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8/22-8/25 Red Sox @ Rays Series Thread
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Post by sox207 on Aug 23, 2016 7:24:35 GMT -5
If the Sox can get anything that even resembles an eighth-inning guy, this team leads the East by at least 3 games We have that guy - Ross. Too bad Farrell is awful at developing/setting roles for relievers. It's something that's extremely important and he fails to do it. If Barnes is your "8th inning guy" he shouldn't have been in last night. There 8th inning guy should be Ziggy.
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Post by James Dunne on Aug 23, 2016 7:26:50 GMT -5
Bashing Farrell while singing the praises of Andrew Miller has a tinge of irony. Miller's development as a late-inning reliever is probably Farrell's greatest developmental success. His career was a total disaster before Farrell got ahold of him.
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Post by mattpicard on Aug 23, 2016 8:03:46 GMT -5
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Post by James Dunne on Aug 23, 2016 8:10:05 GMT -5
Clear Stockholm Syndrome.
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Post by Guidas on Aug 23, 2016 8:18:10 GMT -5
In the space of a few comments the starters are being overused and the relievers are being overused. In my opinion what is going on with the bullpen is on the bullpen. Maybe they need to quit reading the press? They aren't this bad. They need to "man-up" and start getting it done. At this point they don't even have to be good. They just need to stop being lousy. Robbie Ross can't pitch the 8th if Farrell never brings him in.
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Post by tjb21 on Aug 23, 2016 8:19:29 GMT -5
Great win!
Tied for first again. I'm very cautiously optimistic about tonight's game.
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nomar
Veteran
Posts: 10,787
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Post by nomar on Aug 23, 2016 8:28:10 GMT -5
Hope: Bogaerts stays hot, Benintendi's confidence is at an all time high, Buchholz stays lucky.
Fear: Dave O'Brien will probably talk about how much talent Archer has but that his ERA against us is astronomical, thus jinxing our offense into extinction.
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Post by jimed14 on Aug 23, 2016 8:45:42 GMT -5
Hope: Bogaerts stays hot, Benintendi's confidence is at an all time high, Buchholz stays lucky. Fear: Dave O'Brien will probably talk about how much talent Archer has but that his ERA against us is astronomical, thus jinxing our offense into extinction. I know you say this a lot, but Buchholz typically is "lucky" when he's good, because he's always nibbling around the edges and getting batters to swing at pitches just out of the zone for weak contact. His peripherals aren't very good, but what I'm talking about is always there when he's doing well. It has always been his approach.
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nomar
Veteran
Posts: 10,787
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Post by nomar on Aug 23, 2016 8:51:34 GMT -5
Hope: Bogaerts stays hot, Benintendi's confidence is at an all time high, Buchholz stays lucky. Fear: Dave O'Brien will probably talk about how much talent Archer has but that his ERA against us is astronomical, thus jinxing our offense into extinction. I know you say this a lot, but Buchholz typically is "lucky" when he's good, because he's always nibbling around the edges and getting batters to swing at pitches just out of the zone for weak contact. His peripherals aren't very good, but what I'm talking about is always there when he's doing well. It has always been his approach. Well either way, I hope he keeps it up. His peripherals were great last year though. Agreed that he outperforms his peripherals historically, but never have they been this bad in a year he was successful.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Aug 23, 2016 9:24:29 GMT -5
Despite the poor bullpen and at times shaky rotation, it's nice to see the Red Sox playing meaningful games in late August again. You can't reasonably ask for more than that from your team.
My hopes for the rest of the year:
1) Bogaerts rediscovers his stroke and goes on a huge hot streak down the stretch.
2) E-Rod continues to put his first half struggles behind him and further stabilizes the rotation.
3) Benintendi has the same impact at the bottom of the lineup that Ellsbury had in the 2007 postseason.
4) Koji comes back rested and healthy and gives the team a reliable 8th inning guy.
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ericmvan
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Supposed to be working on something more important
Posts: 8,924
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Post by ericmvan on Aug 23, 2016 9:38:56 GMT -5
Got home last night from a double bill of 8 1/2 and Multiple Maniacs to discover Price's game line, Xander solidifying the notion that he's fixed his funk, and JF not only giving JBJ a day off but playing Young in LF rather than CF.
Pomeranz or E-Rod can be the 8th inning guy in the post-season.
