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5/24-5/26 Red Sox @ White Sox Series Thread
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Post by benzinger on May 24, 2022 23:53:34 GMT -5
You probably remember this one. First 11 batters scored if I'm not misreading the PBP
Almost certain I have a live scorecard in a filing cabinet!
In that game, everyone but Nomar had an RBI. In this game, everyone but Xander did.
Oh my! This game was such a classic. I remember it so well. That 2003 Red Sox lineup was just relentless. Bonus points for scoring 6 runs off Pavano before he even recorded an out!
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Post by julyanmorley on May 25, 2022 0:50:47 GMT -5
- The Marlins starter and first reliever left the game without recording an out - Miguel Cabrera's 7th game ever - One of only 8 Byung Hyun Kim Red Sox starts. I was certain he was going to be a stud for us
- This game set the Marlins record to 40-41. They would go on to win the World Series. - Whatever you do, don't click over to the next day's game (Tim Wakefield gave up 4 8th inning runs as a starter. How many years do we have to go back before anyone did that in the majors?) If memory serves me correctly, Grady Little claimed they ran into the third out at home on purpose in the first inning.
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Post by keninten on May 25, 2022 1:47:16 GMT -5
Great win! 2.5 out of the WC. Can tie the CWS with a win tomorrow.
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redsox04071318champs
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Post by redsox04071318champs on May 25, 2022 7:51:21 GMT -5
Almost certain I have a live scorecard in a filing cabinet!
In that game, everyone but Nomar had an RBI. In this game, everyone but Xander did.
Oh my! This game was such a classic. I remember it so well. That 2003 Red Sox lineup was just relentless. Bonus points for scoring 6 runs off Pavano before he even recorded an out! I remember that game. They scored 14 in the first inning and the 3rd out of the inning was almost intentional. I forget which runner it was (Mueller, perhaps?), but I remember he made a half hearted attempt to score the 15th run and was thrown out at home to end the inning. That 2003 lineup was spectacular. I know RBIs is not an analytical stat, but eight guys in that lineup eclipsed 80 RBIs. The only one who didn't was Damon who knocked in 94 a year later. 6 guys smacked 25 HRs or more. Mueller just missed the 20 HR club with 19 HRs, but at least he won the batting title. Nobody in the lineup batted below .273. It was crazy. I'd say only the 1950 lineup was better.
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redsox04071318champs
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Post by redsox04071318champs on May 25, 2022 7:55:40 GMT -5
- The Marlins starter and first reliever left the game without recording an out - Miguel Cabrera's 7th game ever - One of only 8 Byung Hyun Kim Red Sox starts. I was certain he was going to be a stud for us
- This game set the Marlins record to 40-41. They would go on to win the World Series. - Whatever you do, don't click over to the next day's game ( Tim Wakefield gave up 4 8th inning runs as a starter. How many years do we have to go back before anyone did that in the majors?)If memory serves me correctly, Grady Little claimed they ran into the third out at home on purpose in the first inning. I was at that game. It was brutal. Up 9-2 in the 8th inning at home. The score got to 9-6 in the 9th inning. I think the Marlins got a run and I think Brandon Lyon was pitching to some bum named Mike Lowell (haha), who with 2 outs, smashed a 3-run HR into the bullpen to make it 10-9 Florida. I remember the Sox getting the tying run on. Without looking at the box score, I know it ended on a play where it looked like the ball would fall in and the tying run would score from 2b, but I think it was Juan Pierre who made a great catch and then doubled the runner off of 2b (I know Tek was involved but I don't know if he was the runner doubled off or the guy who hit the ball). I know the Sox won the next day 11-6 to take 2 of 3 from the Marlins. They could really hit the ball that year.
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Post by thegoodthebadthesox on May 25, 2022 8:36:01 GMT -5
It's rare when a team has every player score a run.
What I would like to know is: has a team ever accomplished that feat before the game was half over?
CV completed the trick by knocking in himself, with one out in the 5th.
Riddle me this Mr. Stats Guy, has there ever been a week stretch in which a team has scored 10+ runs twice, in one game (such as last night) every starter scored at least 1 run and in the other only 3 starters scored the totality of the runs (the Story game against Seattle)?
