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ematz1423
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Post by ematz1423 on Jul 12, 2024 17:48:13 GMT -5
No more SS's please. We have a million of them. Sign me up for 1 million and 1 if they think it's the BPA. The reason you take all the SS you can is because they're generally good athletes and if need be can move to other impactful positions. |
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Post by costpet on Jul 13, 2024 6:25:09 GMT -5
I understand that, but most SS’s are speed guys with little power. The power guys play the corner positions 3b,1b, Lf, Rf. Plus in this draft we need to concentrate on pitching.
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Post by rjp313jr on Jul 13, 2024 6:44:04 GMT -5
I understand that, but most SS’s are speed guys with little power. The power guys play the corner positions 3b,1b, Lf, Rf. Plus in this draft we need to concentrate on pitching. These guys are so many years away that concentration on specific positions seems like madness and a recipe for having a bad system. After the first few rounds, maybe you put a greater emphasis on pitching or if you have a group of players you equally like and ones a pitcher then you err on the side of pitching, but I’m always a fan of just taking best player available in a baseball draft. |
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Post by greatscottcooper on Jul 13, 2024 6:46:23 GMT -5
BPA all day. Give me 20 short stops if that’s the BPA
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Post by greatscottcooper on Jul 13, 2024 6:49:40 GMT -5
When a team drafts a short stop they might also be drafting:
A third baseman
A second baseman
A centerfielder
A right fielder.
You literally don’t have to go further back than last years draft to find players drafted as “short stops” playing all these other positions.
End the stigma!!! Embrace the SS pick!
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Post by crossedsabres8 on Jul 13, 2024 6:51:43 GMT -5
I understand that, but most SS’s are speed guys with little power. The power guys play the corner positions 3b,1b, Lf, Rf. Plus in this draft we need to concentrate on pitching. This was probably more true like two decades ago than it is now. |
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jimoh
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Post by jimoh on Jul 13, 2024 7:05:46 GMT -5
I understand that, but most SS’s are speed guys with little power. The power guys play the corner positions 3b,1b, Lf, Rf. Plus in this draft we need to concentrate on pitching. Guys drafted or signed as shortstops: Gary Sheffield, Alex Rodriguez, Mike Schmidt, Hanley Ramirez, Paul Molitor, Robin Yount, Reggie Smith, Jim Thome, Mookie Betts, Chipper Jones, Manny Machado, Matt Williams, Mike Moustakas, Justin Upton, Adam Jones, Alex Bregman, Brady House, DJ LeMahieu, Ernie Banks, Rico Petrocelli, Dustin Pedroia, Nomar, John Valentin, Yaz. Hank Aaron and Harmon Hillebrew started at 2b. The best right-handed athletes play SS in high school and often in college. |
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jimoh
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Post by jimoh on Jul 13, 2024 7:21:22 GMT -5
High school kids from Mississippi have a brutal track record. Anyone care about this with regard to Griffin? I can’t imagine the level of competition is worse than, say, New Jersey where Mike Trout is from, just as one random anecdotal example. Also, a guy like Braden Montgomery is from Mississippi. Would he not have developed in the minors? Just feels like random noise to me. Academically, "the highest ranked Mississippi school is Ocean Springs High School, which earned a No. 682 national ranking. Ocean Springs High School is the only Mississippi school in 2024 to break 1,000 on the rankings list. The next highest school, Lewisburg High School in Olive Branch, ranked 1,464." |
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Post by 6fanin67 on Jul 13, 2024 7:27:10 GMT -5
Looooong time lurker here finally dipping a toe in the water. A question I keep having, and there's probably a simple answer I'm missing, is regarding the concept of BAP. Outside of the first few picks in the draft, isn't the BAP basically a unicorn? And if there's really no way you can truly identify the BAP, isn't a team better off factoring organizational need and depth into the equation? I mean it took until the fifth round for the overall BAP to be selected in the 2011 draft. It seems that a team thinking that they're thin on middle infielders so let's take this kid from Tennessee sometime before the 172nd pick would have been a pretty good draft strategy.
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redsox04071318champs
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Always hoping to make my handle even longer...
