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Post by redsoxfan2 on May 31, 2024 18:37:51 GMT -5
LeBron is a legitimate billionaire, if playing with his son were important to him, he’d play for the vet minimum no problem. It’d be extra bonus if it were a loaded team like the Celtics where he may be able to win enough chips to pass Jordan. Now, I agree he’s not walking thru that door, but it’s not because of money. My whole point was he's not signing with any team just because you draft his son and he's not signing anywhere for veteran minimum. Sure he can, he's not doing it. I'm not so sure honestly. If him taking the minimal is the difference between his son being on an NBA roster and being in the G League is the money going to be worth it for Lebron?
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Post by umassgrad2005 on May 31, 2024 21:15:01 GMT -5
My whole point was he's not signing with any team just because you draft his son and he's not signing anywhere for veteran minimum. Sure he can, he's not doing it. I'm not so sure honestly. If him taking the minimal is the difference between his son being on an NBA roster and being in the G League is the money going to be worth it for Lebron? What? Yeah because the difference in pay isn't close to equal, LeBron can just give him some money. Do you really think he's not spending most of the year in the G-League no matter what happens? The worst thing for his career would be sitting on a bench versus playing a ton of games in the G-League. I'm so confused.
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Post by rjp313jr on Jun 1, 2024 5:38:48 GMT -5
I'm not so sure honestly. If him taking the minimal is the difference between his son being on an NBA roster and being in the G League is the money going to be worth it for Lebron? What? Yeah because the difference in pay isn't close to equal, LeBron can just give him some money. Do you really think he's not spending most of the year in the G-League no matter what happens? The worst thing for his career would be sitting on a bench versus playing a ton of games in the G-League. I'm so confused. LeBron originally said the last year of his career would be spent with his son. That’s at least a couple years away regardless. LeBron has since backed off those statements and said it’s not a priority. This could be true or it could be a way to make sure only the team he wants to draft him drafts him. This could go hand in hand with why Bronny will only work out for the Lakers and Suns.
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Post by redsoxfan2 on Jun 1, 2024 9:35:07 GMT -5
I'm not so sure honestly. If him taking the minimal is the difference between his son being on an NBA roster and being in the G League is the money going to be worth it for Lebron? What? Yeah because the difference in pay isn't close to equal, LeBron can just give him some money. Do you really think he's not spending most of the year in the G-League no matter what happens? The worst thing for his career would be sitting on a bench versus playing a ton of games in the G-League. I'm so confused. The point is circling around LeBron's original comments and the fact that he's only likely being drafted because of LeBron. This probably means he's likely not going to be good enough to be in the NBA. At the very least as long as his father is there he'll get to be on an NBA roster with the hope he can guide and help develop his son. My understanding of Bronny James (could be entirely wrong) - Borderline NBA ready defensively, but under sized. - Solid passer - Can't create his own shot and averages about 3 points per game. - Decent vertical - Heart problems Based on that there's a good chance that without his father he never plays in the NBA. So, would LeBron sacrifice money to have the opportunity to play with his son and give him a chance in a league he likely might never get into without his father? Never mind the fact that I'm sure they'd do a bunch of commercials together which would also help him out financially. Yeah, I know it's pie in the sky fantasy, but there were real comments made by LeBron and his kid isn't good enough and may never be good enough to make a roster without his dad so it's fascinating what LeBron will do.
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Jun 1, 2024 11:26:47 GMT -5
What? Yeah because the difference in pay isn't close to equal, LeBron can just give him some money. Do you really think he's not spending most of the year in the G-League no matter what happens? The worst thing for his career would be sitting on a bench versus playing a ton of games in the G-League. I'm so confused. LeBron originally said the last year of his career would be spent with his son. That’s at least a couple years away regardless. LeBron has since backed off those statements and said it’s not a priority. This could be true or it could be a way to make sure only the team he wants to draft him drafts him. This could go hand in hand with why Bronny will only work out for the Lakers and Suns. So you changed your mind? We should draft Bronny at 30 so we get LeBron?
