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Post by sarasoxer on Oct 6, 2021 7:41:19 GMT -5
Well, I don't think the team was gutless. I think that they looked tired, physically and emotionally. There were so many games in the first half where they came back improbably. In my mind, the tank was drained. Somehow the last few games they got a second wind. Hopefully Xander is on the upswing again as he is so important. JD had a hiatus too and it looked like he might have been cooked but he looks better again. Truly Robles and Schwarber have injected life. Having Whitlock back had to provide a psychological boost too. We are past Covid. All of us are so invested that we are up and down emotionally in concert with team performance and that's reflected in comments both positive and negative. I can feel down and frustrated as much as the next person. Having played sports as most here have each experiencing successes and failures, I just find it harsh to call a team gutless when performance doesn't match expectation. Fair take. I hope 2nd half Xander is in the rear view mirror. As an ad on....As much as there is emotional ebb and flow commentary here tied to the Sox play as we are human, sometimes there can also be a holier than thou, above it all attitude evident.
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Post by benzinger on Oct 6, 2021 7:51:59 GMT -5
So much for Brian Cashman having “pantsed” Chaim Bloom at the trade deadline. The Blue Jays and Yankees paid a very heavy price at the deadline to qualify for (and then lose) one playoff game between them. Sure but to put everything in context if the Jays had even gotten off to a slightly better start we're talking about them still playing today. That team took the first few months of the season off. They're going to be a serious problem next year. I really expected that Jays team to be a legit threat THIS year. And now they have Ray(probable Cy Young winner) and Semien(top-10 for MVP) both as free agents. I doubt they can keep them both...and it might be hard to keep even one of them.
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Post by benzinger on Oct 6, 2021 7:53:45 GMT -5
So much for Brian Cashman having “pantsed” Chaim Bloom at the trade deadline. The Blue Jays and Yankees paid a very heavy price at the deadline to qualify for (and then lose) one playoff game between them. They still have Berrios and Gallo respectively next year, so those might still work out..just imagine the Jays offense with some decent pitching ...AL East may be the toughest division next year. But yeah they invested heavily and have nothing to show for it, for now...the exact opposite of Mr Bloom Gallo sucks. They can have him.
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Post by costpet on Oct 6, 2021 8:12:38 GMT -5
I remember reading "Money Ball" way back by Billy Beane. A quote I remember was "In a short series, anything can happen." That's still true.
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Post by sarasoxer on Oct 6, 2021 8:19:33 GMT -5
Love the Bloom brain trust and the work that has been done...truly remarkable. The farm may not have a lot of prized prospects but dang, every Sox minor league team and even those in the DSL had winning records. I don't know if that has ever happened! I believe only the Rays and Yankees had better cumulative farm records this year. I'm anxious and excited to see what moves the future holds.
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Post by FenwayFanatic on Oct 6, 2021 8:41:15 GMT -5
Are we in agreement now to not start Bobby vs tough righties? Doesn’t make a lot of sense.
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Post by benzinger on Oct 6, 2021 8:48:54 GMT -5
Are we in agreement now to not start Bobby vs tough righties? Doesn’t make a lot of sense. Eh, if it’s between him and Travis Shaw, I’m fine with Bobby.
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Post by soxfansince67 on Oct 6, 2021 8:49:21 GMT -5
Saying a team has no chance to win is a take I would never offer up, because it’s a dumb take. If you don’t want to get called out for dumb, reactionary posts, you shouldn’t share them. The problem with all the chicken little posts is, if the Sox lose, they can say I told you so, but if the Sox win everyone is so happy that they forget about it. I’m not letting them off the hook so easily. Here’s the thing—if you spend any real amount of time on these forums, it becomes fairly obvious who the bad posters with bad takes are. It isn’t exactly rocket science. As we’ve already seen in this thread, mocking them and rubbing it in their face (especially in a bad natured way) isn’t going to change their mind. It’s like making fun of the kid who comes in last in the race—even if well deserved because that kid was being an annoying braggart, it’s still a little distasteful. I think that this is quite an insulting post for a moderator, particularly if you are looking to expand those who participate. These are game reaction threads - comments are often made in the heat of the moment. Do you really want to start a high school type atmosphere and name call - bad takes, bad posters? Yes, there are a range of styles, ages and experiences here. If you want this to be a welcoming forum instead of an exclusive club, these types of takes should really be reconsidered.
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Post by aznpopsical on Oct 6, 2021 8:54:46 GMT -5
wanna give a quick shoutout to john henry for being able to push the right buttons for the most part since he became the owner (this time identifying chaim bloom as the right hire for the new era of red sox baseball). as both a die hard phoenix suns fan and a red sox fan, i am constantly reminded the stark contrast and know that that's not something you can take for granted. red sox nation really is spoiled by having an owner like him
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art
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Post by art on Oct 6, 2021 8:55:48 GMT -5
So much for Brian Cashman having “pantsed” Chaim Bloom at the trade deadline. The Blue Jays and Yankees paid a very heavy price at the deadline to qualify for (and then lose) one playoff game between them. They still have Berrios and Gallo respectively next year, so those might still work out..just imagine the Jays offense with some decent pitching ... AL East may be the toughest division next year. But yeah they invested heavily and have nothing to show for it, for now...the exact opposite of Mr Bloom Well, it definitely was this year: four 91+ win teams. I haven't looked it up, but I question whether this has happened before.
