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Patriots 2022 Season Thread
cdj
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Post by cdj on Dec 19, 2022 8:49:57 GMT -5
Don’t know if a 4th OC in 4 years will be good for mac, might be too late at that point
They clearly didn’t attend “How to raise a young QB 101”
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cdj
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Post by cdj on Dec 19, 2022 8:51:44 GMT -5
Also I’m glad that the offensive line was decent last night so I don’t have to see that excuse for Matt Patricia ineptitude
The offense just fundamentally sucks. He doesn’t even get the plays in on time, that’s why Jones freaks out on him every week.
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mobaz
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Post by mobaz on Dec 19, 2022 9:12:18 GMT -5
Positive view: e very week this offense continues to suck is further evidence that Patricia and Judge need to be fired (or at least stop working with the offense). Key young building blocks like Duggar, Uche, Stevenson, Marcus Jones, etc. continue to pop. They weren’t going to advance in the playoffs anyways and better draft position is honestly more important for their long-term development. The problem is the decision making that went into them becoming the OCs in the first place. It was an awful idea on the surface that was then awful in initial execution (camp and preseason were really bad) that has proven to be far worse than I imagined, especially given the play and mental setbacks in Mac. Bill's arrogance OBVIOUSLY has hugely benefited this team this century but the last 5 years it has been far more detrimental than beneficial. He's missing the basics of "do your job" at the coaching and pro personnel levels, and that's trickled down into the team, where dumb mistakes have become the norm. We've gotten the most out of Judon, and the DBs situation is far better than anticipated. I'm a little sympathetic to the personnel choices along the OL, but it's mostly a failure. The WR group continues to be unsatisfactory (since Brady's last days), linebacker corp hasn't really improved, and the defense breaks often enough to put our offense on its heels. The investments in TEs (picks in '20 and FA in '21) haven't yielded anything. It's the NFL, so things can turn fast but it's a long path for next year to be better than this year. |
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Post by redsoxfan2 on Dec 19, 2022 9:15:17 GMT -5
I liked seeing Bill say Mac can't throw the ball 55 yards which is why there was no hail Mary.
The whole thing needs to get washed. Bill screwed up this kid.
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Post by Don Caballero on Dec 19, 2022 11:38:24 GMT -5
I don't think Mac is the issue. He has shown he can be a good QB, I don't think the Pats should be looking for a replacement just yet. However, I've been saying this from the start, he lacks an elite arm so he will never ever be Mahomes, Allen or Herbert. He can't run, so Jackson or Hurts is out of question. So where does that leave him, what is a good comp for him? Honestly I think it's someone like Kirk Cousins or Jared Goff. Decent starter, but you absolutely need an elite receiver like St. Brown or Jefferson for it to work. His best WR right now is Meyers which come on is just not good enough.
The question moving forward is do you bet on finding that elusive QB with an elite tool or do you try and give Jones his #1 weapon? Doing what they're doing right now is not going to work.
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Dec 19, 2022 12:54:00 GMT -5
Does it help people sleep blaming everything on certain people? If you watched that game and you come away saying it's all the coaching, you're just kidding yourself. Let me guess MP made Jones miss a wide open Meyers and Henry.
The arm chair coaches too much deep ball not Jones game, too much short passes. Well they tried airing it out last game, Mac Jones made a bunch of mistakes. Just like the last play, everyone playing the OC, yet it was the players.
Mac Jones losing his cool is a bad sign. The issues with the play clock are mostly him. He changes plays, reads D and snaps the ball late on a ton of plays. Nevermind his ability to to actually read the D and make the right decision hasn't been good.
He looks like a 2nd year QB who didn't even start 2 years in college. He’s in that QB room, he has a say clearly in what they are doing. He bitches about short passes, they open it up next game. Results are even worse.
Funny how people don't remember how they bitched about McDaniels every game. Watching the Raiders was comical, that McDaniels offense is crap. You know it's almost like even veteran players need time to adjust lol.
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cdj
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Post by cdj on Dec 19, 2022 15:33:48 GMT -5
I love that you’re still going to bat for Matt Patricia as an OC. The loyalty is admirable. It’s ok to admit hiring him for that role was braindead. It was malpractice. It was blatant cronyism. How many QB’s has he successfully developed? What about Judge?
