|
Post by incandenza on Sept 1, 2024 15:26:49 GMT -5
CORA: "Thats the way we drew it up" Never mind the inability to adjust to the situation; it wasn't a great plan to begin with. Criswell has been better against lefties than righties this season. And Hill, who is 73 years old and whose season had barely started and who had a 5+ ERA and xERA last season, was pitching for the second day in a row and third time in four days. And it meant, too, that they'd have to go deep into their lousy bullpen beyond Hill. How was Criswell not the better option than that whole mess - even before he came out and dominated for 4 innings?
|
|
ematz1423
Veteran
Posts: 6,478
Member is Online
|
Post by ematz1423 on Sept 1, 2024 15:38:16 GMT -5
It's almost impossible to over exaggerate how bad a move it was to pull Criswell at 4 innings in a game he didn't allow one base runner. Cora should properly be roasted for that. Just baffling decision making.
|
|
shagworthy
Veteran
My neckbeard game is on point.
Posts: 1,846
|
Post by shagworthy on Sept 1, 2024 15:39:39 GMT -5
CORA: "Thats the way we drew it up" Never mind the inability to adjust to the situation; it wasn't a great plan to begin with. Criswell has been better against lefties than righties this season. And Hill, who is 73 years old and whose season had barely started and who had a 5+ ERA and xERA last season, was pitching for the second day in a row and third time in four days. And it meant, too, that they'd have to go deep into their lousy bullpen beyond Hill. How was Criswell not the better option than that whole mess - even before he came out and dominated for 4 innings? Did that drawing also have the predicted 4-1 loss outcome? I'm neither a fan boy or hyper critical of Cora but he'd have been better off pulling a Belichek and not answering than tossing that out into existence. It's like he went to the Sam Kennedy school of public speaking.
|
|
|
Post by kingstephanos on Sept 1, 2024 15:40:59 GMT -5
Doc Rivers quote: "You've got to coach worrying about your entire team: whether that gets you a championship or whether that gets you fired. I think it allows you to coach free. You're coaching with freedom because you know you're doing what you think is right."
|
|
shagworthy
Veteran
My neckbeard game is on point.
Posts: 1,846
|
Post by shagworthy on Sept 1, 2024 15:43:42 GMT -5
Doc Rivers quote: "You've got to coach worrying about your entire team: whether that gets you a championship or whether that gets you fired. I think it allows you to coach free. You're coaching with freedom because you know you're doing what you think is right." I'm not comfortable with Doc Rivers, in my opinion one of the most overrated coaches in the history of the NBA this side of PJ Carlisimo, being a blueprint bearer for our decision making. He (Doc) is basically only good when given a perfect team, and less not we remember when the C's were going to re-tool he ran away from Boston as fast as he could rather than shepherd a young team.
|
|
TearsIn04
Veteran
Everybody knows Nelson de la Rosa, but who is Karim Garcia?
Posts: 2,966
|
Post by TearsIn04 on Sept 1, 2024 15:58:17 GMT -5
Criswell shouldn't be on this team, even as a 6th starter type, if the manager has so little confidence in him that he yanks him after four perfect innings and 52 pitches in favor of an elder gent who just joined the team after a layoff.
Cora loves to make moves that are pre-ordained before the game. He talks about making pitching changes based on the "pocket" of the order that is coming up. Hey AC, sometimes it's Ok to take it all in and make an adjustment.
Just about anything can be dangerous when taken an extreme. BB analytics are an example of that, as today's game showed.
|
|
asm18
Veteran
Posts: 2,597
|
Post by asm18 on Sept 1, 2024 15:58:59 GMT -5
Royals lose (4 back in loss column) Twins win (5 back in loss column)
Not being able to win series against the fearsome and immaculate Blue Jays and Tigers - oof.
Had been looking at our White Sox series (when KC/MIN also play each other) as the key weekend if they want to close the gap and make things mildly interesting. But at this rate that might only close the gap so much - and the way we’re playing we might not sweep even the worst team in modern history.
|
|
|
Post by Darwin's Curve on Sept 1, 2024 16:03:19 GMT -5
It's almost impossible to over exaggerate how bad a move it was to pull Criswell at 4 innings in a game he didn't allow one base runner. Cora should properly be roasted for that. Just baffling decision making. Cora's supposed to be the adult in the room here. The fact he's not even viewing his decision as blame-worthy is troubling. Can players "really love" playing for a guy that seems to be single-handedly killing their post-season chances - no matter how many meetings they get to skip?
|
|
TearsIn04
Veteran
Everybody knows Nelson de la Rosa, but who is Karim Garcia?