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Jun 1, 2024 12:03:18 GMT -5
Broony James mini scouting report. 17th prospect in his class, McDonald's all American.
6'1.5" 6'7.25" wingspan 210 ten pounds 32'and 40.5" vertical
Comp Avery Bradley, George Hill and Marcus Smart
Combine 3 point shooting 19/25, making last 12 straight. Side/mid/side 3 point shooting 17/22. He shot 76.6% from 3 at Combine 3 point shooting drills. Which match his high school reports that he's a better shooter than his father.
Onto the tape, very athletic player that can make highlight defensive plays, you absolutely see why the comps are 3 really good defensive players. He's crazy advanced on D for a true freshman. High basketball IQ. He absolutely can create his own shot and get others involved.
At Combine he showed vision and skills to develop into a PG
He has a 100% clean bill of health per USC and at the NBA combine.
His mistake was going to USC to play with the #1 recruit Jason Collier who's also a PG/combo guard, then missing time because of his medical event.
So he's a legit NBA prospect, heck if he went back to USC with no Collier and had a good year he could be a 1st round pick. Which is what he should have done, especially considering the money he was making in College.
In this draft class I'd say he's mid to late 2nd round to undrafted. He shouldn't have declared, but he does have NBA upside. He's not a non NBA prospect, I personally like him more as a prospect for the Celtics than JD Davison who we took a few years ago in 2nd round, mainly because of his D and shooting. That 210 pounds as a freshman, with wingspan and athletic ability raises his bar on D. Get him upto 220 and you won't be able to pick on him. Davison was 195, Pritchard is 195, Smart was 220, big reason he was switchable. He already weighs more than Holiday and White.
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Post by rjp313jr on Jun 1, 2024 13:41:28 GMT -5
LeBron originally said the last year of his career would be spent with his son. That’s at least a couple years away regardless. LeBron has since backed off those statements and said it’s not a priority. This could be true or it could be a way to make sure only the team he wants to draft him drafts him. This could go hand in hand with why Bronny will only work out for the Lakers and Suns. So you changed your mind? We should draft Bronny at 30 so we get LeBron? I don’t understand how this means I changed my mind. No this team should not draft him at 30. I mean if they had a back door guarantee from LeBron that he’d opt out and join them on the vet minimum then yes. I’m not even sure they should use the 30th pick with their cap situation. If they win this Title and decide to re-up White they are going to be a repeat second apron team for years. Which means they can’t trade picks 7 years out from each year they are over and are locked into the end of the first round even if they were a lottery team.
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Jun 3, 2024 20:26:40 GMT -5
I don't understand why it was posted to a reply to Redsoxfan2 who wants us to draft Broony James so we get LeBron and doubled down on it saying LeBron could take minimum to help his son. If that's not your intention okay, but I know everything about it.
The funny thing is I basically wrote off Bronny James. One thing this did was force me to dig deeper and watch more tape. I actually think he should be a target with our 2nd round pick. Not because of LeBron, but because he has the makings of a 3 and D guard and he'll be ready right when Holiday is getting near the end of his career.
If the right player is available at pick 30 we basically have to take him. This draft is crazy, people have guys going in lottery, who others don't have in the first round. So it's crazy hard to judge who will be available. This team needs depth bad and not many ways to add it besides the draft.
I don't see an issue trading picks, the core of this team is set for years.
First round picks don't do that unitl you go 3 out of 5 years over 2nd level on luxury tax, starting next year. Not that it really matters, they should be back of the 1st round to begin with.
While it would be great to hit HRs in the draft, what Stevens has to do is at minimum hit some singles and doubles. If not this team could look like most of LeBron's teams rather quickly.