It’s you against the world on this one. Fans, analysts, players. They all see the spacing is awful, the timing on the plays isn’t there. The entire offense is in the ****ter. It was in the ****ter in July. It’s still in the ****ter in December. He doesn’t even get the plays in on time!!!!!! 😂😂😂
It’s funny how under mcdaniels Jones looked competent and under Patricia he looks like Zach Wilson
Offensive line was fine yesterday. Stop making excuses for a ****ty coordinator WHO HAS ZERO EXPERIENCE DOING WHAT HES DOING and turned a decent Qb into a bad one.
Mac sucks too, he deserves plenty of blame. Would be a lot easier if his OC knew what he was doing tho
Me? I’d fire the entire coaching staff. Dumb errors after dumb errors. Might need a new QB too because they’ve tried their hardest to break this toy
Can’t wait for 3 weeks from now when they kick 2 field goals and lose by 3 touchdowns and those of us in this thread get to hear that Matt Patricia is actually good at his job and it’s everybody else’s fault he can’t do a job he’s never done. It’s getting hilarious at this point.
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Post by redsoxfan2 on Dec 19, 2022 17:01:08 GMT -5
Does it help people sleep blaming everything on certain people? If you watched that game and you come away saying it's all the coaching, you're just kidding yourself. Let me guess MP made Jones miss a wide open Meyers and Henry. The arm chair coaches too much deep ball not Jones game, too much short passes. Well they tried airing it out last game, Mac Jones made a bunch of mistakes. Just like the last play, everyone playing the OC, yet it was the players. Mac Jones losing his cool is a bad sign. The issues with the play clock are mostly him. He changes plays, reads D and snaps the ball late on a ton of plays. Nevermind his ability to to actually read the D and make the right decision hasn't been good. He looks like a 2nd year QB who didn't even start 2 years in college. He’s in that QB room, he has a say clearly in what they are doing. He bitches about short passes, they open it up next game. Results are even worse. Funny how people don't remember how they bitched about McDaniels every game. Watching the Raiders was comical, that McDaniels offense is crap. You know it's almost like even veteran players need time to adjust lol. I'm not going to lie, there's a lot of truth in here. But, that doesn't mean MP had a good game. You have an opposing defensive coordinator publicly laughing at your offensive coordinator (and you only really won that game because Murray went down and they were a bad team to begin with). Former players, current players, national guys and even Zolak are bashing MP and speaking how it was not a good hire. Whose fault is it that they had 3 tries at the half yard marker and they threw the ball 3 times? They got a touchdown, but Bill didn't like the look and it gets pulled back as a result. Mac might have gotten it on the 4th try, but false start. Why do they have players so clueless about situational football that they think that laterals are a great idea in a tie game? A lot of this is Bill, but wasting timeouts, wasting game clock, calling predictable plays, players saying they're clueless as to what the defenses are doing. A lot of that is on MP. Mac had an atrocious game. MP sucks, but if Mac keeps playing like that he'll be out of the league real quick. It's not MP's fault he couldn't hit a wide open Jonnu. It's amazing that the Patriots were even less than a minute away from winning this game. As far as McDaniels is concerned, I'm guilty of this myself; however, this is like, "Remember how you were complaining your computer couldn't handle a game properly? Well, we got rid of it and got you a book instead. Enjoy". All of an sudden Josh McDaniels feels like the greatest OC to ever walk the Earth. |
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cdj
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Post by cdj on Dec 19, 2022 17:06:30 GMT -5
Maybe I’d be willing to debate Patricia’s merit if he actually went one week without not getting a play in on time but since he can’t even do that then I don’t know what the point is. That’s like the most basic ask. Call a play. Doesn’t even have to be a good one at this point- hell we know it probably won’t be a good one!- but at least get it in on time so the team can get set, know what they’re doing, and can get the play off
I was willing to give him the benefit of the doubt because I didn’t mind him as DC (although I liked Flores more) but it’s readily apparent his hiring as OC has been a mistake, and something he’s wildly unfit to do.