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Post by FenwayFanatic on Oct 6, 2021 9:09:04 GMT -5
Are we in agreement now to not start Bobby vs tough righties? Doesn’t make a lot of sense. Eh, if it’s between him and Travis Shaw, I’m fine with Bobby. I was at the game last night but heard they mentioned a stat where Bobby has something like 2 hits against pitches 97+ all year. CANNOT start him against Baz. That would be managerial malpractice
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Post by manfred on Oct 6, 2021 9:23:22 GMT -5
Remember how awful this team was last year? Seems like a bad dream at this point.
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Post by alexcorahomevideo on Oct 6, 2021 9:33:57 GMT -5
Sure but to put everything in context if the Jays had even gotten off to a slightly better start we're talking about them still playing today. That team took the first few months of the season off. They're going to be a serious problem next year. I really expected that Jays team to be a legit threat THIS year. And now they have Ray(probable Cy Young winner) and Semien(top-10 for MVP) both as free agents. I doubt they can keep them both...and it might be hard to keep even one of them. They were dreadful first half of the year. If the season was 163 games instead of 162 the Jays are probably playing the Sox last night. They just got way too far behind before figuring it all out. I'm sure they'll keep one but they aren't the Dodgers or Yankees.
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vokuhila
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Post by vokuhila on Oct 6, 2021 9:52:34 GMT -5
I can't decide which one of these is more aesthetically pleasing:
The Pivetta-Pirouette...
...or the Gardner-Quickstepp
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ematz1423
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Post by ematz1423 on Oct 6, 2021 10:04:19 GMT -5
Can be interesting reading the quotes after teams get bounced from the playoffs. I find this one by Boone very funny. "The league has closed the gap on us." What gap does he mean? Is he really that delusional that the yankees who haven't won since 2009 were the class of the AL all along? There was no gap, why he's acting as if they're the dodgers cracks me up.
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Post by patford on Oct 6, 2021 10:12:34 GMT -5
Kiké's play off the wall was even better than his throw. Talk about a perfect read. He pounced on that ball like a cat and got rid of the ball in one continuous motion. Stanton is locked in. I'm not sure why they pitched to him. Why do Verdugo and Cora get so much abuse? Hard to see how the Sox win a series against any of the remaining teams but this was a great and extremely satisfying win. Schwarber is playing himself into a big contract. He's completely redundant with Martinez and I doubt Bloom will spend much on top of the Martinez 19 million on the DH spot and trying to hide one of the two in the OF. There is a chance the Sox could beat the Rays if Devers, Bogaerts and Schwarber are all on fire and somehow the team gets the good E-Rod and Pivetta. Both E-Rod and Pivetta are intriguing because of how god they are when they are on and throwing strikes. I don't expect anything this year from Sale. He seems really off. His elbow is likely not fully recovered and hopefully next year he will be better than he has ever been with the Sox but right now the velocity and command are not there and look to be ebbing with each start. Eovaldi would then start a possible game 4. One big factor is the bullpen has become solid again even without Barnes and Ottavino pitching well.
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Post by taiwansox on Oct 6, 2021 10:15:22 GMT -5
Remember how awful this team was last year? Seems like a bad dream at this point. That pitching staff was basically what the Orioles had this year haha
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Post by benzinger on Oct 6, 2021 10:35:08 GMT -5
Eh, if it’s between him and Travis Shaw, I’m fine with Bobby. I was at the game last night but heard they mentioned a stat where Bobby has something like 2 hits against pitches 97+ all year. CANNOT start him against Baz. That would be managerial malpractice I get it, but people are acting like they have Rafael Palmeiro on the bench. Shaw can strike out against Baz, too.
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Post by benzinger on Oct 6, 2021 10:37:30 GMT -5
I can't decide which one of these is more aesthetically pleasing: The Pivetta-Pirouette... ...or the Gardner-Quickstepp I’m surprised that Gardner didn’t argue with the ump that he didn’t actually strike out there.
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Post by patford on Oct 6, 2021 10:40:30 GMT -5
I can't decide which one of these is more aesthetically pleasing: The Pivetta-Pirouette... ...or the Gardner-Quickstepp I’m surprised that Gardner didn’t argue with the ump that he didn’t actually strike out there. Even more shocking that Boone didn't run out of the dugout having a complete meltdown and then completely get away with behavior which would get any other manager thrown out.
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Post by incandenza on Oct 6, 2021 10:45:11 GMT -5
Sure but to put everything in context if the Jays had even gotten off to a slightly better start we're talking about them still playing today. That team took the first few months of the season off. They're going to be a serious problem next year. I really expected that Jays team to be a legit threat THIS year. And now they have Ray(probable Cy Young winner) and Semien(top-10 for MVP) both as free agents. I doubt they can keep them both...and it might be hard to keep even one of them. Countervailing factors: on the one hand, their run differential says they were much better than their record this year, and they had to deal with that whole playing in minor league ballparks scattered around the eastern US situation (they sure seemed to turn it on when they got back to Toronto).