E-Rod throwing 3 simulated innings today. Projected rotation now:
Tue 8/23 Buchholz Wed 8/24 Porcello Thu 8/25 Pomeranz Fri 8/26 Wright Sat 8/27 Price Sun 8/28 Rodriguez or Buchholz Mon 8/29 Porcello Tue 8/30 Pomeranz Wed 8/31 Wright 9/1 off
That sets up the big weekend series in Toronto to be either E-Rod, Porcello, Pomeranz, or, if they use the Thursday off day to skip a starter, Porcello, Pomeranz, Wright. Whoever pitches in that series would be scheduled to pitch the season finale series as well (assuming they don't skip over Pomeranz on Monday 9/26). So whether they do skip E-Rod just before that series may depend on how he and Wright pitch coming off of their injuries (in 2 and 3 starts respectively).
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ericmvan
Veteran
Supposed to be working on something more important
Posts: 8,924
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Post by ericmvan on Aug 23, 2016 9:42:11 GMT -5
Despite the poor bullpen and at times shaky rotation, it's nice to see the Red Sox playing meaningful games in late August again. You can't reasonably ask for more than that from your team. My hopes for the rest of the year: 1) Bogaerts rediscovers his stroke and goes on a huge hot streak down the stretch. 2) E-Rod continues to put his first half struggles behind him and further stabilizes the rotation. 3) Benintendi has the same impact at the bottom of the lineup that Ellsbury had in the 2007 postseason. 4) Koji comes back rested and healthy and gives the team a reliable 8th inning guy.Throwing a bullpen today, which is exceptionally good news. It now seems likely that he'll be back not just this year, but for much or most of September.
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Post by mattpicard on Aug 23, 2016 9:43:32 GMT -5
Got home last night from a double bill of 8 1/2 and Multiple Maniacs to discover Price's game line, Xander solidifying the notion that he's fixed his funk, and JF not only giving JBJ a day off but playing Young in LF rather than CF.Pomeranz or E-Rod can be the 8th inning guy in the post-season. E-Rod throwing 3 simulated innings today. Projected rotation now: Tue 8/23 Buchholz Wed 8/24 Porcello Thu 8/25 Pomeranz Fri 8/26 Wright Sat 8/27 Price Sun 8/28 Rodriguez or Buchholz Mon 8/29 Porcello Tue 8/30 Pomeranz Wed 8/31 Wright 9/1 off That sets up the big weekend series in Toronto to be either E-Rod, Porcello, Pomeranz, or, if they use the Thursday off day to skip a starter, Porcello, Pomeranz, Wright. Whoever pitches in that series would be scheduled to pitch the season finale series as well (assuming they don't skip over Pomeranz on Monday 9/26). So whether they do skip E-Rod just before that series may depend on how he and Wright pitch coming off of their injuries (in 2 and 3 starts respectively). I was pleased with this as well, but it would have been asinine to play Young in CF over Beni considering he's coming off a significant hamstring injury. Now, it would have still been pretty asinine if Young's legs were 100%, but I do wonder what JF would have done in that situation. Probably still Beni in CF, since he hasn't been locked into a corner for a while, unlike Mookie.
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Post by sox fan in nc on Aug 23, 2016 9:59:49 GMT -5
As bad as Buch is, all he would have to is not throw up in his last few starts & he could be the 2nd or 3rd best SP in this years FA. I can easily see the 13 mil picked up & a trade happening.
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Post by fenwaythehardway on Aug 23, 2016 10:02:16 GMT -5
Fear: Dave O'Brien will probably talk That's certainly my fear.
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Post by FenwayFanatic on Aug 23, 2016 11:39:05 GMT -5
I understand. I was responding to Fanatic, who used that to bootstrap into another diatribe about the manager. Farrell has his warts, but I don't think letting Barnes finish the game fits into that narrative. Thats because I was talking about his managing as a whole not this particular game. Showalter had another great game last night.
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Post by jerrygarciaparra on Aug 23, 2016 12:31:07 GMT -5
I really wonder whether the love for Ross is more indicative of the lack of internal options, more than the talents of the pitcher himself. We are talking about a guy who's had a fairly middling MLB career, and one who last year, incurred the wrath of posters when he didn't pitch well. He is giving up less hits and homeruns this year and striking out more this year, but it is in 40 innings.
I mean, did it ever occur to anyone that he is pitching better because he pitches less? The track record does not indicate an 8th innning guy, and it is a real slippery slope to think that is a role he can manage just because he has pitched better this year. I would prefer Ziegler, as his history indicates that he is efficient in that role.
