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Post by voiceofreason on Nov 27, 2019 12:21:17 GMT -5
I’m pretty sure Coyle would get 5+ on the open market. I don't know maybe I am wrong but I think that's a bit high for his contribution. He would be all day long if he could come close to the guy from the playoffs last year but he has never been that guy.
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Post by rjp313jr on Nov 27, 2019 12:31:29 GMT -5
I’m pretty sure Coyle would get 5+ on the open market. I don't know maybe I am wrong but I think that's a bit high for his contribution. He would be all day long if he could come close to the guy from the playoffs last year but he has never been that guy. It’s possible you’re right Johnson got 4.5m
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Post by texs31 on Nov 27, 2019 12:36:36 GMT -5
Consider though, there are 121 FORWARDS who will make at least 5M next year. Not players. Forwards.
Even ignoring how the open market inflates prices, he certainly seems like 1 of the top 121 forwards in the league.
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Post by voiceofreason on Nov 27, 2019 12:46:59 GMT -5
Consider though, there are 121 FORWARDS who will make at least 5M next year. Not players. Forwards. Even ignoring how the open market inflates prices, he certainly seems like 1 of the top 121 forwards in the league. He does seem like he would be in the top 121 but he hasn't been as productive as Johnson and it isn't really even close. Taking a closer look with 31 teams and 6 top 2 lines players per team that is 186 guys playing on teams top 2 lines. Not sure he is a top 6 guy on many teams. I'm not hating on him as a good third line C but he is what he is and I hope they can keep him at around the 3.5/4 per yr level. Thanks for the info on the other stuff.
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Post by texs31 on Nov 27, 2019 13:05:32 GMT -5
Are we talking Johansson? Most thought 4.5 was low for him but his injury concerns and a shorter term deal (can go back out at age 30 with, hopefully, a "cleaner" health resume) likely factored in. Most were thinking 5-6 for a player of his production level.
I would very much say Coyle is a top 2 forward on many teams. I think there are plenty of guys who skate on 1st and 2nd lines that aren't as good as Coyle. Just look at LA. Outside of Kopitar, I'd take Coyle over everyone else on that team.
I think you're assuming that the spread of players is equal across all teams and that everyone skating on the top 2 lines is would do so universally.
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Post by texs31 on Nov 27, 2019 14:06:30 GMT -5
Back to the expansion draft, it's going to very interesting to see what's next if both Coyle and Krug sign extensions (or re-sign this offseason). Reminder, the 2 options for protection lists are 7F/3D/1G OR 8FD/1G.
Basically, if you want to protect more than 3 defensemen, you can only protect 8 versus the 10 you can if you only keep 3. The implication of that is that if Krug is signed, he's getting protected. Unless something drastic happens with Carlo or McAvoy, there are your 3 defensemen. That would mean you have to trade Grzelcyk or leave him exposed to the draft.
The only other option would to trade/expose BOTH Heinen/DeBrusk (with 4 D protected, you'd only have 4 spots for forwards and Bergeron and Marchand MUST be protected via NMCs and Pastrnak and a re-signed Coyle would likely be protected - even if not given an NMC).
Of course, there is some time before they have to figure all of this out as the draft is NEXT offseason (not this coming one) but it could impact some moves the make between now and then.
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Post by voiceofreason on Nov 27, 2019 14:20:37 GMT -5
Funny little fact about greedy owners and the expansion. Seattle is paying a 650 million dollar fee that all the teams split evenly, except Vegas as they were an expansion team not long ago.
They paid 500 mil to get in the league but don't deserve a share?
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Post by voiceofreason on Nov 27, 2019 14:42:33 GMT -5
Speaking of expansion, Reilly Smith has put up much better #s and is a better player got 5/25.
The guy I was talking about before is Johnson from TB, that was rjps guy so I am assuming that is who he was talking about.
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Post by texs31 on Nov 27, 2019 16:04:56 GMT -5
As a follow up, Matt Kalman (WEEI) is reporting that a source confirms the report and indicates that they will be "team friendly deals".
