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Post by oleary25 on Jul 10, 2024 12:39:22 GMT -5
First of all I wouldn’t trade Abreu for anything less than a controllable starting pitcher . At least 2 years of control preferably. I wouldn’t trade Hamilton. His speed is such a weapon in the postseason. The RedSox are a different team when he’s in the line up. Hypothetically in a perfect world I’d trade with Toronto for Gauseman 2 years of control and Justin Turner. Front line starting pitcher also with Turner experienced bat that thrives in Boston . He’d really lengthen the line up.
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Post by trotman on Jul 10, 2024 12:55:28 GMT -5
The Pirates on paper could be a potential trade partner as they need OF and hitting. Their fans and front office are freaking out over their cheap owner pushing to reduce payroll. Why not Mitch Keller as that longer term option to improve this season and beyond?
Old buddy Martin Perez is also out there and could eat the innings that are so desperately needed. Cheap rental
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Post by gk2186 on Jul 10, 2024 12:58:26 GMT -5
Pitt just paid Keller a few months ago....
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Post by bettsonmookie on Jul 10, 2024 13:09:43 GMT -5
Wilyer does seem the odd man out, but the upside of holding on for top dollar is there. He put up approx 2.3 WAR in his first ~280 AB’s. If he duplicates that, he is looking like a 4 WAR player with a bargain contract.
If you can market him as such, the return will be far more impactful.
Roman is the youngest of the big 3 and there is no need to start his service clock prematurely. Let Wilyer establish himself and Roman add some polish. Reassess from there.
I think it’s a problem to be solved in the 2025 offseason. If they move on prior, I hope they don’t discount him.
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nomar
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Post by nomar on Jul 10, 2024 13:27:01 GMT -5
Wilyer is a good young player. Trading him because another prospect might be as good or better in a year or two seems foolish to me. Logjams find ways to not end up being logjams most of the time anyway. Unless someone is blowing you away for Abreu I don’t see why you’d deal him.
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Post by bloomstaxonomy on Jul 10, 2024 13:32:52 GMT -5
I looked at any SP with 1 or 2 years of control left on a team under .500. Here are my preferences at the deadline, ranked in order of...uhh...preference.
Eovaldi (purely for vibes and leadership alone, never mind his good stats and peripherals) Heaney (I tend to like players the Sox were keen on in the past; they obviously liked him in the 22-23 offseason) Flaherty (can't argue with the results; has great control but I'm a little scared his HRs could go bonkers in Fenway) Kikuchi (it's an old-fashioned sentiment, but it would be nice to add a lefty to the rotation and he is still fairly effective) Gray (1.5 years left and only 32, there might be another level Bailey could unlock, though you could say the same for anyone)
Not interested in any other players in the aforementioned bucket. If I expanded my list by adding SPs with 1 or 2 years of control on teams hovering around .500, I'd add guys like Eflin and Manaea, both of which I'd actually put pretty high up on the list.
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briam
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Post by briam on Jul 10, 2024 13:55:39 GMT -5
Wilyer is a good young player. Trading him because another prospect might be as good or better in a year or two seems foolish to me. Logjams find ways to not end up being logjams most of the time anyway. Unless someone is blowing you away for Abreu I don’t see why you’d deal him. You have to trade talent to get talent though, and trading a young roughly 3 WAR outfielder when you have a top 20 national prospect in AA seems to be a potential good move.
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nomar
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Post by nomar on Jul 10, 2024 13:58:39 GMT -5
Wilyer is a good young player. Trading him because another prospect might be as good or better in a year or two seems foolish to me. Logjams find ways to not end up being logjams most of the time anyway. Unless someone is blowing you away for Abreu I don’t see why you’d deal him. You have to trade talent to get talent though, and trading a young roughly 3 WAR outfielder when you have a top 20 national prospect in AA seems to be a potential good move. Sure if you’re getting a 3 WAR SP or MIF with an equal amount of control, but I wouldn’t settle for a lesser player.
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Post by bettsonmookie on Jul 10, 2024 14:18:44 GMT -5
Fedde thru 5 shutout vs Minnesota. ERA sub-3 on the season. He won’t be cheap.