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cdj
Veteran
Posts: 15,590
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Post by cdj on Jun 3, 2024 21:03:19 GMT -5
I think Bronny has the tools to be a very good role player in the league. People mock him for his numbers but he had the heart episode and they understandably eased him back slowly
He actually kind of reminds me of Andre Jackson a bit. He’s a little shorter but I could see him being a similar kind of player. Just has to develop his shot (not unlike Jackson did/does). I’d draft and develop as a PG
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Post by rjp313jr on Jun 4, 2024 5:31:47 GMT -5
Sources told ESPN Holmes recently canceled several workouts, raising strong suspicions that he has secured a guarantee in the back part of the first round.
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Jun 4, 2024 13:29:49 GMT -5
Looking at who the Celtics have worked out, the guys ranked to be drafted Scheirman, Ingram, Jones, Mogbo and Trentyn Flowers. The first four are upperclassmen with different close to ready skill sets. Flowers is a young combo guard who played in NBL, the Australian league. Started out at PG, moved to SG, wasn't ready. Now I'll admit it's rather hard judging young players in foreign leagues. That being said he's got a ton of upside and shows you flashes of being able to do everything. Given Stevens loves young upside guys, add him to the list. Great size, elite athlete, already good weight for either guard spot, heck it's not bad at SF, nice looking shot, drives to rim, passes, high engery player. 6'6.5" 201.4 pounds 6'8.25" wingspan, 34.5 and 42 in vertical, 19 years old.
I might have a new top pick for #30.
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Post by GyIantosca on Jun 5, 2024 16:24:29 GMT -5
Friendly reminder that Brad Stevens has never selected in the first round. I think this year is good money to maintain that trend. I was actually surprised we have a pick to draft. I love there eye for talent. Timelord fell to us at I think 26.
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Post by rjp313jr on Jun 5, 2024 19:08:27 GMT -5
Friendly reminder that Brad Stevens has never selected in the first round. I think this year is good money to maintain that trend. I was actually surprised we have a pick to draft. I love there eye for talent. Timelord fell to us at I think 26. Despite all the trades the only year we don’t have a first round pick is 2029… 2028 we will either have ours or the Spurs, but he’s done a great job of making these deals while still keeping the stock pile of first round picks.
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Jun 5, 2024 21:27:55 GMT -5
It's basically the last thing for GM Stevens to prove, his drafting abilities.
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Jun 7, 2024 12:00:55 GMT -5
Devin Carter promise in the Lottery. Holmes promise came from Denver per reports.
People mentioned Robert Williams, who fell for numerous reasons. Remember the missed press conference and all the worries about it? This year's guy is Kel'el Ware, top ten talent in this draft. Major questions about playing hard, work ethic and all that crap. I've seen experts say they wouldn't take him in the first even though he's top ten talent wise, though they think someone will. So he's a player to watch.
I was warming up to a scorer/shooter like Baylor Scheierman SG at 30. That last game just reinforced my idea that he should only focus on two way players. As good as he could be on offense, he'll never be a great or likely even good defender in a switch everything D.
So I've fried my Brain looking at almost everyone that is likely to be drafted. This draft has depth, less now that some players pulled out and the international guys can still pull out. Still it's not horrible, it's just a ton of young freshman and young international players, risky upside guys. The top of the draft is horrible and the best players could come from anywhere. In a normal year a bunch of these young players go back to school, they didn't in this one because the quality was so bad. So you have a ton of raw boom or bust type players. The right team that can judge talent could get rather lucky if they are willing to develop them.
