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Post by bigpupp on Jul 26, 2016 23:14:33 GMT -5
Sox now third worst in runs allowed in AL. I actually think Dombrowski is going to make a big move. If he's been charged with winning now and they're on the bubble between division/wild card/out I think he'll feel he has to do something more to get them over that hump. Trouble is they don't need a big move; they need a couple of small moves. A Major League bullpen needs to be able to throw 500 innings, but Tazawa, Kimbrel and Uehara combined are worth less 200 innings. The big moves, which haven't really worked -- are the problem. The Red Sox didn't need a TOR starter; they needed a couple of back of the rotation guys with ERA's under five. Similarly the didn't need sixty elite closer innings, they needed 200 solid 6th and 7th innings. Or 1000 innings, depending on who you ask...
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Post by bosox81 on Jul 26, 2016 23:20:11 GMT -5
Sox now third worst in runs allowed in AL. I actually think Dombrowski is going to make a big move. If he's been charged with winning now and they're on the bubble between division/wild card/out I think he'll feel he has to do something more to get them over that hump. Trouble is they don't need a big move; they need a couple of small moves. A Major League bullpen needs to be able to throw 500 innings, but Tazawa, Kimbrel and Uehara combined are worth less 200 innings. The big moves, which haven't really worked -- are the problem. The Red Sox didn't need a TOR starter; they needed a couple of back of the rotation guys with ERA's under five. Similarly the didn't need sixty elite closer innings, they needed 200 solid 6th and 7th innings. This. Last season the Red Sox had one of the worst pitching staffs in baseball. Through 98 games they had allowed 464 runs. $217 million, plus another $11.25 million, plus five prospects later where are we? Through 98 games this year they have allowed 474 runs! So they've been worse by ten runs than last year. Big upgrade from last year's disaster, right?
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Post by James Dunne on Jul 26, 2016 23:25:47 GMT -5
So if they hadn't added Price and Kimbrel, they'd have allowed fewer runs? That seems like a leap.
Also, considering the jump in run scoring around the league this year, allowing only 10 more runs than the same point last year is probably a modest improvement.
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Post by bosox81 on Jul 26, 2016 23:38:13 GMT -5
So if they hadn't added Price and Kimbrel, they'd have allowed fewer runs? That seems like a leap. Also, considering the jump in run scoring around the league this year, allowing only 10 more runs than the same point last year is probably a modest improvement. Fair point. Don't have the time to through the first 98 games, but comparing the first half last year to this year, there have been 9.8% more runs scored this year than last. The Red Sox staff has allowed 2.1% more runs this year than last. So, I guess you can say that's an improvement for the $44 MM plus five prospects spent.
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Post by bigpupp on Jul 27, 2016 0:12:15 GMT -5
Trouble is they don't need a big move; they need a couple of small moves. A Major League bullpen needs to be able to throw 500 innings, but Tazawa, Kimbrel and Uehara combined are worth less 200 innings. The big moves, which haven't really worked -- are the problem. The Red Sox didn't need a TOR starter; they needed a couple of back of the rotation guys with ERA's under five. Similarly the didn't need sixty elite closer innings, they needed 200 solid 6th and 7th innings. This. Last season the Red Sox had one of the worst pitching staffs in baseball. Through 98 games they had allowed 464 runs. $217 million, plus another $11.25 million, plus five prospects later where are we? Through 98 games this year they have allowed 474 runs! So they've been worse by ten runs than last year. Big upgrade from last year's disaster, right? Don't have to go through the first 98 games. Although it's not perfect, average ERA in MLB last year was 4.01 and this year it is 4.22. Pretty significant difference.
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Post by James Dunne on Jul 27, 2016 0:37:49 GMT -5
So if they hadn't added Price and Kimbrel, they'd have allowed fewer runs? That seems like a leap. Also, considering the jump in run scoring around the league this year, allowing only 10 more runs than the same point last year is probably a modest improvement. Fair point. Don't have the time to through the first 98 games, but comparing the first half last year to this year, there have been 9.8% more runs scored this year than last. The Red Sox staff has allowed 2.1% more runs this year than last. So, I guess you can say that's an improvement for the $44 MM plus five prospects spent.But you can't assume they'd have the same output if they'd stood pat. Clay Buchholz, Joe Kelly, and Eduardo Rodriguez ranged from mildly frustrating to pretty good last year, and this year they've ranged from unmitigated disaster to broken-and-can't-figure-out-why. I'm pretty critical of the Kimbrel and Pomeranz deals but the team is obviously better off with those two and Price than they would be without them.
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Post by p23w on Jul 27, 2016 5:31:54 GMT -5
So if they hadn't added Price and Kimbrel, they'd have allowed fewer runs? That seems like a leap. Also, considering the jump in run scoring around the league this year, allowing only 10 more runs than the same point last year is probably a modest improvement. This was sarcasm, right?
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Post by bosox81 on Jul 27, 2016 6:14:18 GMT -5
Fair point. Don't have the time to through the first 98 games, but comparing the first half last year to this year, there have been 9.8% more runs scored this year than last. The Red Sox staff has allowed 2.1% more runs this year than last. So, I guess you can say that's an improvement for the $44 MM plus five prospects spent.But you can't assume they'd have the same output if they'd stood pat. Clay Buchholz, Joe Kelly, and Eduardo Rodriguez ranged from mildly frustrating to pretty good last year, and this year they've ranged from unmitigated disaster to broken-and-can't-figure-out-why. I'm pretty critical of the Kimbrel and Pomeranz deals but the team is obviously better off with those two and Price than they would be without them. And Porcello took a significant step forward and Wright went from nonfactor to ace of the staff. I agree that the team is better with those three pitchers than without them. I'm just very disappointed where we are pitching-wise after so much of the farm and so much money spent.