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Post by wanderingdude on Jul 10, 2024 14:26:38 GMT -5
I saw a couple of Tweets today throwing around a couple trade ideas I thought would be interesting: Scenario 1: Randy Arozarena Eric Fedde Scenario 2: Jameson Taillon Seiya Suzuki I’m more for scenario two. Taillon is AL East tested and has a good track record of giving you quality innings as #4/5 SP. Suzuki would give you a solid RH OF bat that you can also slot into DH. Both are signed til the end of 2026 and obviously there is the Breslow connection with the Cubs. Scenario one seems a little unrealistic. I don’t think Tampa will trade Randy within the division and even if they would, they’d ask a much steeper prospect price. Eric Fedde does seem reasonable and low risk, but I worry about him performing in a market like Boston. I saw the Randy thing floated and i don’t understand it at all. I think the tweet was based around a wilyer package, and considering this year Wilyer has been a better hitter, fielder, and base runner, with better expected stats, i would really not like to do that. Randy hits right handed so that’s cool and maybe him hitting in fenway and back in a playoff race would unlock what he was before, but based solely on what they have done on the field he’d be our like 5th best outfielder.
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Post by dirtywaterinla on Jul 10, 2024 14:56:34 GMT -5
I saw a couple of Tweets today throwing around a couple trade ideas I thought would be interesting: Scenario 1: Randy Arozarena Eric Fedde Scenario 2: Jameson Taillon Seiya Suzuki I’m more for scenario two. Taillon is AL East tested and has a good track record of giving you quality innings as #4/5 SP. Suzuki would give you a solid RH OF bat that you can also slot into DH. Both are signed til the end of 2026 and obviously there is the Breslow connection with the Cubs. Scenario one seems a little unrealistic. I don’t think Tampa will trade Randy within the division and even if they would, they’d ask a much steeper prospect price. Eric Fedde does seem reasonable and low risk, but I worry about him performing in a market like Boston. I saw the Randy thing floated and i don’t understand it at all. I think the tweet was based around a wilyer package, and considering this year Wilyer has been a better hitter, fielder, and base runner, with better expected stats, i would really not like to do that. Randy hits right handed so that’s cool and maybe him hitting in fenway and back in a playoff race would unlock what he was before, but based solely on what they have done on the field he’d be our like 5th best outfielder. Agreed. I don’t think he’s worth the cost. Suzuki on the other hand does make more sense especially if he’s packaged with Tallion. You could platoon him w/ Yoshida @ DH and put him out in LF. It would also free up TON to sell high on him to a team like SEA or PIT who are in desperate need of a power RHH OF. As for Tallion, I’m surprised his name isn’t being mentioned more in proposals. Seems like a much more sure bet than Fedde and he’s signed for two more years.
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Post by ematz1423 on Jul 10, 2024 15:03:52 GMT -5
The only way I could see Suzuki making some sense would be if they shipped Yoshida out somewhere. Otherwise I don't see paying Yoshida/Suzuki nearly $40M between the two of them to mostly platoon at DH. Chances are they could probably just sign O'Neill for less years and AAV then what is left on Suzuki's contract.
I could see taking on some salary for a few extra years for a solid pitcher but I don't see it being that likely or helpful for a position player who pretty much just adds what they already have.
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Post by greenmonster on Jul 10, 2024 15:06:22 GMT -5
The more I think about the Hoerner idea the more I like it. My first thought is that the Sox need to get some pitching help....What better way to help the pitching than by adding a gold-glove defender to the infield? We can all remember far too many instances where shaky defense has required the pitchers to get 4 or 5 outs in an inning and throw dozens more pitches.... He is also a 26yo RH bat who is capable of stealing a base and putting pressure on the opponents defense.
I have no idea what the acquisition cost might be but the Sox have some lower level depth at middle infield that will likely be blocked by Mayer. If you could put together a package centered around Cespedes or Zantello that makes a lot of sense.