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cdj
Veteran
Posts: 15,590
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Post by cdj on Jun 7, 2024 17:19:34 GMT -5
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Post by rjp313jr on Jun 7, 2024 17:31:25 GMT -5
Devin Carter promise in the Lottery. Holmes promise came from Denver per reports. People mentioned Robert Williams, who fell for numerous reasons. Remember the missed press conference and all the worries about it? This year's guy is Kel'el Ware, top ten talent in this draft. Major questions about playing hard, work ethic and all that crap. I've seen experts say they wouldn't take him in the first even though he's top ten talent wise, though they think someone will. So he's a player to watch. I was warming up to a scorer/shooter like Baylor Scheierman SG at 30. That last game just reinforced my idea that he should only focus on two way players. As good as he could be on offense, he'll never be a great or likely even good defender in a switch everything D. So I've fried my Brain looking at almost everyone that is likely to be drafted. This draft has depth, less now that some players pulled out and the international guys can still pull out. Still it's not horrible, it's just a ton of young freshman and young international players, risky upside guys. The top of the draft is horrible and the best players could come from anywhere. In a normal year a bunch of these young players go back to school, they didn't in this one because the quality was so bad. So you have a ton of raw boom or bust type players. The right team that can judge talent could get rather lucky if they are willing to develop them. I’m still down with a guy like Scheierman. Hauser has turned into a useful defender but I’d love it if Ware fell.
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Jun 8, 2024 10:50:41 GMT -5
Hauser really isn't a useful defender though. If he played big minutes he would be attacked in the playoffs non stop. I think Scheierman is a much better player, he does more than just shoot 3s and has quick feet. He's just 100% the anti Stevens type draft pick and has been rising up draft boards lately. I'm trying to adjust because draft after draft I look at older more readying prospects and Stevens goes after young, raw, athletic upside players. Why I'm looking at a guy like Flowers, fits Stevens draft pattern 100%. Nevermind they brought him in for a workout, yet same with Scheierman.
I've crossed Shannon off my board, I see no reason to deal with that.
CBS just put out a mock with Ware being picked by us at 30. I usually hate players with his question marks. I would make an exception for Ware because he's exactly what we need. Horford is getting old and Porzingis is a huge injury risk 24/7.
Just my next big is Adem Bona and he's like a more raw version of Robert Williams.
I really want to love Oso Ighodaro, I just can't get over freshman Tatum out rebounding senior Oso. Nevermind he shows zero shooting and his post moves are a hook shot and a one handed running shot. He's basically a PF that can play D, dribble and do dunks. Which frankly would be okay if he was a high level rebounder, he's not. Another thing that really bugs me is he can't use his dribbling and athletic ability to attack the basket, he stops to do his bad post moves. Maybe I'm being too harsh and good coaching can develop him. It's just a high bar for a guy who doesn't take any jump shots at all.
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Post by rjp313jr on Jun 8, 2024 12:02:42 GMT -5
Hauser really isn't a useful defender though. If he played big minutes he would be attacked in the playoffs non stop. I think Scheierman is a much better player, he does more than just shoot 3s and has quick feet. He's just 100% the anti Stevens type draft pick and has been rising up draft boards lately. I'm trying to adjust because draft after draft I look at older more readying prospects and Stevens goes after young, raw, athletic upside players. Why I'm looking at a guy like Flowers, fits Stevens draft pattern 100%. Nevermind they brought him in for a workout, yet same with Scheierman. I've crossed Shannon off my board, I see no reason to deal with that. CBS just put out a mock with Ware being picked by us at 30. I usually hate players with his question marks. I would make an exception for Ware because he's exactly what we need. Horford is getting old and Porzingis is a huge injury risk 24/7. Just my next big is Adem Bona and he's like a more raw version of Robert Williams. I really want to love Oso Ighodaro, I just can't get over freshman Tatum out rebounding senior Oso. Nevermind he shows zero shooting and his post moves are a hook shot and a one handed running shot. He's basically a PF that can play D, dribble and do dunks. Which frankly would be okay if he was a high level rebounder, he's not. Another thing that really bugs me is he can't use his dribbling and athletic ability to attack the basket, he stops to do his bad post moves. Maybe I'm being too harsh and good coaching can develop him. It's just a high bar for a guy who doesn't take any jump shots at all. I’m not ready to declare Stevens draft patterns yet. Especially, now with the new CBA and their salary situations. We also haven’t seen him make a first round pick yet. They may feel they already have their Hauser replacement with Drew Peterson. And I agree Hauser isn’t a great defender and playing him huge minutes would create an obstacle, but what are we looking for here? He’s a role player. Drafting and of first and in the second, it’s not easy to find 2 way well rounded players. Even a guy like White took 6 years to turn into a 2 way guy like he is now and he was an older draft pick. The team we have this year and next with the depth and great 2 way players who can all shoot is going to be hard to sustain.