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Post by texs31 on Nov 27, 2019 17:39:36 GMT -5
Official now. Yrs were accurate. 5.25 hit for Coyle. 1.35 for Wagner.
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Post by rjp313jr on Nov 27, 2019 18:13:42 GMT -5
Speaking of expansion, Reilly Smith has put up much better #s and is a better player got 5/25. The guy I was talking about before is Johnson from TB, that was rjps guy so I am assuming that is who he was talking about. No i was talking Johanson and my phone autocorrected.
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Post by voiceofreason on Nov 27, 2019 19:18:22 GMT -5
Official now. Yrs were accurate. 5.25 hit for Coyle. 1.35 for Wagner. OK so I should have stuck to my original thought which was "I don't know." Bruins are smarter than me, maybe but the Backes deal was an over pay from the beginning, but I think this says the B's expect a lot out of Coyle. I hope they are right but 15 goals a season isn't anything to be too excited about. Don't see any discount there. Hope I am wrong.
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Post by texs31 on Nov 27, 2019 19:50:22 GMT -5
Someone just reminded me that Kevin Hayes makes over 7m per.
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Post by texs31 on Nov 27, 2019 19:53:47 GMT -5
Official now. Yrs were accurate. 5.25 hit for Coyle. 1.35 for Wagner. OK so I should have stuck to my original thought which was "I don't know." Bruins are smarter than me, maybe but the Backes deal was an over pay from the beginning, but I think this says the B's expect a lot out of Coyle. I hope they are right but 15 goals a season isn't anything to be too excited about. Don't see any discount there. Hope I am wrong. That's fair. I agree that there is some projection in this number. And an expectation that he will take a larger role in the future (especially when DK comes off the books). There is no one else in the org who has the skillset to be a top 2 C. Studnicka is more like a 3rd liner (though he could exceed expectations someday).
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Post by voiceofreason on Nov 28, 2019 11:52:37 GMT -5
Someone just reminded me that Kevin Hayes makes over 7m per. Bad contracts can kill a team, the B's are fortunate to only have 1. Although their have been times I questioned DK. The whole top line are good values and that is big. Team is on pace for 128 points Pasta on pace for 75 goals Both he and Marchant on pace for 120 points LOL life is good for the black and gold!!
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Post by texs31 on Nov 28, 2019 15:41:55 GMT -5
HW wonders if his signing might lead to trading Krejci this offseason (especially if the also resign Krug).
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Post by texs31 on Dec 1, 2019 11:34:30 GMT -5
If the reports that Connor Clifton plays for Boston tonight are true, he will have passed the number of games played to no longer be exempt from waivers.
Some had thought they'd manipulate his games a bit to use his exempt status as a mechanism to create room (roster and cap) for returning D Moore (just assigned to Prov for conditioning) and Miller (was close but just had a setback).
That's no longer possible as Clifton would likely be claimed if put on waivers.
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Post by voiceofreason on Dec 2, 2019 11:53:49 GMT -5
Happy for Backes getting the game winner last night. To say he has had a rough year and deserves it is an understatement. He also showed a very human side to that collision, good for him.
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Post by texs31 on Dec 2, 2019 14:29:32 GMT -5
John Moore completed his 1 GM Conditioning stint in Prov and has returned to the Boston Roster.
Wonder if some movement could come in the not-to-distant future.
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Post by voiceofreason on Dec 2, 2019 17:31:03 GMT -5
Impressive to think about how well the B's are playing with the injuries they are and have been dealing with. Lots of guys getting playing time and doing well, great depth.