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Post by bosox81 on Aug 23, 2016 12:52:30 GMT -5
Maybe just don't declare a specific 8th-inning guy and go with match-ups. I mean, Tito doesn't even have a defined closer.
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Post by klostrophobic on Aug 23, 2016 12:56:18 GMT -5
Got home last night from a double bill of 8 1/2 and Multiple Maniacs to discover Price's game line Almost did the same thing, but wasn't sure I could handle both back-to-back. Going to see Multiple Maniacs tonight, though. Definitely love the idea of Pomeranz (or Rodriguez) in the bullpen in the playoffs. Ideal world scenario with Uehara coming back and entering the playoffs with a bullpen of Kimbrel/Ziegler/Pomeranz/Uehara/Tazawa/Barnes is pretty enticing.
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Post by braziliansox on Aug 23, 2016 13:17:49 GMT -5
Hope: Bogaerts stays hot, Benintendi's confidence is at an all time high, Buchholz stays lucky. Fear: Dave O'Brien will probably talk about how much talent Archer has but that his ERA against us is astronomical, thus jinxing our offense into extinction. I know you say this a lot, but Buchholz typically is "lucky" when he's good, because he's always nibbling around the edges and getting batters to swing at pitches just out of the zone for weak contact. His peripherals aren't very good, but what I'm talking about is always there when he's doing well. It has always been his approach. With this post you're officially Buchholz's deepjohn. Congratulations!
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pd
Rookie
Posts: 236
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Post by pd on Aug 23, 2016 13:19:58 GMT -5
Maybe just don't declare a specific 8th-inning guy and go with match-ups. I mean, Tito doesn't even have a defined closer. And who is the 8th inning guy now? Isn't that more or less what he's doing?
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pd
Rookie
Posts: 236
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Post by pd on Aug 23, 2016 13:22:29 GMT -5
I really wonder whether the love for Ross is more indicative of the lack of internal options, more than the talents of the pitcher himself. We are talking about a guy who's had a fairly middling MLB career, and one who last year, incurred the wrath of posters when he didn't pitch well. He is giving up less hits and homeruns this year and striking out more this year, but it is in 40 innings. I mean, did it ever occur to anyone that he is pitching better because he pitches less? The track record does not indicate an 8th innning guy, and it is a real slippery slope to think that is a role he can manage just because he has pitched better this year. I would prefer Ziegler, as his history indicates that he is efficient in that role. And if Farrell did use Ross in the 8th and he had a bad outing, Farrell would be getting ripped for that too.
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Post by braziliansox on Aug 23, 2016 13:23:31 GMT -5
Maybe just don't declare a specific 8th-inning guy and go with match-ups. I mean, Tito doesn't even have a defined closer. And who is the 8th inning guy now? Isn't that more or less what he's doing? Pretty sure he penciled Barnes in the 8th inning a couple days ago.
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Post by jerrygarciaparra on Aug 23, 2016 13:37:38 GMT -5
Maybe just don't declare a specific 8th-inning guy and go with match-ups. I mean, Tito doesn't even have a defined closer. Do you think we currently have the arms to do that? Sounds great and all...but I don't see a lot depth at this moment. The minute you used Kimbrel and Ziegler in the 7th and/or 8th, and then threw out Barnes or Tazawa to close out a close game (and then lose), you'd have pitchforks heading to Fenway. I don't know the state of the Cleveland pen, but I am going to guess it is prohibitively better than ours.
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Post by pedrofanforever45 on Aug 23, 2016 13:46:03 GMT -5
I really wonder whether the love for Ross is more indicative of the lack of internal options, more than the talents of the pitcher himself. We are talking about a guy who's had a fairly middling MLB career, and one who last year, incurred the wrath of posters when he didn't pitch well. He is giving up less hits and homeruns this year and striking out more this year, but it is in 40 innings. I mean, did it ever occur to anyone that he is pitching better because he pitches less? The track record does not indicate an 8th innning guy, and it is a real slippery slope to think that is a role he can manage just because he has pitched better this year. I would prefer Ziegler, as his history indicates that he is efficient in that role. And if Farrell did use Ross in the 8th and he had a bad outing, Farrell would be getting ripped for that too. No he wouldn't, because this is what everyone wants to see happen. TL at least recognized Ross Jr was the best reliever at the end of last year and made him the closer, Farrell gets his hands on him and he thinks he's a lefty specialist again that shouldn't be used in high leverage.
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