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Jun 8, 2024 14:30:20 GMT -5
That might be very well true, like I said I've been burned in three different drafts. You can't deny that up to this point, Stevens has a prospect type he likes. Maybe that changes, maybe it doesn't. Bringing in Flowers at minimum shows he's still looking at those types.
A year ago I really loved Colby Jones and Trayce Jackson-Davis, older two way guys. Andre Jackson Jr., so they were there, he passed to focus on upside. I'll make two lists this year, guys I would target and guys that fit Stevens known drafting pattern.
That's the million dollar question, what is Stevens looking for? Best player available, best two way player, best defender, best offensive player or highest upside player?
Derrick White was a good two player his rookie year, he was starting on a playoff team year two, top defensive box score on the team. Then they went into rebuilding. That's exactly why I would target older players, by year 3 or 4 he was a high level two way player. Flowers by year 3/4 is likely like Brown in his early years. Nice bench piece, but still years away from his prime.
Players I'd target but unlikely they slide in this draft Tristan Da Silva, Kel'el Ware, Jaylon Tyson and DaRon Holmes. Maybe you get lucky, it happens. A player that might be there Kevin McCullar Jr., he's kinda similar to White as a glue guy. Willing to look past D, Scheierman, look past offense Oso Ighodaro.
Want young swing for the fences Carlton Carrington, Isaiah Collier and Yves Missi if they drop. Bobi Klintman, Pacome Dadiet, Justin Edwards, Trentyn Flowers, Cameron Christie, AJ Johnson, Adem Bona and Ulrich Chomche.
One of the more interesting prospects I watched tape on Dillon Jones from Weber State, who the Celtics brought in for a visit. I'm just not sure what you do with him, but very unique game and frankly even his size at 6'4.5" 236.8 pounds and 6'11" wingspan. Only 2nd player in last 25 years to score over 20 points, 9 rebounds and 5 assists in a season. He plays a role like Tatum of Point forward, gets a bunch of steals, very good FT shooter, but 3 point shot isn't fully there yet. Creates shots off iso, would have to learn to play off the ball and it's Webber State. Didn't have a good combine playing off the ball, he's used to always having it.
I'll also mention a guy a bunch of people don't have being draft in N'Faly Dante 6'10" 260.2 pounds 7'6" wingspan. In the late 2nd if you wanted a big who rebounds, block shots, gets steals, but is very raw on offense Dante could be a nice back of the bench type big.
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Post by benogliviesbrother on Jun 8, 2024 15:57:18 GMT -5
Hauser really isn't a useful defender though. If he played big minutes he would be attacked in the playoffs non stop. I think Scheierman is a much better player, he does more than just shoot 3s and has quick feet. He's just 100% the anti Stevens type draft pick and has been rising up draft boards lately. I'm trying to adjust because draft after draft I look at older more readying prospects and Stevens goes after young, raw, athletic upside players. Why I'm looking at a guy like Flowers, fits Stevens draft pattern 100%. Nevermind they brought him in for a workout, yet same with Scheierman. I've crossed Shannon off my board, I see no reason to deal with that. CBS just put out a mock with Ware being picked by us at 30. I usually hate players with his question marks. I would make an exception for Ware because he's exactly what we need. Horford is getting old and Porzingis is a huge injury risk 24/7. Just my next big is Adem Bona and he's like a more raw version of Robert Williams. I really want to love Oso Ighodaro, I just can't get over freshman Tatum out rebounding senior Oso. Nevermind he shows zero shooting and his post moves are a hook shot and a one handed running shot. He's basically a PF that can play D, dribble and do dunks. Which frankly would be okay if he was a high level rebounder, he's not. Another thing that really bugs me is he can't use his dribbling and athletic ability to attack the basket, he stops to do his bad post moves. Maybe I'm being too harsh and good coaching can develop him. It's just a high bar for a guy who doesn't take any jump shots at all. I’m not ready to declare Stevens draft patterns yet. Especially, now with the new CBA and their salary situations. We also haven’t seen him make a first round pick yet. They may feel they already have their Hauser replacement with Drew Peterson. And I agree Hauser isn’t a great defender and playing him huge minutes would create an obstacle, but what are we looking for here? He’s a role player. Drafting and of first and in the second, it’s not easy to find 2 way well rounded players. Even a guy like White took 6 years to turn into a 2 way guy like he is now and he was an older draft pick. The team we have this year and next with the depth and great 2 way players who can all shoot is going to be hard to sustain. Svi, who has improved his playability quite a lot to my eye, would like a word.