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Post by redsox04071318champs on Jul 13, 2024 8:09:17 GMT -5
I understand that, but most SS’s are speed guys with little power. The power guys play the corner positions 3b,1b, Lf, Rf. Plus in this draft we need to concentrate on pitching. Nah, most guys are SS when drafted. They're the best players on their high school or college teams and that's where they tend to play, SS, even if it becomes quickly obvious that's where they're not going to stay as they go up the minor league levels. Two quick examples comes to mind. Remember Michael Chavis? I believe he was drafted as a SS and by the time he got to the majors he was anything but a SS. Chipper Jones was drafted as a SS, but never really played SS in the majors as he was quickly shifted to 3b. You have the image of some lightweight guy with a good glove that cant hit his way out of a paper bag, but that's not what the Sox are targeting. They're going after guys who are the best on their teams and can play SS and hopefully stay there, but if not they move to other positions. Remember hulking OF-DH Gary Sheffield? He started off as a SS, even stayed at SS upon arriving to the majors, but nfamously didnt stay there long before being shifted to 3b and eventually RF. |
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Post by threeifbaerga on Jul 13, 2024 8:19:53 GMT -5
I understand that, but most SS’s are speed guys with little power. The power guys play the corner positions 3b,1b, Lf, Rf. Plus in this draft we need to concentrate on pitching. Nah, most guys are SS when drafted. They're the best players on their high school or college teams and that's where they tend to play, SS, even if it becomes quickly obvious that's where they're not going to stay as they go up the minor league levels. Two quick examples comes to mind. Remember Michael Chavis? I believe he was drafted as a SS and by the time he got to the majors he was anything but a SS. Chipper Jones was drafted as a SS, but never really played SS in the majors as he was quickly shifted to 3b. You have the image of some lightweight guy with a good glove that cant hit his way out of a paper bag, but that's not what the Sox are targeting. They're going after guys who are the best on their teams and can play SS and hopefully stay there, but if not they move to other positions. Remember hulking OF-DH Gary Sheffield? He started off as a SS, even stayed at SS upon arriving to the majors, but nfamously didnt stay there long before being shifted to 3b and eventually RF. On top of this - the guys who make the bigs as light hitting SS are the ones that stay athletic enough to stick at SS but maybe don't get strong enough to be big power guys. |
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Post by thegoodthebadthesox on Jul 13, 2024 9:11:43 GMT -5
For those who aren’t regular listeners, the D1 Baseball draft preview podcast is pretty good. The regular D1 guys I can take or leave as draft specific analysts, but Chris Burke brings some great data and good insights as a guest.
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Post by RedSoxStats on Jul 13, 2024 12:15:11 GMT -5
The big movers on the final BA 500
+141, 152 Nate Knowles
+99, 85 Austin Overn
+84, 201 Fenwick Trimble
+84, 203 Smith Bailey
+60, 202 Ryan Stafford
+36, 266 Jaxon Walker
+34, 212 Brandon Neely
+25, 281 Dominic Fritton
+20, 208 Nick McLain
+19, 224 Hunter Hines
+16, 257 Cooper Williams
-20, 262 Pierce Coppola
-70, 309 Davis Diaz
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Post by julyanmorley on Jul 13, 2024 12:37:50 GMT -5
The big movers on the final BA 500 +141, 152 Nate Knowles His coach is the father of a Red Sox scout |
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Post by ogshortstufff on Jul 13, 2024 12:42:01 GMT -5
Is 12 too early to take an upside swing on Brecht or one of the high school pitchers? Aside from Yesavage (who I would gladly take), it feels like most of the guys that could be available are high floor, low ceiling corner outfield types.
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Post by incandenza on Jul 13, 2024 13:21:26 GMT -5
The big movers on the final BA 500 +141, 152 Nate Knowles +99, 85 Austin Overn +84, 201 Fenwick Trimble +84, 203 Smith Bailey +60, 202 Ryan Stafford +36, 266 Jaxon Walker +34, 212 Brandon Neely +25, 281 Dominic Fritton +20, 208 Nick McLain +19, 224 Hunter Hines +16, 257 Cooper Williams -20, 262 Pierce Coppola -70, 309 Davis Diaz Fenwick Trimble would be a phenomenal pick; everyone else on that list is pretty underwhelming. I guess I could live with Dominic Fritton.