On the other hand, they got a ton of value out of Ray and Semien, and even if they do keep them both it's pretty unlikely they're that good again. Ryu also may be slowing down. If some of their young pitching pans out next season they could be really great; but if not I can see a path back to another 90-win season or so.
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Post by redsox04071318champs on Oct 6, 2021 10:45:28 GMT -5
Still basking in last night. I was glad to be wrong on this year's Red Sox team. I picked them to win 79, not much different from most national prognosticators who aren't Red Sox fans. But instead they won 92 games.
Not the first time I was wrong picking the games. In 2019 I picked the Sox to earn a playoff spot with 95 wins and they came in at just 84 wins. I liked being wrong this time better.
I thought that the Red Sox would lose yesterday's game based on the way they've played the past two months compared to the Yankees and the Yankees' pitching edge they've had all season.
I was scratching my head when I saw the Yankees lineup yesterday. It looked thinner than at any time I've seen it since July. No Lemahieu and no Sanchez made that lineup paper thin. I think they had 3 Mendoza line hitters in that lineup.
But the Sox needed to bring their A game, the game they haven't had enough of in a long time, the opposite of what they've done against the Yankees the past six times out when they beat themselves, and at the best time possible they brought their A game. The Sox staff that doles out walks like candy at Halloween didn't issue a single walk. Even Robles came in firing strike after strike. Whitlock was Koji-like in his efficiency throwing just 8 pitches.
That is called setting the tone.
The Red Sox batters, seemingly forever chasing bad pitches, were patient and grinded out atbats in a way the 2004 team would have been proud of. Besides the homers by Xander and Schwarber, the situational hitting of Verdugo last night was impressive. I could do without his kamikaze baserunning, but he was clutch last night, first getting a response run in the last of the 6th and then the clutch 2 out dagger in the 7th.
The defense, which too many times this season has been sloppy, was instead rock solid and the relay in the 6th was perfect and totally deflated the Yankees.
And the most delicious part was at the end when Garrett Whitlock snuffing out the season of his former team. Thanks for the gift Cashman.
The Red Sox played a perfect game last night. When they play sloppy like they have the past couple of months it brings out concerns and doubts and criticism, but when they play the way they did yesterday, they deserve nothing but compliments.
That win last night validates the season. Yes, playing better than expected is nice, but if you lose to that awful team the season feels disappointing, but beating that team and eliminating them....well, that makes the season a smashing success regardless of what happens going forward.
They could get swept by the Rays and it wouldn't change this season from being a huge success. The Rays will be favored to win and they should be favored to win. Doesn't mean the Sox can't win. If they play 11 more perfect, crisp, and clean games like they did last night, they could win a World Series that way.
The only regret I have now is that my cable company did away with MLB network and YES network. I'd have loved to have seen the post-game show on YES to see the Yankee autopsy. And I'd like to see the Michael Kay show today.
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Post by kjkramer on Oct 6, 2021 10:48:09 GMT -5
What? No "Sox are gutless" comments? I said that 100% They were absolutely gutless the last week or so of the season and lucky to get in the playoffs. They were not gutless yesterday. Im hoping they just "hit a funk" and saw rock bottom and we see the team they can be and have been this year. That team can win it all. The gutless team that showed up the last week or so will be swept by Tampa. We find out soon. Im thinking/dreaming/hoping that gutless stretch is gone and we peak now and win ot all..... can easily happen. No matter what.... the Yankees are gone and we will be better no matter what next year. We definitely win it all next year. Winning it this year would set up a repeat possibility
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Post by benzinger on Oct 6, 2021 10:49:06 GMT -5
Can be interesting reading the quotes after teams get bounced from the playoffs. I find this one by Boone very funny. "The league has closed the gap on us." What gap does he mean? Is he really that delusional that the yankees who haven't won since 2009 were the class of the AL all along? There was no gap, why he's acting as if they're the dodgers cracks me up. This quote got a lot of play last night and rightfully so. Since winning it all in 2009, look at how they have fared: 2010: Won ALDS, Lost in ALCS 2011: Lost ALDS 2012: Won ALDS, Lost in ALCS 2013: Missed playoffs 2014: Missed playoffs 2015: Lost Wild Card Game 2016: Missed playoffs 2017: Won ALDS, Lost in ALCS 2018: Lost ALDS 2019: Won ALDS, Lost in ALCS 2020: Lost ALDS 2021: Lost Wild Card Game So in the 12 years since winning it all, they haven’t been to the World Series once, they have missed the playoffs 3 times and have won a total of 4 postseason series. I’d say the “gap” was narrowed long ago.
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radiohix
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Post by radiohix on Oct 6, 2021 10:51:13 GMT -5
In maybe Gardner’s last series in Fenway, he went 0-3 with 3 K’s. I don’t know about you guys but this is extremely satisfying to me.
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