And judge needs to go back to ST, and they need to fire Achord
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Dec 19, 2022 19:16:16 GMT -5
Does it help people sleep blaming everything on certain people? If you watched that game and you come away saying it's all the coaching, you're just kidding yourself. Let me guess MP made Jones miss a wide open Meyers and Henry. The arm chair coaches too much deep ball not Jones game, too much short passes. Well they tried airing it out last game, Mac Jones made a bunch of mistakes. Just like the last play, everyone playing the OC, yet it was the players. Mac Jones losing his cool is a bad sign. The issues with the play clock are mostly him. He changes plays, reads D and snaps the ball late on a ton of plays. Nevermind his ability to to actually read the D and make the right decision hasn't been good. He looks like a 2nd year QB who didn't even start 2 years in college. He’s in that QB room, he has a say clearly in what they are doing. He bitches about short passes, they open it up next game. Results are even worse. Funny how people don't remember how they bitched about McDaniels every game. Watching the Raiders was comical, that McDaniels offense is crap. You know it's almost like even veteran players need time to adjust lol. I'm not going to lie, there's a lot of truth in here. But, that doesn't mean MP had a good game. You have an opposing defensive coordinator publicly laughing at your offensive coordinator (and you only really won that game because Murray went down and they were a bad team to begin with). Former players, current players, national guys and even Zolak are bashing MP and speaking how it was not a good hire. Whose fault is it that they had 3 tries at the half yard marker and they threw the ball 3 times? They got a touchdown, but Bill didn't like the look and it gets pulled back as a result. Mac might have gotten it on the 4th try, but false start. Why do they have players so clueless about situational football that they think that laterals are a great idea in a tie game? A lot of this is Bill, but wasting timeouts, wasting game clock, calling predictable plays, players saying they're clueless as to what the defenses are doing. A lot of that is on MP. Mac had an atrocious game. MP sucks, but if Mac keeps playing like that he'll be out of the league real quick. It's not MP's fault he couldn't hit a wide open Jonnu. It's amazing that the Patriots were even less than a minute away from winning this game. As far as McDaniels is concerned, I'm guilty of this myself; however, this is like, "Remember how you were complaining your computer couldn't handle a game properly? Well, we got rid of it and got you a book instead. Enjoy". All of an sudden Josh McDaniels feels like the greatest OC to ever walk the Earth. I don't think MP had a good game, I also don't think he's basically the only issue either. Any OC was going to look bad for this team this year, it's more GMs fault than anything. Everyone looks at Mac last year versus this year, yet you can't do what you did last year. The OL is horrible, even last game Trent Brown was making Chandler Jones look like he was prime age again. His quickness is gone, he's a swing OT for me going forward. No blocking TEs, no fullback, no ultra quick slot WR. I mean they had to put Marcus Jones at WR trying to get a spark. Ask Stevenson, it wasn't called he did it on his own. If it called and looks like that I'll blame MP. Players do stupid crap. One of Brady's greatest strengths was holding all players to a crazy high bar, making sure they knew play and did the right thing. QB is leader of offense, is Mac Jones acting that way? Not overly surprising either, amplified by the crap OL. Yet he started to struggle to end last year the more responsibilities he got. His rawness in certain areas shows. Why Zappe looked so impressive, much more college experience with a bunch of OC. |
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Dec 19, 2022 19:21:15 GMT -5
Maybe I’d be willing to debate Patricia’s merit if he actually went one week without not getting a play in on time but since he can’t even do that then I don’t know what the point is. That’s like the most basic ask. Call a play. Doesn’t even have to be a good one at this point- hell we know it probably won’t be a good one!- but at least get it in on time so the team can get set, know what they’re doing, and can get the play off I was willing to give him the benefit of the doubt because I didn’t mind him as DC (although I liked Flores more) but it’s readily apparent his hiring as OC has been a mistake, and something he’s wildly unfit to do. And judge needs to go back to ST, and they need to fire Achord How in the world watching games live can you see when the play is coming in? I see Mac Jones struggling to do what Brady did effortlessly for two decades, then rushing to snap the ball right before the clock runs out. There's a huge difference, ones on Mac as a learning young QB, ones on the coach. |
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cdj
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Post by cdj on Dec 19, 2022 19:22:55 GMT -5