Posts: 2,966
|
Post by TearsIn04 on Sept 1, 2024 16:06:45 GMT -5
MFYs just lost a sloppy game to the Cards and the O's are up by five on the Rox, so at least we have that.
You just know the O's are looking at their schedule and seeing next week's series at Fenway as a big opportunity.😧
|
|
|
Post by rhswanzey on Sept 1, 2024 16:18:11 GMT -5
It's almost impossible to over exaggerate how bad a move it was to pull Criswell at 4 innings in a game he didn't allow one base runner. Cora should properly be roasted for that. Just baffling decision making. Remember Eovaldi getting pulled after 73 pitches thru 7 in Toronto so Tyler Danish could give up a granny in the 8th? At least that was in the first half in 2022, when the stakes are lower. Same reasoning- it was the game plan
|
|
ematz1423
Veteran
Posts: 6,478
Member is Online
|
Post by ematz1423 on Sept 1, 2024 16:23:17 GMT -5
This type of game makes me think the plan for Whitlock next year should be as a bullpen arm that comes in to games like today throws 2-3 IP and does it a couple times a week. It's hard to trust his body to withstand a starters workload.
|
|
|
Post by rhswanzey on Sept 1, 2024 16:25:12 GMT -5
"The big four" matters ONLY if they are as good in the majors as their promise. ONLY if they are healthy or stay healthy. ONLY if our pitching is effective and gives the team chances to win. So the "Big Three" are Bello, Houck and Crawford - can they take another step forward? Can they go a bit deeper? Who in the mess of arms in the pen are going to end up reliable? Martin and Jansen are not spring chickens. There is very little help coming from the minors. With so much mediocrity with the other teams, yet another bad trade deadline indicated lack of support or belief in this team - and here we are. You clearly know this, but what unfair expectations. They have to hit as all-star appearance type players or we’re in limbo in perpetuity. It’s so much harder to find two front half of the rotation starter types in the same offseason, than one each in two consecutive years.
|
|
|
Post by grandsalami on Sept 1, 2024 16:33:54 GMT -5
It may just be me , but i am getting 2008 (i think) ortiz wrist injury vibes from Devers. Feels like this injury will require surgery given much his swing utilizes that part of the body
|
|
|
Post by greenmonster on Sept 1, 2024 16:34:37 GMT -5
It's almost impossible to over exaggerate how bad a move it was to pull Criswell at 4 innings in a game he didn't allow one base runner. Cora should properly be roasted for that. Just baffling decision making. Remember Eovaldi getting pulled after 73 pitches thru 7 in Toronto so Tyler Danish could give up a granny in the 8th? At least that was in the first half in 2022, when the stakes are lower. Same reasoning- it was the game plan Game plan put together by a bunch of stat geeks with their noses in a spreadsheet. Most likely haven't played a game since Little League and were the last ones picked in their gym class.
|
|
ematz1423
Veteran
Posts: 6,478
Member is Online
|
Post by ematz1423 on Sept 1, 2024 16:35:46 GMT -5
It may just be me , but i am getting 2008 (i think) ortiz wrist injury vibes from Devers. Feels like this injury will require surgery given much his swing utilizes that part of the body Didn't devers hurt his shoulder pretty early in the year? It hasnt fully healed. My guess is that devers is going to get some sort of surgery this offseason if I had to guess. Hopefully one that'll have him back up and going within a few months.
|
|
|
Post by wildsox on Sept 1, 2024 16:38:00 GMT -5
Alex “I’m going to start managing games like we need to win, but actually won’t” Cora Extension in hand. What a joke a day later. Same feeling
|
|
|
Post by orion09 on Sept 1, 2024 16:40:50 GMT -5
I keep waiting for the finger pointers to settle on the Chris Sale trade and it never happens. That was like a seven win hit to the team right there. I mean, did kind of call it back at the time of the trade. No sense in dwelling on it though, hopefully Grissom is a productive player going forward. You seem to be saying he's both too expensive and irreplaceable. And as a team that isn't especially salary-constrained but really needs additional MI defense, "over"-spending on a SS with a high defensive floor is just fine by me. Not to mention he’s one of our only players with 4 WAR upside, and we need all the upside we can get. I think the only way the Sox make the playoffs this season is if they get 70th+ percentile performances from multiple players (which is possible!). That’s the main reason I didn’t like the Sale trade actually, because even though he’s always hurt, he still has a pretty high ceiling if things break right, which is what the Sox need this season. It’s hard to overstate how bad Grissom has been on defense. The defense seriously constrains his ceiling, which would seem to make it unlikely he turns in a 3+ WAR performance (which is, again, what the Sox need). Though I’ve warmed up to the trade a bit, since he hits so well and is so young. There’s always the possibility he’s able to eventually overcome poor early-career defense, a la Bogaerts.