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Jun 9, 2024 11:21:46 GMT -5
I give Hauser some crap, but he's also one of Stevens best moves. He just had more win shares in one year than Svi has had in his 7 year career. I don't mind guys like Svi on the back of the bench for a team like this, but playoff rotation is a high bar. It likely matters because they might not be willing to play Hauser given the crazy luxury tax we are about to step into.
It's one of the reasons why I feel rookies are important, cheapest contracts, especially in 2nd round. We are about to make the crazy Warriors tax payments look like nothing.
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Post by rjp313jr on Jun 9, 2024 14:34:44 GMT -5
I give Hauser some crap, but he's also one of Stevens best moves. He just had more win shares in one year than Svi has had in his 7 year career. I don't mind guys like Svi on the back of the bench for a team like this, but playoff rotation is a high bar. It likely matters because they might not be willing to play Hauser given the crazy luxury tax we are about to step into. It's one of the reasons why I feel rookies are important, cheapest contracts, especially in 2nd round. We are about to make the crazy Warriors tax payments look like nothing. If they win the title this year, I think it’s possible ownership ponies up and pays White too. I agree with the rookies being important but it’s also why they may not want the guaranteed first round contracts.
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Jun 10, 2024 0:00:09 GMT -5
I give Hauser some crap, but he's also one of Stevens best moves. He just had more win shares in one year than Svi has had in his 7 year career. I don't mind guys like Svi on the back of the bench for a team like this, but playoff rotation is a high bar. It likely matters because they might not be willing to play Hauser given the crazy luxury tax we are about to step into. It's one of the reasons why I feel rookies are important, cheapest contracts, especially in 2nd round. We are about to make the crazy Warriors tax payments look like nothing. If they win the title this year, I think it’s possible ownership ponies up and pays White too. I agree with the rookies being important but it’s also why they may not want the guaranteed first round contracts. If they don't pay White, I don't understand anything! It's guys like Hauser who likely pay the price of the crazy luxury tax, even if he's not a break the bank guy. First round pick #30 is like $2.5 million, right player is there it should be an easy decision. If not, trade back. I would likely try and use it on older players, younger ones trade back get the cheaper deal because they'll take years to develop. Way I look at it, pick 30 is cheapest way to replace Hauser and/or Horford long-term.
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Jun 10, 2024 14:20:31 GMT -5
bleacherreport.com/articles/10123676-2024-nba-mock-draft-full-2-round-predictions-and-pro-comparisonsIf this happens, outside of Holmes not going 28 to Denver, I'm using pick 30, looking at Scheierman, McCullar and Jones. For the record if Holmes does actually fall and reports are wrong, I take him all day long! 2nd pick while I'd personally want to take Trentyn Flowers all day long, I dont think I could pass up Oso Ighodaro based on long-term team needs. Roll the dice and see if you can develop him some more. Then I'd go all out after Trentyn Flowers.
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