Maybe I’d be willing to debate Patricia’s merit if he actually went one week without not getting a play in on time but since he can’t even do that then I don’t know what the point is. That’s like the most basic ask. Call a play. Doesn’t even have to be a good one at this point- hell we know it probably won’t be a good one!- but at least get it in on time so the team can get set, know what they’re doing, and can get the play off I was willing to give him the benefit of the doubt because I didn’t mind him as DC (although I liked Flores more) but it’s readily apparent his hiring as OC has been a mistake, and something he’s wildly unfit to do. And judge needs to go back to ST, and they need to fire Achord How in the world watching games live can you see when the play is coming in? I see Mac Jones struggling to do what Brady did effortlessly for two decades, then rushing to snap the ball right before the clock runs out. There's a huge difference, ones on Mac as a learning young QB, ones on the coach. They’re calling it out on the broadcast and it’s obvious that’s what’s happening, that’s how! When Mac was throwing a tantrum that’s what it was about Do you think Patricia is good at his job- yes or no? Don’t need a long explanation. If you think yes we’re not going to find any common ground and that’s fine. I think Mac does need to shoulder some blame- he was objectively very bad yesterday. But let’s not pretend like we’ve put him in a position to find success either. Even bringing in Gase would be better than this. |
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Post by soxfansince67 on Dec 19, 2022 21:43:20 GMT -5
Just a thought - when I started following the Patriots, around 1968 (when I was 12), they were awful - laughing stock material. They had some ups and downs until the dynastic range of 2001-2019 - then...we have this year. 2022. So - it took 54 years, but it's come full circle!
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Post by GyIantosca on Dec 20, 2022 10:41:43 GMT -5
I read that Mayo is def leaving because 2 years in a row Bb didn’t name a defensive coordinator. This is all because of his sons. I wonder what Kraft is gonna do. If you think about it ever since Bb had to have his sons coach everything is going downhill with the coaches. No D coordinator. No O coordinator title. What a mess. All in the lap of Bb.
What does Kraft do? Bert Breer
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Post by costpet on Dec 20, 2022 11:23:33 GMT -5
What about next year? Just a thought. The Pats have a lot of cap space for 2023. How about they offer Brady $25 million on a one year deal. The problem with the Bucs is that they have no defense. Anything Brady does good is negated by a terrible defense. The Pats have a decent defense. That might appeal to him. Then talk Gronk into coming back for one last time. Mac sits for a year learning from Brady and they change the offense to suit Brady, with Mac learning the same system. They bring back O'Brien to handle the OC and let MP handle the defense. That would work, if possible. Pipedream.
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Post by redsoxfan2 on Dec 20, 2022 13:28:03 GMT -5
I'm rooting for either they clean house on the offensive operation meaning Bill no longer GMs, new OC, replace Mac Jones, revamp the OL or roll it all back out there and double down by hiring either Josh McDaniels or Billy O'brien to replace Jerod Mayo.
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Post by bigmarty58 on Dec 20, 2022 14:05:08 GMT -5
In 2023 I would like to see the following:
Hire an experienced Offensive Coordinator
Hire an experienced Quarterback Coach
Promote Jerod Mayo to Defensive Coordinator
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Post by GyIantosca on Dec 20, 2022 15:31:00 GMT -5
In 2023 I would like to see the following: Hire an experienced Offensive Coordinator Hire an experienced Quarterback Coach Promote Jerod Mayo to Defensive Coordinator I'm all for that but Big But coach is the highest paid in the laegue over 25 million a year. I almost feel he doesnt mind if he gets pushed out he can have any job he wants in the league. |
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cdj
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Post by cdj on Dec 20, 2022 21:43:32 GMT -5
I’d take a look at Tae Crowder, Giants waived him. Hasn’t been good in a new system this year but he can motor around, would add speed to the LB group
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cdj
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Post by cdj on Dec 20, 2022 21:50:36 GMT -5
Just saw this but Terez Hall is back healthy and on the practice squad
Had been cut this summer w/ a failed physical. Thought he looked good in 2020 when he saw the field. Def hit hard
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Dec 21, 2022 2:03:27 GMT -5
