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Post by raftsox on Dec 27, 2012 8:58:01 GMT -5
We could have just signed him next offseason. Granted, spending a year in Boston may make Hanrahan more fond of the place, but is that little bit of advantage worth the cost? I look at this trade as a way to get some value for a few players while (and this is the important part) freeing up 1 40 man spot this season and 2 next season. Again, while getting some value. DFA'ing players nets no value. I wouldn't be surprised to see another trade or two just like this in the near future. Send Saltalamacchia and Wilson along with Hill (?) for something of short-term value.
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Post by elguapo on Dec 27, 2012 9:23:49 GMT -5
Wilson has all his options remaining. I assume he's riding the shuttle until further notice. The Sox don't have many 40-man relievers with options, mainly Wilson & Carpenter (+ Tazawa & Bard & Aceves who ideally stick all or most of the year), which is why I was surprised they let Olmsted and Fields go.
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Post by raftsox on Dec 27, 2012 9:24:32 GMT -5
But this is a pitcher than Cherington and the FO thought highly enough of twelve months ago to trade a high-upside position player for (Lowrie) and now are going to give up on because of four appearances in April. It's a stretch to say that they're giving up on him after 4 appearances in April. I have no real knowledge of what the FO thinks or why they do this but here's a potential scenario that may have lead to this decision. They knew he had some mental issues prior to the trade, but interviewed him and were happy with his responses. After getting him in town and seeing how he performed they realized that while his interview was good, he "oversold" himself. It happens all the time in every business; even baseball, remember Austin Bailey and Bryan Peterson?
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Post by raftsox on Dec 27, 2012 9:25:19 GMT -5
Wilson has all his options remaining. I assume he's riding the shuttle until further notice. The Sox don't have many 40-man relievers with options, mainly Wilson & Carpenter (+ Tazawa & Bard & Aceves who ideally stick all or most of the year), which is why I was surprised they let Olmsted and Fields go. Wilson is redundant, that's why I put his name in there. It's just a hypothetical anyways.
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Post by elguapo on Dec 27, 2012 9:36:55 GMT -5
Wilson is redundant, that's why I put his name in there. It's just a hypothetical anyways. I take your point, just disagree about Wilson being redundant, for the reasons stated above. Semantics, maybe.
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Post by The Town Sports Cards on Dec 27, 2012 9:51:44 GMT -5
Based on this trade how does everybody see the remaining bullpen roles fall into place? A trade is definitely possible at the break as has been noted but is one imminent this offseason? Also, what is the impact on the rotation? Does Aceves or Morales have first shot on sliding into the rotation due to injury, ineffectiveness or need based on schedule or would that be Webster or Rubby? I think that as of today the rotation is; Buchholz Lester Lackey Doubront Dempster On the 40 Man in the Minors; Webster De la Rosa Wright Britton Bullpen; Morales Miller Breslow Aceves Mortenson Uehara Bailey Hanrahan On the 40 Man in the Minors; Bard - ( because he has options ) Tazawa - ( because he has options ) Wilson Carpenter If no more moves are made I think the rotation is set with Aceves & Morales both available to spot start. Bard & Tazawa both start in the minors because they are the only ones with options. Things could shake out differently during Spring Training due to competition & health. But if no other moves are made that's what it looks like to me at this time. It means an 8 man Bullpen & a 3 man bench so I would think that somehow there is more to come + the roster is at 40 again & the team still needs to add a 1B - be it Napoli or someone else. That's 8 guys in the bullpen, the Sox will only carry 7 (for 12 total pitchers and 4 hitter on the bench). If there's no trades seems like Mortensen would be DFA'd.
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Post by soxcentral on Dec 27, 2012 10:04:19 GMT -5
Didn't realize Tazawa still had an option year remaining, kind of a shame as he could end up being the best reliever we have.
So assuming he does go to AAA and we carry 7 relievers, I could live with these general roles:
Hanrahan - 9th Bailey - 8th Uehara - 7th Miller/Breslow - LH matchups/alternate 7th/8th options Aceves/Morales - multiple inning relievers
Bard/Tazawa - AAA depth
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Post by James Dunne on Dec 27, 2012 10:22:45 GMT -5
I'd be really disappointed if Tazawa is left off the roster in lieu of Aceves and/or Mortensen. There's a fine line between an organization managing its options and letting the minor league options manage the roster. Tazawa was fantastic last year, both statistically and in terms of his stuff, and his peripherals only reinforced that it wasn't a fluke.
