now and we're dangerously getting close to triggering his option. People need to stop thinking about the Marlins Hanley, the version we have sucks and should be benched (DFA'd if you ask me) Hanley's season. WPA is per 600 PA. (HBP) is when Gray hit him on the wrist in the first and he left the game.
This is stranger than fiction, truly.
Dates G PA wRC+ WPA to 4/12 (HBP) 12 48 160 13.63 4/14 to 4/30 14 62 122 1.16 5/1 to 5/12 10 47 73 -2.81 5/14 to 5/23 8 34 -18 -12.88 Excellent point.
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