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Post by ancientsoxfogey on Jul 27, 2016 6:39:01 GMT -5
For those thinking we should fire the a manger. It won't happen. And it rarely happens in any sport. The cavs were the exception. And they would have won even if they didn't fire their coach. Teams above 500 don't fire their manager unless he chokes out a player or something And the Pittsburgh Penguins changed head coaches twice during the season and won the Stanley Cup.
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Post by bosox81 on Jul 27, 2016 6:40:01 GMT -5
This. Last season the Red Sox had one of the worst pitching staffs in baseball. Through 98 games they had allowed 464 runs. $217 million, plus another $11.25 million, plus five prospects later where are we? Through 98 games this year they have allowed 474 runs! So they've been worse by ten runs than last year. Big upgrade from last year's disaster, right? Don't have to go through the first 98 games. Although it's not perfect, average ERA in MLB last year was 4.01 and this year it is 4.22. Pretty significant difference. Well, if we're going by ERA, last year's Red Sox staff had a 4.34 ERA. This year it's 4.43 so far. It didn't go backwards as much as the rest of the league, but again, after how much in money and prospects has been spent, you have to be disappointed at the marginal improvement.
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Post by James Dunne on Jul 27, 2016 7:16:34 GMT -5
Don't have to go through the first 98 games. Although it's not perfect, average ERA in MLB last year was 4.01 and this year it is 4.22. Pretty significant difference. Well, if we're going by ERA, last year's Red Sox staff had a 4.34 ERA. This year it's 4.43 so far. It didn't go backwards as much as the rest of the league, but again, after how much in money and prospects has been spent, you have to be disappointed at the marginal improvement. You absolutely have to be disappointed by the marginal improvement. And Price hasn't been anything near dominant. But the reason the staff has been a disappointment is that starters 4-7 - Buchholz, Rodriguez, Kelly, and Owens - have been a disaster. Price giving up 15-25 fewer runs would make a huge difference in his ERA but wouldn't really change the staff's overall performance.
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Post by mgoetze on Jul 27, 2016 7:46:31 GMT -5
Based on having watched only the condensed game, it seems that, while Wright's command is not as excellent as it was at the beginning of the season, it's still good enough to be a reasonable starter. He generated a lot of weak contact that, on this occasion, turned into a lot of hits. Ross, on the other hand, seemed to clearly be struggling with his control in his second inning of work. That he wasn't hooked may well have lost the game.
On the more general question of having starters only go through the order twice. I don't think it is practical to do so for every starter in a 5-man rotation. More plausibly, you could have a 4-man rotation with piggyback starters. However, even in a 5-man rotation, it is feasible to have 2 guys limited to 18 batters faced. What you need is a dedicated reliever to go the next 9 batters on those days. Which obviously means you can't have your #4 and #5 starters on back-to-back days as managers like to have them. And the rest of the bullpen needs to be managed more flexibly...
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Post by tjb21 on Jul 27, 2016 7:55:23 GMT -5
The phrase: "THIS TEAM" could be used to describe the current year. In every way. They're maddening. They're wonderful. They're consistently inconsistent. What a strange season.
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Post by templeusox on Jul 27, 2016 13:21:15 GMT -5
Gotta find a way to get Jose Iglesias out. He's not good.
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Post by Guidas on Jul 27, 2016 13:21:26 GMT -5
Can't a pitcher on this staff hold a lead for a few innings?
Asking for a friend. I'll hang up and listen.
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Post by templeusox on Jul 27, 2016 13:22:25 GMT -5
Anatomy of a bad inning. Give up a couple bloops and pitch non-competitively to two of the best hitters in the game.
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Post by Guidas on Jul 27, 2016 13:33:41 GMT -5
All Sandy Leon, All The Time. #GreatestHits
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Post by Don Caballero on Jul 27, 2016 13:44:26 GMT -5
On the bright side, the Blue Jays are losing. Will the Padres be able to hold a lead? Oh my God it has been a depressing week for the Red Sox when I'm caring about stuff like that.
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Post by Guidas on Jul 27, 2016 13:48:00 GMT -5
On the bright side, the Blue Jays are losing. Will the Padres be able to hold a lead? Oh my God it has been a depressing week for the Red Sox when I'm caring about stuff like that. I'm putting this all on jimed14 forum.soxprospects.com/post/220121
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manfred
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Post by manfred on Jul 27, 2016 14:02:26 GMT -5
I watch ERod and keep thinking, "man, he's close... he's going to get it together and be very good later in the season." Then I remember it is almost August.
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Post by Don Caballero on Jul 27, 2016 14:07:15 GMT -5
Rule of the thumb as a Red Sox fan: never be too happy, everything is not ok and the sky could be falling.
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Post by huskies15 on Jul 27, 2016 14:07:29 GMT -5
I feel like this team rides the roller coaster of the season too much. They get hot for a week r two and then lose all confidence and play relatively poorly for a week. This tigers and twins series have just seemed flat
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Post by tjb21 on Jul 27, 2016 14:11:45 GMT -5
The score should be much worse right now. Fortunate to still be within a run.
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Post by templeusox on Jul 27, 2016 14:13:12 GMT -5
Really well done everyone. Good show this series.
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nomar
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Post by nomar on Jul 27, 2016 14:20:51 GMT -5
Glad I haven't been able to watch these last 2.
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