I think I Would still like to add an arm also
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Post by dirtywaterinla on Jul 10, 2024 15:11:24 GMT -5
The only way I could see Suzuki making some sense would be if they shipped Yoshida out somewhere. Otherwise I don't see paying Yoshida/Suzuki nearly $40M between the two of them to mostly platoon at DH. Chances are they could probably just sign O'Neill for less years and AAV then what is left on Suzuki's contract. I could see taking on some salary for a few extra years for a solid pitcher but I don't see it being that likely or helpful for a position player who pretty much just adds what they already have. Excellent point though I do think Suzuki does have slightly more to offer than Yoshida at the point. But yes, too costly to have both.
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Post by dirtywaterinla on Jul 10, 2024 15:12:36 GMT -5
The more I think about the Hoerner idea the more I like it. My first thought is that the Sox need to get some pitching help....What better way to help the pitching than by adding a gold-glove defender to the infield? We can all remember far too many instances where shaky defense has required the pitchers to get 4 or 5 outs in an inning and throw dozens more pitches.... He is also a 26yo RH bat who is capable of stealing a base and putting pressure on the opponents defense. I have no idea what the acquisition cost might be but the Sox have some lower level depth at middle infield that will likely be blocked by Mayer. If you could put together a package centered around Cespedes or Zantello that makes a lot of sense. I think I Would still like to add an arm also At this point, you need innings, so as much as a GG defender sounds nice, you still need someone who can give you an average of 6 innings/start for 12 more starts.
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Post by ematz1423 on Jul 10, 2024 15:15:19 GMT -5
The only way I could see Suzuki making some sense would be if they shipped Yoshida out somewhere. Otherwise I don't see paying Yoshida/Suzuki nearly $40M between the two of them to mostly platoon at DH. Chances are they could probably just sign O'Neill for less years and AAV then what is left on Suzuki's contract. I could see taking on some salary for a few extra years for a solid pitcher but I don't see it being that likely or helpful for a position player who pretty much just adds what they already have. Excellent point though I do think Suzuki does have slightly more to offer than Yoshida at the point. But yes, too costly to have both. Oh I agree if somehow they could pull of a series of trades that ultimately ended up with Suzuki on the Sox and Yoshida elsewhere while not having to pay much if any of Yoshida's deal I'd be all for it. Which is a roundabout way of saying yes I think Suzuki>Yoshida in terms of fit and probably ability at this point. Suzuki's defensive #s don't look outstanding but he seems at least playable in LF where clearly to the Sox Yoshida is not.
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Post by wanderingdude on Jul 10, 2024 15:16:43 GMT -5
Dick Monfort still owns the Rockies so who knows what their plan is at the deadline, but Brendan Rodger’s would be pretty interesting imo. He doesn’t really do anything great, but he’s not bad at anything and would be a decent upgrade at second. He’s under control through 2025 so if Story and Mayer take over next year he would be easy to move on from and still get you something back. Again, Monfort is still the owner so i have no idea if they would sell or what they would ask for in return, but he seems to be a pretty clean fit.
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Post by jclmontana on Jul 10, 2024 17:48:45 GMT -5
I really want the Sox to be buyers this year, to actually be relevant in August and beyond, but I think any buying for immediate help has to include a good to very good pitcher, which may be foolishly expensive. The starting rotation is already thin (too thin?), and is probably going to get significantly thinner.
Tanner Houck pitched 106 innings last year, and he's already up to 111 innings. Kutter Crawford pitched 129 innings in 2023 and is currently at 105 innings. These guys are going to need some time off during the season to manage innings, especially Houck. Before this year, Houck had noticeable trouble pitching effectively beyond the 3rd or 4th inning; he seems like a poor candidate for a huge innings increase while maintaining effectiveness.
