nomar
Veteran
Posts: 10,787
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Post by nomar on Jan 25, 2023 13:38:18 GMT -5
Even if he gets traded and a portion of his salary is offloaded, it’s hard to see the Red Sox having room for Chafin as I’ve seen theorized. After Strahm, 2/16 is the probable floor for him.
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Post by juanpena on Jan 25, 2023 14:00:20 GMT -5
People have brought up Ort so, so many times as someone to DFA, but it seems obvious they need a guy or two with options they can keep in AAA as depth when the inevitable injuries hit, right? Am I missing something there? This is a bad argument. It’s good to have guys with options who can go up and down. You can certainly think that while believing a particular pitcher doesn’t deserve one of those spots. Some people could believe that Kelly, Mills and German are better and Ort is expendable. I haven’t seen enough of those three to make that judgment but it doesn’t mean arguing against Ort is an argument against a flexible roster.
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Post by seamus on Jan 25, 2023 14:32:46 GMT -5
People have brought up Ort so, so many times as someone to DFA, but it seems obvious they need a guy or two with options they can keep in AAA as depth when the inevitable injuries hit, right? Am I missing something there? This is a bad argument. It’s good to have guys with options who can go up and down. You can certainly think that while believing a particular pitcher doesn’t deserve one of those spots. Some people could believe that Kelly, Mills and German are better and Ort is expendable. I haven’t seen enough of those three to make that judgment but it doesn’t mean arguing against Ort is an argument against a flexible roster. I think Incandenza is just wondering why Ort's value in an up-and-down role has been so universally disregarded that opting to DFA someone like Barnes is so unthinkable. I do think Ort is the most likely candidate for a countermove at this point, and probably would have even before Barnes, but it's still worth pausing to think about why the organization hasn't pulled that trigger yet. Maybe it's just a sequencing thing and he'll be gone before opening day to make room for another acquisition, but it's also possible that the Sox don't actually think he's quite as expendable as the board does. One thing I appreciate about the Barnes move is that it shows this front office is willing to accept that a situation didn't pan out and move on. Maybe there was a better way to do it - given that teams are probably keenly aware that Barnes is a sticky stuff guy, I doubt he has much of a trade market beyond what minor amount of cash considerations and/or PTBNL they might be able to get through this process - but I really like that the team doesn't feel compelled to trot out a guy just because a financial commitment has been made, even if it means they'll take some lumps through both financial costs and media criticism.
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Post by soxfan06 on Jan 25, 2023 15:40:18 GMT -5
I for one am confused at the number of people questioning this move.
I think getting Barnes off this roster was 100% a no brainer.
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Post by grandsalami on Jan 25, 2023 16:14:49 GMT -5
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Post by DesignatedForAssignment on Jan 25, 2023 18:23:17 GMT -5
Barnes would be smart to accept a deal where he accepts assignment and then rejoins the roster on Feb 13 ... to replace Story.
3 weeks
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Post by pedey on Jan 25, 2023 21:53:04 GMT -5
I'm fine with this move. Barnes hasn't earned a 2023 roster spot.
It's the other moves that confuse me. They commit over 50 million to relievers past the age of 35 (Martin, Jansen). They trade Josh Taylor, who had a solid 2022 season and good peripherals (11.9 K/9, 4.3 BB/9, 0.4 HR/9) for a infielder whose career OBP is .280. NOW they decide to dump Barnes.
But they couldn't spare one roster spot for Thad Ward. Hopefully this really won't come back and bite them.
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cdj
Veteran
Posts: 13,976
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Post by cdj on Jan 25, 2023 22:11:44 GMT -5
Josh Taylor had a good 2021 season
He then got hurt and looked like garbage in the minors in his comeback attempt in 2022
Both teams are assuming risk in the deal. But on the Sox side their risk is that they gave up a solid reliever. The royals risk is that they gave up a starting MI. I can tell you which side I’d rather be on.
I had Barnes in the same tier as Taylor. If they came into camp and looked good then great they can be on the roster. They weren’t locks in my eyes (though I am surprised Barnes didn’t get any rope this spring given his contract)
Ppl are focusing too much on the age of 1 inning relievers too imo. It’s not hard to see why they’re on the roster- they’re 2 of our top 3 relievers now! Major upgrade on what we had!
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Post by wingman478 on Jan 25, 2023 23:03:38 GMT -5
Josh Taylor had a good 2021 season He then got hurt and looked like garbage in the minors in his comeback attempt in 2022 Both teams are assuming risk in the deal. But on the Sox side their risk is that they gave up a solid reliever. The royals risk is that they gave up a starting MI. I can tell you which side I’d rather be on. I had Barnes in the same tier as Taylor. If they came into camp and looked good then great they can be on the roster. They weren’t locks in my eyes (though I am surprised Barnes didn’t get any rope this spring given his contract) Ppl are focusing too much on the age of 1 inning relievers too imo. It’s not hard to see why they’re on the roster- they’re 2 of our top 3 relievers now! Major upgrade on what we had! Only one year of control for Mondesi. That one year includes him missing the first 2-3 weeks of the season rehabbing. I'm guessing that's the timeline. Maybe more (hopefully not). If Mondesi doesn't comeback and become a elite short stop defensively that he was before, then I don't view the trade as a win. The trade is probably a wash and non factor if neither contributes much, but having a healthy Mondesi who plays elite level defense would have been fun. He would have easily be the best defensive player on the team, at short stop.