How in the world watching games live can you see when the play is coming in? I see Mac Jones struggling to do what Brady did effortlessly for two decades, then rushing to snap the ball right before the clock runs out. There's a huge difference, ones on Mac as a learning young QB, ones on the coach. They’re calling it out on the broadcast and it’s obvious that’s what’s happening, that’s how! When Mac was throwing a tantrum that’s what it was about Do you think Patricia is good at his job- yes or no? Don’t need a long explanation. If you think yes we’re not going to find any common ground and that’s fine. I think Mac does need to shoulder some blame- he was objectively very bad yesterday. But let’s not pretend like we’ve put him in a position to find success either. Even bringing in Gase would be better than this. There calling what out? That MP isn't getting the plays in quickly? You hear that every game? We must be watching different games. They call out the issues getting the plays off. You see the reason last game, it's Mac Jones doing his thing at the line. Yeah it's obvious, you just blame everything on MP. Not surprising, you blamed McDaniels for every bad thing and now act like he's a God. Yet look at that Raiders offense I seriously have no clue, I've seen good and bad. Yet the OL is so bad no OC is overcoming that. He's not the GM. So many people act like this is last years team and all the issues is just MP, that's just not true. Yeah if you have a young QB that isn't mobile, having a good OL is crazy important with putting him in a position to find success. Last year good OL and a great running game were a huge part of his success. Honest question look at the end of last year, minus that Jaguars game because they were just dreadful. Was he good with that OL and running attack? More interceptions than TDs. Those two horrible offensive coaches everyone blames for everything looked brilliant with Zappe. That being said I have no issues moving on because I can't take the non stop crap. It started well before even camp and hasn't stopped. It's Trump level at this point. I can't even bear to think about hearing this crap for another offseason. |
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Dec 21, 2022 2:13:32 GMT -5
I read that Mayo is def leaving because 2 years in a row Bb didn’t name a defensive coordinator. This is all because of his sons. I wonder what Kraft is gonna do. If you think about it ever since Bb had to have his sons coach everything is going downhill with the coaches. No D coordinator. No O coordinator title. What a mess. All in the lap of Bb. What does Kraft do? Bert Breer Bill has not named coordinators jobs going on forever. His son is DC and I have zero issues with that. It's actually nice knowing he's not possibly leaving. |
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cdj
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Post by cdj on Dec 21, 2022 8:44:57 GMT -5
They’re calling it out on the broadcast and it’s obvious that’s what’s happening, that’s how! When Mac was throwing a tantrum that’s what it was about Do you think Patricia is good at his job- yes or no? Don’t need a long explanation. If you think yes we’re not going to find any common ground and that’s fine. I think Mac does need to shoulder some blame- he was objectively very bad yesterday. But let’s not pretend like we’ve put him in a position to find success either. Even bringing in Gase would be better than this. There calling what out? That MP isn't getting the plays in quickly? You hear that every game? We must be watching different games. They call out the issues getting the plays off. You see the reason last game, it's Mac Jones doing his thing at the line. Yeah it's obvious, you just blame everything on MP. Not surprising, you blamed McDaniels for every bad thing and now act like he's a God. Yet look at that Raiders offense I seriously have no clue, I've seen good and bad. Yet the OL is so bad no OC is overcoming that. He's not the GM. So many people act like this is last years team and all the issues is just MP, that's just not true. Yeah if you have a young QB that isn't mobile, having a good OL is crazy important with putting him in a position to find success. Last year good OL and a great running game were a huge part of his success. Honest question look at the end of last year, minus that Jaguars game because they were just dreadful. Was he good with that OL and running attack? More interceptions than TDs. Those two horrible offensive coaches everyone blames for everything looked brilliant with Zappe. That being said I have no issues moving on because I can't take the non stop crap. It started well before even camp and hasn't stopped. It's Trump level at this point. I can't even bear to think about hearing this crap for another offseason. Oh you mean the offensive line that he’s responsible for because he’s their coach? Your evidence that he’s not a bad coach is the performance of the group that he coaches I would kill to go back to 3rd and 6 Brandon Bolden draws under Josh. I ADMIT- I was silly last year. It could have been MUCH worse given what I’ve seen this year. Foolish me for thinking Bill would hire somebody that knows what they’re doing. Josh at least works with QB’s and knows how to develop them And lol yeah they looked great against the 2 worst defenses in football, congrats for hanging 29 on the lion lol. What an offensive juggernaut Matt Patricia is terrible at his job and you’ve got to be the only one in the world who thinks anything other than that. He’s taking attacks from everybody- fans, players, analysts. It’s because it’s obvious. You’re fine with cronyism and nepotism even when it produces crap results. Most people are not Btw the raiders offense is a hell of a lot better than the pats! Hilarious that you’re criticizing Josh but not Matt. Downright insane really. There is not a single thing they do worse than us. They run the ball better. They throw the ball better. They score more points. Their issue isn’t offense. It’s defense. |
