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Post by philarhody on Nov 21, 2020 9:42:48 GMT -5
 It feels like Atlanta is out on Hayward but them and NY are the only two teams who can sign him at this point. Watch those teams to see if they use cap space, if they use it, not on Hayward, then the leverage is gone. I need to check out who is still available for the Celtics to use their FMLE on if they have it. Let’s say they have it and they get Turner back... would they still want to try and use it on Ibaka? I thought Atlanta had an agreement with Danilo Gallinari for 3 years, 61 million last night. |
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Post by texs31 on Nov 21, 2020 9:55:34 GMT -5
Celtics Blog tweeted his feelings on Turner that seem fair.
Good at shooting and rim protection.
Bad at passing and PnR defense.
Feels that D could be resolved in Cs system.
Also thinks the worst case is they have another middle tier salary to use if a star should become available.
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Post by rjp313jr on Nov 21, 2020 10:07:16 GMT -5
It feels like Atlanta is out on Hayward but them and NY are the only two teams who can sign him at this point. Watch those teams to see if they use cap space, if they use it, not on Hayward, then the leverage is gone. I need to check out who is still available for the Celtics to use their FMLE on if they have it. Let’s say they have it and they get Turner back... would they still want to try and use it on Ibaka? I thought Atlanta had an agreement with Danilo Gallinari for 3 years, 61 million last night. They did, they started with like 43m in space or something |
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Post by philarhody on Nov 21, 2020 11:59:22 GMT -5
Celtics Blog tweeted his feelings on Turner that seem fair. Good at shooting and rim protection. Bad at passing and PnR defense. Feels that D could be resolved in Cs system. Also thinks the worst case is they have another middle tier salary to use if a star should become available. Turner needs to know that he’s not getting traded to play a bigger role on a better team. He’s being traded because he’s overpaid for his correct role, which is as a rotational big on a contender. Honestly, I think Theis is the better player for playoff basketball, depending on the matchup. |
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Post by rjp313jr on Nov 21, 2020 12:26:08 GMT -5
I’m starting to shift back to Danny doesnt “want” Turner. And by want, I mean, he doesn’t think he’s that great. If he did, he’d do this deal already. I’m sure he thinks he’s ok and will take him, but he must feel he’s overpaid and not a game changer.
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Post by rjp313jr on Nov 21, 2020 12:35:37 GMT -5
FVV back to Toronto 4/85
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Post by rjp313jr on Nov 21, 2020 12:36:09 GMT -5
Wonder if that puts Knicks back on Hayward - he may have no interest but curious anyways.
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Nov 21, 2020 12:41:23 GMT -5
Joe Harris got four years 75 million. Like wow. Wood's got 3 years 41 million from Houston in a sign and trade. Guys are flying off the table, Danny better not take too long! This Is an overpay but the Nets are at the point where an over-pay to keep a guy with bird rights does make sense and Joe Harris is a perfect complementary player as a guy who’s a knock down shooter and doesn’t need a lot of touches. Also, gives them salary for trades down the road so I get it. I would have understood a one year 25 million deal versus the deal he got. Thinking about a Harden trade. Yet he's now a massive negative asset for years. They bid against themselves. You try and play him big minutes in the playoffs and teams will exploit that. |
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Nov 21, 2020 12:52:59 GMT -5
I’m starting to shift back to Danny doesnt “want” Turner. And by want, I mean, he doesn’t think he’s that great. If he did, he’d do this deal already. I’m sure he thinks he’s ok and will take him, but he must feel he’s overpaid and not a game changer. The one concrete report that we have, saying what Danny wants includes Turner. They are arguing about the second piece. Which makes sense because I wouldn't want McDermott and Danny has leverage. Danny does nothing quick and always tries to destroy teams in trades. A lot of you keep trying to see what you want it seems. Unless we have more reports? The fact Danny hasn't gone after a big in the draft or free agency backs up the rumors. |
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Nov 21, 2020 13:01:43 GMT -5
Celtics Blog tweeted his feelings on Turner that seem fair. Good at shooting and rim protection. Bad at passing and PnR defense. Feels that D could be resolved in Cs system. Also thinks the worst case is they have another middle tier salary to use if a star should become available. Turner needs to know that he’s not getting traded to play a bigger role on a better team. He’s being traded because he’s overpaid for his correct role, which is as a rotational big on a contender. Honestly, I think Theis is the better player for playoff basketball, depending on the matchup. He's getting traded because they have two of the better young centers in the league and you can't play two bigs in today's NBA. They've tried for a few years now and it doesn't work. Turner or Sabonis need to be traded. I think Turner did just fine in the playoffs lol. He's 24, he hasn't even reached his peak and he's no ball hog. He's the exact opposite, he doesn't need the ball. |
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Post by texs31 on Nov 21, 2020 13:06:52 GMT -5
To be fair though, Indy will have to send out close to matching salary bc after the S&T, Pacers will be hard-capped.