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Post by benzinger on May 25, 2022 9:01:26 GMT -5
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Post by benzinger on May 25, 2022 9:10:56 GMT -5
Oh my! This game was such a classic. I remember it so well. That 2003 Red Sox lineup was just relentless. Bonus points for scoring 6 runs off Pavano before he even recorded an out! I remember that game. They scored 14 in the first inning and the 3rd out of the inning was almost intentional. I forget which runner it was (Mueller, perhaps?), but I remember he made a half hearted attempt to score the 15th run and was thrown out at home to end the inning. That 2003 lineup was spectacular. I know RBIs is not an analytical stat, but eight guys in that lineup eclipsed 80 RBIs. The only one who didn't was Damon who knocked in 94 a year later. 6 guys smacked 25 HRs or more. Mueller just missed the 20 HR club with 19 HRs, but at least he won the batting title. Nobody in the lineup batted below .273. It was crazy. I'd say only the 1950 lineup was better. Nomar, Manny and Papi in the same lineup! And none of them were the guy that won the batting title that year(who just happened to bat 8th(!!) in the lineup). Just an absurd offense.
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Post by jerrygarciaparra on May 25, 2022 11:36:22 GMT -5
He'll always be Bobby Bombs to me. However, the Bombs stands for moonshots, not poor results. In honor of benzinger...I predict a -000 --- -000 -000 -0-- -000 --- -- -000 tonight. LMAO! Nailed it! If i do it every night, i am bound to be right some time, I think.
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redsox04071318champs
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Post by redsox04071318champs on May 25, 2022 11:45:47 GMT -5
I remember that game. They scored 14 in the first inning and the 3rd out of the inning was almost intentional. I forget which runner it was (Mueller, perhaps?), but I remember he made a half hearted attempt to score the 15th run and was thrown out at home to end the inning. That 2003 lineup was spectacular. I know RBIs is not an analytical stat, but eight guys in that lineup eclipsed 80 RBIs. The only one who didn't was Damon who knocked in 94 a year later. 6 guys smacked 25 HRs or more. Mueller just missed the 20 HR club with 19 HRs, but at least he won the batting title. Nobody in the lineup batted below .273. It was crazy. I'd say only the 1950 lineup was better. Nomar, Manny and Papi in the same lineup! And none of them were the guy that won the batting title that year(who just happened to bat 8th(!!) in the lineup). Just an absurd offense. I still remember the order in that lineup: Damon, Walker, Nomar, Manny, Ortiz, Millar, Nixon, Mueller, Varitek. They switched up Walker and Nomar in the postseason for a bit. Obviously Mueller would have made more sense toward the top of the lineup but he really hated batting up high in the order.
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Post by notstarboard on May 25, 2022 12:12:46 GMT -5
Am I not remembering correctly? Because I thought it was clear that Barnes performance dropped off a cliff after MLB cracked down on the sticky stuff. Him and Garrett Richards. It may have contributed, but I don't think Barnes' issue was sticky stuff. He's always had low curveball spin and low fastball spin relative to velocity. The biggest issue he seems to have had was a precipitous drop in velocity, which very likely wouldn't have been caused by sticky stuff. His fastball for the year last year averaged 95.8 mph, and it was higher during the first half of the year. He was pretty regularly throwing 97-98. This year it's 94.3 mph and his delivery looks higher effort to me too. Plus, Barnes was rolling last year until August (2.25 ERA, 0.80 WHIP, .161 AVG against on 8/4/21). The sticky stuff enforcement started like two months before that.
I think overuse for the first half of last year is a more likely culprit.
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Post by jerrygarciaparra on May 25, 2022 14:32:47 GMT -5
Am I not remembering correctly? Because I thought it was clear that Barnes performance dropped off a cliff after MLB cracked down on the sticky stuff. Him and Garrett Richards. It may have contributed, but I don't think Barnes' issue was sticky stuff. He's always had low curveball spin and low fastball spin relative to velocity. The biggest issue he seems to have had was a precipitous drop in velocity, which very likely wouldn't have been caused by sticky stuff. His fastball for the year last year averaged 95.8 mph, and it was higher during the first half of the year. He was pretty regularly throwing 97-98. This year it's 94.3 mph and his delivery looks higher effort to me too. Plus, Barnes was rolling last year until August (2.25 ERA, 0.80 WHIP, .161 AVG against on 8/4/21). The sticky stuff enforcement started like two months before that.
I think overuse for the first half of last year is a more likely culprit.
while it is true his velocity is down, it is hard to argue that the sticky ban didn't directly affect him. They banned it on June 21 of last year, that is right around the All-Star break. He made the All Star team and has been barely serviceable since. Even when he was throwing 98 early in his career, he could not sustain good pitching success. I sound like a broken record, he walks too many guys. His career walk rate is 4.1. Nobody is going to ever be great walking that many guys. He should be traded or DFA'd when the time is right, which cant' come soon enough, IMO. And I was a guy who was really excited for many years to have him on the club. It is a shame, he has a rubber arm and good movement on his curve. Add: the overuse argument is pretty spurious. The way MLB is going with bullpen usage, relievers are gonna have to throw 70-90 innings, pretty much all of them.