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Post by iakovos11 on Dec 27, 2012 11:08:38 GMT -5
Tazawa will not be in AAA - unless he really lays an egg or is injured in spring training. He was there best reliever in the 2nd half.
If Bard returns to former self, he won't be in AAA either. He has proven to be a dominant 8th inning guy. He just needs to show up this spring and show he is still that guy if focusing on a relief role from day 1. Easier said than done, I realize. And apparently not many have confidence that he can do this.
In a perfect world, the bullpen has Hanrahan, Bailey, Bard, Tazawa, and Uehara - and then 2 other guys.
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Post by Guidas on Dec 27, 2012 11:46:47 GMT -5
2 other guys prob include Miller, who was one of the best - if not the best - Sox relievers from beginning to end of last year. Ditto Morales & Breslow. Bard starts in the minors me thinks, even if he looks stellar, if only to make sure he can repeat the performance. Of course there are injuries and phantom injuries that will sort much of this out, as well.
And for the record, I think Miller/Tazawa look like better 8th inning options than Bailey based on performance last year. Again the caveat here is relievers can be prone to inconsistency year to year.
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Post by DesignatedForAssignment on Dec 27, 2012 12:41:10 GMT -5
Brock Holt going on age 25 .... impressive AA stats with the bat the past 2 years ... was Rule 5 eligible DEC '12, giving PITT reason to bring him up in SEPT. If his 24 games, 65 MLB ABs was SEPT, then he did not burn an option and has 3 remaining. www.thebaseballcube.com/players/profile.asp?P=Brock-Holt
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Post by GyIantosca on Dec 27, 2012 16:55:40 GMT -5
The Pirates just love our B and C graded prospects. Imagine we consider a blue chipper with them? They would throw us McCutchen, Alvarez and Cole? Just kidding but really they just salivate when they deal with us. They are probably still pissed about Wakefield after all these years.They probably hoping one of these kids turns into an all-star.
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Post by remember04 on Dec 27, 2012 17:01:02 GMT -5
The Pirates just love our B and C graded prospects. Imagine we consider a blue chipper with them? They would throw us McCutchen, Alvarez and Cole? Just kidding but really they just salivate when they deal with us. They are probably still pissed about Wakefield after all these years.They probably hoping one of these kids turns into an all-star. As I recall they also tried to sneak Arroyo through waivers and we claimed him for nothing.
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Post by elguapo on Dec 27, 2012 20:01:05 GMT -5
As I recall they also tried to sneak Arroyo through waivers and we claimed him for nothing. Then he blossomed into a legitimate starting pitcher and we traded him for...
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Post by remember04 on Dec 27, 2012 22:05:13 GMT -5
As I recall they also tried to sneak Arroyo through waivers and we claimed him for nothing. Then he blossomed into a legitimate starting pitcher and we traded him for... Yeah but good old Wily Mo Pena was great for entertainment value. I still remember him launching that bomb against the Royals that damn near hit a hot dog stand or something out there.
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Post by bighead on Dec 28, 2012 7:38:19 GMT -5
As I recall they also tried to sneak Arroyo through waivers and we claimed him for nothing. Then he blossomed into a legitimate starting pitcher and we traded him for... Rumor has it that Arroyo had to be traded because of a conflict with one of the other players personal lives.
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Post by James Dunne on Dec 28, 2012 10:30:40 GMT -5
Rumor has it that Arroyo had to be traded because of a conflict with one of the other players personal lives. He was just signed to a contract extension only a few weeks before the trade. So that would've been taking a pretty big risk if they thought he was a clubhouse problem.
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Post by remember04 on Dec 28, 2012 12:51:53 GMT -5
Rumor has it that Arroyo had to be traded because of a conflict with one of the other players personal lives. He was just signed to a contract extension only a few weeks before the trade. So that would've been taking a pretty big risk if they thought he was a clubhouse problem. Yeah, as I recall that was a fairly team friendly contract because he liked it here so much and we used that to increase his trade value. I was never very high on him but I wasn't crazy about that move. Why should any other player sign a team friendly contract because they like it here when they just traded the last guy to sign one?
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Post by Chris Hatfield on Dec 29, 2012 11:03:18 GMT -5
Then he blossomed into a legitimate starting pitcher and we traded him for... Rumor has it that Arroyo had to be traded because of a conflict with one of the other players personal lives. I believe you're thinking of Orlando Cabrera not being re-signed. Arroyo had TMZ-ish off-field rumors at the time but they were unrelated to teammates.
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