Turner is really the only way to do that.
Not saying Danny doesnt want him but the report that all offers involve him doesnt necessarily mean that Danny wants him no matter what.
Meanwhile, I'm irrationally convincing myself that Danny is holding out for Warren and (maybe) looking for another team to take Turner bc he's promised Tatum that hes going to sign Giles.
If Turner is the keeper out of this deal, the wing upgrade options are drying up. But if you have Giles (who is NOT Turner, I know) in you pocket and can get a wing upgrade like Warren, then that's probably better than Turner and whatever FA wing is left over.
That way Nesmith can develop without contributions being a MUST.
I'm going to preemptively ward off rebuttals by reminding everyone that I said this was irrational.
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Post by rjp313jr on Nov 21, 2020 13:10:15 GMT -5
I’m starting to shift back to Danny doesnt “want” Turner. And by want, I mean, he doesn’t think he’s that great. If he did, he’d do this deal already. I’m sure he thinks he’s ok and will take him, but he must feel he’s overpaid and not a game changer. The one concrete report that we have, saying what Danny wants includes Turner. They are arguing about the second piece. Which makes sense because I wouldn't want McDermott and Danny has leverage. Danny does nothing quick and always tries to destroy teams in trades. A lot of you keep trying to see what you want it seems. Unless we have more reports? The fact Danny hasn't gone after a big in the draft or free agency backs up the rumors. Maybe, but if he loved Turner he’d jump all over him straight up for Hayward. If he signs for 4/100, then depending on how it’s structured, you don’t even need to add more salary to the deal. If I’m Danny, I probably don’t even want McDermott. If you’re trying to get Oladipo too ,then the Celtics need to add more salary and we don’t have that. Doesn’t make sense. Unless I’m missing something. |
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Nov 21, 2020 13:21:31 GMT -5
Celtics Blog tweeted his feelings on Turner that seem fair. Good at shooting and rim protection. Bad at passing and PnR defense. Feels that D could be resolved in Cs system. Also thinks the worst case is they have another middle tier salary to use if a star should become available. His passing might be the biggest issue. How do you rate PnR D? Like do you compare him to centers or the league as a whole? Few centers are really good PnR defenders like Bam. Heck Theis is one of the better ones in the league. At the same time he's not horrible at it, not even close for a center. He played a ton of minutes with Sabonis and I think that is influencing people's Judgement. Him next to Tatum is a big difference. Like in the playoffs with Sabonis out, his numbers were much better. It's why I say keep Theis. He's a very good small ball center, Turner is much more of a true center. We're trying to build a championship roster right? That's the huge nugget, worst case you have a young player who blocks shots and shots three's on a mid level deal to trade. That's a positive asset, that's easy to trade, not a negative one. His deal looks ten times better than Joe Harris who just got 75 million. I don't think I've ever seen a player who so many people view differently. It's not just this board, the so called experts are the exact same way. Some are he's perfect, others are so-so and others are no way. It's like everyone see's something different with him. |
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Nov 21, 2020 13:24:46 GMT -5
To be fair though, Indy will have to send out close to matching salary bc after the S&T, Pacers will be hard-capped. Turner is really the only way to do that. Not saying Danny doesnt want him but the report that all offers involve him doesnt necessarily mean that Danny wants him no matter what. Meanwhile, I'm irrationally convincing myself that Danny is holding out for Warren and (maybe) looking for another team to take Turner bc he's promised Tatum that hes going to sign Giles. If Turner is the keeper out of this deal, the wing upgrade options are drying up. But if you have Giles (who is NOT Turner, I know) in you pocket and can get a wing upgrade like Warren, then that's probably better than Turner and whatever FA wing is left over. That way Nesmith can develop without contributions being a MUST. I'm going to preemptively ward off rebuttals by reminding everyone that I said this was irrational. You actually have a ton of options. |