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cdj
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Post by cdj on Dec 21, 2022 12:52:18 GMT -5
I just remembered the 3rd and 11 naked boot w Mac 😂😂😂😂
The team is downright hilarious at times
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Dec 21, 2022 14:39:36 GMT -5
There calling what out? That MP isn't getting the plays in quickly? You hear that every game? We must be watching different games. They call out the issues getting the plays off. You see the reason last game, it's Mac Jones doing his thing at the line. Yeah it's obvious, you just blame everything on MP. Not surprising, you blamed McDaniels for every bad thing and now act like he's a God. Yet look at that Raiders offense I seriously have no clue, I've seen good and bad. Yet the OL is so bad no OC is overcoming that. He's not the GM. So many people act like this is last years team and all the issues is just MP, that's just not true. Yeah if you have a young QB that isn't mobile, having a good OL is crazy important with putting him in a position to find success. Last year good OL and a great running game were a huge part of his success. Honest question look at the end of last year, minus that Jaguars game because they were just dreadful. Was he good with that OL and running attack? More interceptions than TDs. Those two horrible offensive coaches everyone blames for everything looked brilliant with Zappe. That being said I have no issues moving on because I can't take the non stop crap. It started well before even camp and hasn't stopped. It's Trump level at this point. I can't even bear to think about hearing this crap for another offseason. Oh you mean the offensive line that he’s responsible for because he’s their coach? Your evidence that he’s not a bad coach is the performance of the group that he coaches I would kill to go back to 3rd and 6 Brandon Bolden draws under Josh. I ADMIT- I was silly last year. It could have been MUCH worse given what I’ve seen this year. Foolish me for thinking Bill would hire somebody that knows what they’re doing. Josh at least works with QB’s and knows how to develop them And lol yeah they looked great against the 2 worst defenses in football, congrats for hanging 29 on the lion lol. What an offensive juggernaut Matt Patricia is terrible at his job and you’ve got to be the only one in the world who thinks anything other than that. He’s taking attacks from everybody- fans, players, analysts. It’s because it’s obvious. You’re fine with cronyism and nepotism even when it produces crap results. Most people are not Btw the raiders offense is a hell of a lot better than the pats! Hilarious that you’re criticizing Josh but not Matt. Downright insane really. There is not a single thing they do worse than us. They run the ball better. They throw the ball better. They score more points. Their issue isn’t offense. It’s defense. Which is it he's OL coach or OC? Oh wait he's not the OC then? Did he resign Trent Brown and draft a rookie OG in the first from a small school? You really believe he decided to move Wynn before he even watched him play? Failure of the GM. Browns are 20th rated D, better than Raiders. Yet it's not even about points, it's how Zappe progressed within the offense from preseason and during those games. The way he commands the offense. If you don't think Zappe as a 4th round pick looked impressive that's a you problem. It's not always about results in my book. MP has been attacked since before any football was even played. I'm not even saying he’s good or great or anything like that. I'm just pushing back on the fact no one is talking about the other issues and he gets 100% of the blame. The Raiders have a veteran QB, top 5 WR, top RB and a darn good group of other weapons, Carr has a sack percentage almost half of what Mac Jones does. That should be one of the best offenses in football. Yeah I'll criticize it, first because everyone thinks Josh McDaniels is now a God. Second because that's what it looks like when it's not talent, just stupid mistakes after stupid mistakes. So what about Mac Jones to end last year? What about the first Bills game, they could literally win games without him passing and didn't even trust him to pass. You overlook Zappe because of the D, yet Mac Jones looking good last year was basically just that. Taking advantage of crappy teams. QBs take time, Mac Jones limited experience in College is showing and frankly it's almost like he needed this. I actually think this is good for him. It's either exposed his weaknesses or exposed he's not as good as we thought. That depends on what he does going forward. Yet the signs were there to end last year when they started taking the training wheels off. MP threw the kitchen sink at him and Mac Jones has struggled. Yet no way I wanted to keep babying him either. |
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