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cdj
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Post by cdj on May 25, 2022 16:23:18 GMT -5
Sure but just because that’s the way the league is trending doesn’t mean Barnes arm can/could handle it. I think they did burn him out in the first half. There’s really no other explanation for the velo drop he has had. There were games earlier where he was 92-93. Lately I’ve been seeing it tick up but it’s still down overall
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cdj
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Post by cdj on May 25, 2022 17:34:03 GMT -5
Hernandez Devers Martinez Bogaerts Verdugo Story Cordero Vazquez Bradley Jr
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Post by soxfansince67 on May 25, 2022 19:04:44 GMT -5
radar doesn't look too bad - any word on start time?
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Post by incandenza on May 25, 2022 19:16:23 GMT -5
8.40 EDT
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Post by notstarboard on May 25, 2022 19:34:33 GMT -5
It may have contributed, but I don't think Barnes' issue was sticky stuff. He's always had low curveball spin and low fastball spin relative to velocity. The biggest issue he seems to have had was a precipitous drop in velocity, which very likely wouldn't have been caused by sticky stuff. His fastball for the year last year averaged 95.8 mph, and it was higher during the first half of the year. He was pretty regularly throwing 97-98. This year it's 94.3 mph and his delivery looks higher effort to me too. Plus, Barnes was rolling last year until August (2.25 ERA, 0.80 WHIP, .161 AVG against on 8/4/21). The sticky stuff enforcement started like two months before that.
I think overuse for the first half of last year is a more likely culprit.
while it is true his velocity is down, it is hard to argue that the sticky ban didn't directly affect him. They banned it on June 21 of last year, that is right around the All-Star break. He made the All Star team and has been barely serviceable since. Even when he was throwing 98 early in his career, he could not sustain good pitching success. I sound like a broken record, he walks too many guys. His career walk rate is 4.1. Nobody is going to ever be great walking that many guys. He should be traded or DFA'd when the time is right, which cant' come soon enough, IMO. And I was a guy who was really excited for many years to have him on the club. It is a shame, he has a rubber arm and good movement on his curve. Add: the overuse argument is pretty spurious. The way MLB is going with bullpen usage, relievers are gonna have to throw 70-90 innings, pretty much all of them. Overuse was just speculation on my part based on memories and things I'd heard, but from digging into the game logs I think you're right that overuse probably wasn't the issue. He was used fairly heavily, but it also wasn't out of the ordinary for him. I feel confident that sticky stuff wasn't the issue, though.
Here are Barnes' stats from 6/21 through 8/4:
15 G, 14.2 IP, 8 H, 1 ER, 4 BB, 16 K
Not a huge sample, but it doesn't look like a guy that was relying on sticky stuff to me, especially when you consider that his spin rates in 2021 were basically right on his career average.
From that point on, he was terrible. Here was the rest of the month of August:
10 G, 5.2 IP, 12 H, 10 ER, 6 BB, 12 K
Then he got COVID and was out for three weeks... I'm sure that didn't help either.
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Post by jerrygarciaparra on May 25, 2022 19:53:46 GMT -5
all the baseball fortune that was absent earlier in the year is now coming back for us. Go Figure. LOL
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Post by julyanmorley on May 25, 2022 20:02:59 GMT -5
Damn, what's Franchy's 3 cone time
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Post by Guidas on May 25, 2022 20:13:38 GMT -5
Kiké really helping out Giolito in that AB.
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nomar
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Post by nomar on May 25, 2022 20:44:11 GMT -5
Robots please
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Post by greenmonster on May 25, 2022 21:04:53 GMT -5
DOB can't help himself....announcing Hill hasn't given up a hit yet and two pitches later he has
edit: and three batters later they are trailing
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Post by marrcus on May 25, 2022 21:48:21 GMT -5
Right time for Verdugo to sustain the rally and tie this game.
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Post by benzinger on May 25, 2022 22:02:48 GMT -5
Right time for Verdugo to sustain the rally and tie this game. Verdugo has a lower OPS than Kikè does this season(and the lowest in tonight’s starting lineup). That’s hard to believe.
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cdj
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Post by cdj on May 25, 2022 22:05:30 GMT -5
This guys sucks
Bring me the friggin robots
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