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Post by blizzards39 on Jan 25, 2023 23:19:59 GMT -5
Josh Taylor had a good 2021 season He then got hurt and looked like garbage in the minors in his comeback attempt in 2022 Both teams are assuming risk in the deal. But on the Sox side their risk is that they gave up a solid reliever. The royals risk is that they gave up a starting MI. I can tell you which side I’d rather be on. I had Barnes in the same tier as Taylor. If they came into camp and looked good then great they can be on the roster. They weren’t locks in my eyes (though I am surprised Barnes didn’t get any rope this spring given his contract) Ppl are focusing too much on the age of 1 inning relievers too imo. It’s not hard to see why they’re on the roster- they’re 2 of our top 3 relievers now! Major upgrade on what we had! Only one year of control for Mondesi. That one year includes him missing the first 2-3 weeks of the season rehabbing. I'm guessing that's the timeline. Maybe more (hopefully not). If Mondesi doesn't comeback and become a elite short stop defensively that he was before, then I don't view the trade as a win. The trade is probably a wash and non factor if neither contributes much, but having a healthy Mondesi who plays elite level defense would have been fun. He would have easily be the best defensive player on the team, at short stop. I’d be very surprised if Mondesi is still not elite level defensively. I’m much more worried about how much time he will be healthy.
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Post by jmei on Jan 26, 2023 6:01:27 GMT -5
There are other threads to discuss those other specific transactions or the front office’s performance, let’s keep this one focused on Barnes.
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Post by Soxfansince1971 on Jan 30, 2023 0:06:41 GMT -5
One thing the Barnes DFA does is that it allows more innings to go to bullpen members that are younger, and more likely to be around a lot longer.
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Post by vermontsox1 on Jan 30, 2023 14:10:01 GMT -5
Barnes is being traded to the Marlins, per Rosenthal.
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Post by thegoodthebadthesox on Jan 30, 2023 14:11:52 GMT -5
Barnes is being traded to the Marlins, per Rosenthal. 4 PTBNL's outstanding!! The stove is hot!!
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Post by vermontsox1 on Jan 30, 2023 14:12:29 GMT -5
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Post by thegoodthebadthesox on Jan 30, 2023 14:12:52 GMT -5
Barnes is being traded to the Marlins, per Rosenthal. 4 PTBNL's outstanding!! The stove is hot!! Never mind!!
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Post by bloomstaxonomy on Jan 30, 2023 14:14:16 GMT -5
Great trade. Wonder how much $$ is going to the Marlins. But Bleier is on a $3 mil contract for this year + a 2024 team option.
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Post by thegoodthebadthesox on Jan 30, 2023 14:14:43 GMT -5
Lefty, high GB% and low BB%, projects to be better than Barnes this year, seems like a solid deal
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Post by chr31ter on Jan 30, 2023 14:17:59 GMT -5
Huh.
Another reliever who basically doesn't walk anybody.
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Post by Foulke_In_Athol on Jan 30, 2023 14:21:10 GMT -5
This is a really nice trade, fills a need while jettisoning (not sure that's a word) dead weight
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Post by jmei on Jan 30, 2023 14:21:51 GMT -5
Even if there's money going to the Marlins (which I would expect), the Red Sox got a player who is better than Barnes (per most of the projections), fits the roster better and has a cheap team option ($3.75M) for next year, which is a nice get.
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Post by scottysmalls on Jan 30, 2023 14:22:10 GMT -5
Like Bleier as much as any of the remaining FA lefties save maybe Chafin and he’s on a better deal than any of the comparable ones are likely to get. Even if the Red Sox are paying all of both contracts I like it.
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Post by briam on Jan 30, 2023 14:23:38 GMT -5
Love the Red Sox bullpen construction for this year. Seems like Bloom learned his lesson and is taking action, all you can ask for.
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Post by chr31ter on Jan 30, 2023 14:23:55 GMT -5
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Post by ematz1423 on Jan 30, 2023 14:24:13 GMT -5
I like the sounds of it, jettisoned Barnes and Taylor and got back Mondesi and a lefty in Bleier to replace Taylor. As others have said I wonder how much the Sox are paying of Barnes deal, wouldn't surprise me if it's exactly whatever the difference in contract is between Barnes and Bleier which looks around 6M if I'm looking at it correctly.
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