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Nov 21, 2020 13:30:15 GMT -5
The one concrete report that we have, saying what Danny wants includes Turner. They are arguing about the second piece. Which makes sense because I wouldn't want McDermott and Danny has leverage. Danny does nothing quick and always tries to destroy teams in trades. A lot of you keep trying to see what you want it seems. Unless we have more reports? The fact Danny hasn't gone after a big in the draft or free agency backs up the rumors. Maybe, but if he loved Turner he’d jump all over him straight up for Hayward. If he signs for 4/100, then depending on how it’s structured, you don’t even need to add more salary to the deal. If I’m Danny, I probably don’t even want McDermott. If you’re trying to get Oladipo too ,then the Celtics need to add more salary and we don’t have that. Doesn’t make sense. Unless I’m missing something. That's one way of looking at it, maybe you're right. Yet there are a bunch more ways to look at it right? I said day one Hayward had more value. You add in McDermott who's a negative asset in my book and that just increases. So I'd want a better offer, looks like Danny started out crazy high, which is what he does. Seen reports he wants Holiday. I take this as Danny wants something else and he should. He has all the leverage. Why would you jump at the first offer if you can get more? When has Danny ever done that? |
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Post by rjp313jr on Nov 21, 2020 13:34:14 GMT -5
Hayward to Charlotte 4/120... they need to do a sign and trade right?
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Post by rjp313jr on Nov 21, 2020 13:35:54 GMT -5
Hayward to Charlotte 4/120... they need to do a sign and trade right? Also, kinda proves they don’t want Turner |
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Post by rjp313jr on Nov 21, 2020 13:40:23 GMT -5
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Post by rjp313jr on Nov 21, 2020 13:43:57 GMT -5
Feels like the Celtics may have really screwed this up.
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Nov 21, 2020 13:50:11 GMT -5
Hayward to Charlotte 4/120... they need to do a sign and trade right? Also, kinda proves they don’t want Turner Does it? Maybe Hayward just took the biggest offer or the Pacers weren't offering anything close to that salary wise. Hayward opted out for this reason, he gets to pick where he goes, not Danny. |
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mobaz
Veteran
Posts: 3,044
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Post by mobaz on Nov 21, 2020 13:50:52 GMT -5
Feels like the Celtics may have really screwed this up. I doubt Indy would go that high on salary, so not sure the Celtics "missed" anything since Gordon was obviously still working the market. |
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Nov 21, 2020 13:57:04 GMT -5
The Hornets have two options if it's a sign and trade that doesn't include another team. Batum or Rozier/Zeller plus.
So they likely try three team trades or the Hornets just dump a guy like Rozier.
Horrible move for the Hornets BTW. They need to rebuild.
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Post by rjp313jr on Nov 21, 2020 13:59:32 GMT -5
Also, kinda proves they don’t want Turner Does it? Maybe Hayward just took the biggest offer or the Pacers weren't offering anything close to that salary wise. Hayward opted out for this reason, he gets to pick where he goes, not Danny. The reports are that Hayward’s agents thought the deal with Indy was done but Celtics didn’t agree to trade terms. |
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Post by rjp313jr on Nov 21, 2020 14:00:21 GMT -5
The Hornets have two options if it's a sign and trade that doesn't include another team. Batum or Rozier/Zeller plus. So they likely try three team trades or the Hornets just dump a guy like Rozier. Horrible move for the Hornets BTW. They need to rebuild. Or they could trade us Monk and Bridges |
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Post by artfuldodger on Nov 21, 2020 14:00:59 GMT -5
Hayward choosing Charlotte is the shocker. The other teams that were linked to him at least has tried to win.
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