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Post by voiceofreason on Dec 5, 2019 10:32:39 GMT -5
Impressive to think about how well the B's are playing with the injuries they are and have been dealing with. Lots of guys getting playing time and doing well, great depth. 22 different guys plus 1 defensemen have played forward for the B's in 28 games so far and they are playing like they are. I am really liking how the Bruins and C's are playing opposite nights most of the time. Been a good year for watching them and both teams dealing with an unfair level of injuries but excelling which adds to the intrigue. How are the young guys going to compete has been a constant question. A lot of guys have stepped up for the B's. A few years back I was obsessed with all the really good drafts they had put together and all the prospects. Well here we are a few years down the road and it is paying off, even with the deadline deals and trades that have sent many of them off. On top of all that the Prov. B's are in 1st place of the Atlantic. I guess that makes sense with all the guys playing well when up that they would be doing well down there but with all the movement it is harder. They are in good shape.
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Post by rjp313jr on Dec 6, 2019 9:25:20 GMT -5
It’s nice that when they lose it’s typically in OT...
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Post by voiceofreason on Dec 17, 2019 8:44:42 GMT -5
Is Coyle going to become the 2nd line RW? If so could this be the start for him to statistically earn that contract? If so who becomes the 3rd line center? Going into the trade deadline which is easier to fill? Probably 3rd line C.
Do the B's need some size going into the playoffs this year? Blues kind of ragdolled them last year and their are other teams out there with size. Fine line in the NHL these days between the fast paced open style of play and the grind it out wear them down old school style that often prevails in the playoffs. Of course the refs have a say in how they call the game, which we witnessed in the finals. I think come trade deadline the B's need to think about adding size at that 3rd C spot if Coyle sticks on the 2nd line. They need some extra grit IMO.
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Post by texs31 on Dec 17, 2019 9:17:46 GMT -5
I think/hope his move to 2RW is a temporary/necessary evil. He's a C. Plain and simple. But having the likes of Brett Ritchie on your 2nd line is a problem so, for the time being, I get it.
Conor Ryan (BSJ) just did a piece listing internal candidates that could impact that decision (whether it be a C, like Studnicka, that would allow Coyle to stay at the spot or an internal wing like Kuhlman or Senyshyn that allows Coyle to go back to C).
I, ultimately, think that help is needed from outside the organization. Candidates that have been "rumored" include:
Ilya Kovalchuk - Recently placed on waivers by LAK and it sounds like he's been a problem. No thanks Rickard Rakell - Anaheim wing who will come at a steep price Tyler Toffoli - LAK wing in his last year Kyle Palmieri - I think he was always a better FIT than Hall (just traded to Arizona) given he's RH shot and, more importantly, has term on his contract.
In trade rumors, I'd caution when you read things like "It would cost X to get player Y". That's only true if X is a player on your roster bc most of the Ys will take up cap space that we just don't have. So, for example, many are saying Toffoli will only cost a mid-round pick. Sure, that very well may be his value. But Boston can't fit his contract into their cap. So you have to move a player who is currently counting on your cap. That'll either be a player of value or a player that has no (or negative) value, which means you'll likely have to pay to move him.
That's one of the reasons that I don't mind going after someone with term (even if it's at a steep price). They'll most likely cost someone on your roster but you'll need that anyway. I'm also looking too far down the road (though I would think GMs wouldn't consider it TOO far) and trying to figure out a way to consolidate guys who will become eligible for the expansion draft (where you'll either lose them for nothing or have to "bribe" Seattle not to take them).
So, if Boston can get Krug done (for example), I would consider Grzelcyk and a Roster LW (Heinen/Bjork/DeBrusk) in a package to get a legit young(ish) 2nd line RW (like Rakell or Palmieri) with term. That solves a bunch of "problems" (2nd line RW, RFA for Grz and Bjork/DeBrusk potentially, Expansion draft management).
What I'm struggling to do in my own head is determine what the right trade would be. Grz and one of the wings seems like a lot. But i'd think Sweeney could figure out something where draft picks could be exchanged to even things out.
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Post by rjp313jr on Dec 17, 2019 9:35:28 GMT -5
I know DeBrusk hasn’t been great but if you deal him for a RW then you’ll be looking for a LW.
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