*again, my sole criterion is coolness of name
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Post by johnsilver52 on Jul 13, 2024 13:33:05 GMT -5
Is 12 too early to take an upside swing on Brecht or one of the high school pitchers? Aside from Yesavage (who I would gladly take), it feels like most of the guys that could be available are high floor, low ceiling corner outfield types. I was wondering the same thing too, especially if he'd sign for under slot. Something like ~$4.5M and then they'd have an extra million for the rest of the draft. Would please me to no end to go away from yet again picking another middle IF type 1st. Brecht, as high as mid 1st is probably not happening. Throws 100mph or not. just 2 pitches, command issues and not much control. Doubt even a team with solid history of developing pitching will be looking at him before 20ish pick and later.. But not saying would'nt mind him over a couple other names have seen brandied about as possibles in mock drafts. |
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Post by bishop on Jul 13, 2024 13:48:55 GMT -5
Unless someone can think of a reason this would be the case, no.I can’t imagine the level of competition is worse than, say, New Jersey where Mike Trout is from, just as one random anecdotal example. Also, a guy like Braden Montgomery is from Mississippi. Would he not have developed in the minors? Just feels like random noise to me. Academically, "the highest ranked Mississippi school is Ocean Springs High School, which earned a No. 682 national ranking. Ocean Springs High School is the only Mississippi school in 2024 to break 1,000 on the rankings list. The next highest school, Lewisburg High School in Olive Branch, ranked 1,464." Do you think Alabama or Oklahoma high schools are appreciably better than Mississippi ones? Those Gunnar Henderson and Jackson Holliday picks are looking pretty good... not saying Griffin is on their level as a prospect but the sample for Mississippi HS's is so small it's irrelevant in my mind. Literally 5 guys picked since 1993, none higher than 17th overall. If the choice is Griffin or Moore I'd definitely prefer Griffin unless his ask is outrageous, if it's Griffin or Yesavage I'd be really happy with either. |
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Post by cba82 on Jul 13, 2024 13:56:46 GMT -5
“Literally 5 guys picked since 1993, none higher than 17th overall.” — This seems a remarkable statistic.
But then I looked it up, and Mississippi is ranked #35 in terms of population; how does it compare in terms of draft picks over that time period with, say, New Mexico, ranked #36? Or all the New England states combined?
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Post by julyanmorley on Jul 13, 2024 14:55:05 GMT -5
That would give them some extra money to work that 2nd-4th round magic they've had the last couple of years. People seem to be saying that the pool of high schoolers you could give an extra million to in this range is unusually shallow |
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Post by thegoodthebadthesox on Jul 13, 2024 15:31:37 GMT -5
The big movers on the final BA 500 +141, 152 Nate Knowles +99, 85 Austin Overn +84, 201 Fenwick Trimble +84, 203 Smith Bailey +60, 202 Ryan Stafford +36, 266 Jaxon Walker +34, 212 Brandon Neely +25, 281 Dominic Fritton +20, 208 Nick McLain +19, 224 Hunter Hines +16, 257 Cooper Williams -20, 262 Pierce Coppola -70, 309 Davis Diaz Overn is good, I am a big believer in mining suboptimal developmental contexts and USC basically didn’t have a facility last year, take that for what you will. |
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Post by 0ap0 on Jul 13, 2024 15:35:24 GMT -5
The big movers on the final BA 500 +141, 152 Nate Knowles +99, 85 Austin Overn +84, 201 Fenwick Trimble +84, 203 Smith Bailey +60, 202 Ryan Stafford +36, 266 Jaxon Walker +34, 212 Brandon Neely +25, 281 Dominic Fritton +20, 208 Nick McLain +19, 224 Hunter Hines +16, 257 Cooper Williams -20, 262 Pierce Coppola -70, 309 Davis Diaz Fenwick Trimble would be a phenomenal pick; everyone else on that list is pretty underwhelming. I guess I could live with Dominic Fritton.
*again, my sole criterion is coolness of name
I'd be higher on Jaxon Walker if he'd consider adding a half dozen silent letters to his name. |
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cdj
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Post by cdj on Jul 13, 2024 15:36:18 GMT -5
Smith Bailey is definitely a high socks kinda guy
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Post by Don Caballero on Jul 13, 2024 16:27:02 GMT -5
My friends, what are the odds Griffin falls? I’ve seen some stuff and I’m a believer in that dude!
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Post by julyanmorley on Jul 13, 2024 16:34:18 GMT -5
I have consulted the entrails - 38%
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