Even if just Houck needs downtime to mange his workload, who fills his spot? Josh Winkowski, maybe? JW pitched only 84 innings last year, and is up to 39 this year. Cooper Criswell? He only pitched 33 innings last year and is already at 52 innings. They are already covering spot starts, so relying on them to cover TH or KC starts will start a chain reaction of need. Is anyone ready for the Bryan Mata, opener, experience? Or, how about starting Richard Fitts in a late season game of importance? The Sox could certainly patch together the rotation through heroic innings increases, gutsy performances by spot starters, and bullpen games, but what then? Getting to the playoffs with a gassed staff with no fallback options seems like a recipe for a quick and unsatisfying playoff exit. The Sox are already playing must-win games in July, and because of the fierce competition for playoff spots, it seems like they will have to play hard for the rest of the season. That sort of grind wears out pitching.
I am likely making too much issue of the innings jump for some of these guys, but replacing Houck's innings or dealing with a decline in his performance could be real issue in the second half, hence the idea that the Sox have to get a more than just adequate pitcher at the trade deadline to stay in the playoff picture. Just not sure the front office would (or should?) be up for paying the big price for a current year difference maker.
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Post by threeifbaerga on Jul 10, 2024 17:54:53 GMT -5
I miss the days when we had actual rumors before the trade deadline instead of just "will they/won't they" speculation.
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Post by philsbosoxfan on Jul 10, 2024 23:55:47 GMT -5
Any speculation on why Winc was used in relief tonight ?
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Post by blizzards39 on Jul 11, 2024 0:13:02 GMT -5
Any speculation on why Winc was used in relief tonight ? I believe AC made the statement a few days ago that Wink would now be used in relief. An obvious sign they do t trust him or see him as a starter. At least not this season.
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Post by philsbosoxfan on Jul 11, 2024 0:18:41 GMT -5
Any speculation on why Winc was used in relief tonight ? I believe AC made the statement a few days ago that Wink would now be used in relief. An obvious sign they do t trust him or see him as a starter. At least not this season. Then Criswell or trade for his rotation slot.
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Post by Underwater Johnson on Jul 11, 2024 0:18:52 GMT -5
The biggest place they could add to the lineup at the moment is at first base. They obviously have Casas theoretically coming back there which is bigger than any upgrade they could get via trade. However, they could grab a right handed 1st baseman/DH and send out Yoshida to another team could have some value both long and short term. Obviously Yoshida doesn't really fit long term due to handedness and Casas hasn't exactly been a picture of health throughout his career and his bat is very important to the lineup. They do have lots of other options though like DHing whoever the 4th outfielder for the day is or Valdez if they put Romy in the infield. So the line between getting someone who would be an upgrade but also not cost too much is probably very fine. Aim high. Aim Vladdy. I'd also love to see Tanner Scott and/or Chris Bassitt in red socks.
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Post by dirtywaterinla on Jul 11, 2024 1:47:10 GMT -5
This might be more of a pipe dream seeing the D-Backs have an outside shot for a wildcard spot, but man oh man would I love if Craig could pry Christian Walker away.
He’s precisely the RHH masher you need in this lineup and could split time btwn 1B & DH when Casas gets back (even though admittedly that might be borderline blasphemous seeing he’s one of the best defensive 1B in the MLB).
He’s also a free agent after this season, so he wouldn’t cost you an arm and a leg. Hmmmmmm….
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Post by dirtywaterinla on Jul 11, 2024 1:49:48 GMT -5
The biggest place they could add to the lineup at the moment is at first base. They obviously have Casas theoretically coming back there which is bigger than any upgrade they could get via trade. However, they could grab a right handed 1st baseman/DH and send out Yoshida to another team could have some value both long and short term. Obviously Yoshida doesn't really fit long term due to handedness and Casas hasn't exactly been a picture of health throughout his career and his bat is very important to the lineup. They do have lots of other options though like DHing whoever the 4th outfielder for the day is or Valdez if they put Romy in the infield. So the line between getting someone who would be an upgrade but also not cost too much is probably very fine. Aim high. Aim Vladdy. I'd also love to see Tanner Scott and/or Chris Bassitt in red socks. I really, really don’t see the point of trading for Vladdy when he’s a free agent in a year’s time. Marlins asking price for Scott is just gonna be too high and with Hendricks coming back, I just don’t see the fit. Bassist also scares me — his stuff isn’t that impressive. Much rather take my chances with Fedde or Taillon.
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