|
|
|
Post by alexcorahomevideo on Sept 1, 2024 16:46:25 GMT -5
It may just be me , but i am getting 2008 (i think) ortiz wrist injury vibes from Devers. Feels like this injury will require surgery given much his swing utilizes that part of the body If this is the case then it’s up to the Redsox to shut him down. I get the Sox are “only” 4.5 games out but it’s not worth causing long term issues with your franchise player.
|
|
|
Post by wildsox on Sept 1, 2024 16:53:57 GMT -5
It may just be me , but i am getting 2008 (i think) ortiz wrist injury vibes from Devers. Feels like this injury will require surgery given much his swing utilizes that part of the body If this is the case then it’s up to the Redsox to shut him down. I get the Sox are “only” 4.5 games out but it’s not worth causing long term issues with your franchise player. Unfortunately Cora can only do what he’s pre-planned and how they draw it up. Making an adjustment and sitting him wasn’t in the plan
|
|
|
Post by grandsalami on Sept 1, 2024 16:56:17 GMT -5
If this is the case then it’s up to the Redsox to shut him down. I get the Sox are “only” 4.5 games out but it’s not worth causing long term issues with your franchise player. Unfortunately Cora can only do what he’s pre-planned and how they draw it up. Making an adjustment and sitting him wasn’t in the plan This is unfair to Cora. I am 99.9999% sure that any such decision to shut him down comes from Craig/doctors/ and ownership. And that would be the case for any professional sports team
|
|
|
Post by rhswanzey on Sept 1, 2024 17:43:39 GMT -5
It may just be me , but i am getting 2008 (i think) ortiz wrist injury vibes from Devers. Feels like this injury will require surgery given much his swing utilizes that part of the body Didn't devers hurt his shoulder pretty early in the year? It hasnt fully healed. My guess is that devers is going to get some sort of surgery this offseason if I had to guess. Hopefully one that'll have him back up and going within a few months. Merloni has mentioned several times that it’s both shoulders bothering him, and also that he doesn’t know that three days off is going to make this better. I don’t think this is based on public reporting; unsure if it’s observation of his swing, clubhouse buzz, or some of both. It’s definitely a concerning situation, even if it actually is only the left shoulder. He may have gotten a cortisone shot in April at the point that they determined the injury wouldn’t become worse and they could treat it as a pain management issue. Xander got lots of cortisone shots on his wrist, and otherwise wouldn’t have been able to post like he did. Quick google’ing suggests it’s safe to do up to three times annually on the same injury. I wonder if the most recent three days off was his third of the year. It would be a shame if this is what pushes him to DH, because metrics aside, I thought he showed meaningful improvement this year. Before the most recent layoff, throwing (again, front shoulder) seemed to be bothering him. The cleanest roster fit going forward, whether we’re looking at keeping Yoshida, overcrowded outfield, or all these lefty prospect bats arriving soon, is for Devers to continue to hold down third through Yoshida’s final three years. It would sting to eat Yoshida salary while continuing to jam up the DH spot (so no real benefit), and suddenly need a starting third baseman.
|
|
|
Post by soxfansince67 on Sept 1, 2024 19:08:15 GMT -5
Boston, Seattle, Detroit - 15, 11 and 7 % playoff chances
|
|
|
Post by redsoxfan2 on Sept 1, 2024 19:19:21 GMT -5
Unfortunately Cora can only do what he’s pre-planned and how they draw it up. Making an adjustment and sitting him wasn’t in the plan This is unfair to Cora. I am 99.9999% sure that any such decision to shut him down comes from Craig/doctors/ and ownership. And that would be the case for any professional sports team Why even have a manager then?
|
|
|
Post by grandsalami on Sept 1, 2024 19:25:23 GMT -5
This is unfair to Cora. I am 99.9999% sure that any such decision to shut him down comes from Craig/doctors/ and ownership. And that would be the case for any professional sports team Why even have a manager then? What are you talking about? A decision to shutdown a star player for the season that does not involve something like Tommy john is never the managers decision alone. You honestly think they do not consult with the doctors and their agent before any such decision is made?
|
|
|
Post by redsoxfan2 on Sept 1, 2024 19:30:47 GMT -5
Why even have a manager then? What are you talking about? A decision to shutdown a star player for the season that does not involve something like Tommy john is never the managers decision alone. You honestly think they do not consult with the doctors and their agent before any such decision is made? Oh my mistake. I started the conversation backwards and thought we were talking about sitting Criswell. I'm in agreement with you on this. Carry on.
|
|