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2018 Red Sox roster building
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Post by jodyreidnichols on Oct 3, 2017 7:43:27 GMT -5
Sure some may find this a bit premature but I don't think so. Never before have I had less of a feel for a Red Sox team entering the playoffs. The could just as easily win it all as they get swept.
So with that in mind the hot stove season is well at hand (? well see) Unfortunately it appears Hanley and his $22M/year will be back and he has an option for 2019 which he has a legit chance to make. Unless the Sox cut him (not likely, chances are he's back. Mitch Moreland is a free agent. I wouldn't mind having him back as a default however firstbase may be the best position to upgrade. Eric Hosmer is a free agent and he's only 28. His career line is 284/342/439 this past season it's 318/385/498. His defense is vastly overrted see fangraphs article on him however he's still approx. a league average defensive firstbasemen. The question isn't would you want to upgrade for him it's how much per year and how many years that will determine if it's worth it. I don't know the answer to that but thought it would be good to hear others thoughts on this. Most other positions the Sox have settled. At second I'd love to have Nunez (if his health checks out) in case Pedey's health continues to be an issue and let Nunez be a super sub although chances are he'll want a full time gig somewhere else.
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Post by sibbysisti on Oct 3, 2017 13:10:01 GMT -5
The team needs power, no question. Hosmer, as well as J.D., will have lots of suitors as many teams are looking for the same skill set.
I've suggested Jose Abreu. And he would cost 11m per for two years. But it would take talent to acquire his bat.
With the roster either into or approaching its prime, the next two years are pivotal to WS aspirations. This way they'd have to rebuild the system and reevaluate to 1B situation for the future.
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Post by larrycook on Oct 5, 2017 21:14:45 GMT -5
Job #1 this offseason:
Sign ohtani. Do what ever it takes, this guy is the real deal. Hands down the best free agent available.
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Post by soxfansince67 on Oct 5, 2017 22:11:37 GMT -5
A few predictions, a few wishes - not considering payroll or contracts - just team needs (and those to part with)
Unless they come back and win the Astros series, I think they will be shopping for a new manager and hitting coach.
Sale, Pomeranz, Porcello, ERod, Price Kimbrel, Reed, Kelly, Barnes, Smith, Workman - Thornburg?, Velazquez? Scott? Johnson?
The core of the team - Vazquez, Bogaerts, Devers, Benintendi, Betts, JBJ (maybe - though his oft-fading bat is a concern) Questions - Holt, Lin, Moreland, Leon, Pedey (health?), Nunez (health - and do they sign him?), Swihart, Travis, Marrero
Bye bye Hanley, Fister, Hembree, Boyer, Abad, Young, Davis - and some from the questions list above
We need more offense for sure - who gets added and who is cut will be interesting. The team is really close, but needs bats!
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Post by chrisfromnc on Oct 6, 2017 11:48:15 GMT -5
A few predictions, a few wishes - not considering payroll or contracts - just team needs (and those to part with) Unless they come back and win the Astros series, I think they will be shopping for a new manager and hitting coach. Sale, Pomeranz, Porcello, ERod, Price Kimbrel, Reed, Kelly, Barnes, Smith, Workman - Thornburg?, Velazquez? Scott? Johnson? The core of the team - Vazquez, Bogaerts, Devers, Benintendi, Betts, JBJ (maybe - though his oft-fading bat is a concern) Questions - Holt, Lin, Moreland, Leon, Pedey (health?), Nunez (health - and do they sign him?), Swihart, Travis, Marrero Bye bye Hanley, Fister, Hembree, Boyer, Abad, Young, Davis - and some from the questions list above We need more offense for sure - who gets added and who is cut will be interesting. The team is really close, but needs bats! Steven Wright should fit somewhere as well. I assume he and Brian Johnson will compete for the 6th starter role.
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Post by soxfansince67 on Oct 6, 2017 12:53:26 GMT -5
A few predictions, a few wishes - not considering payroll or contracts - just team needs (and those to part with) Unless they come back and win the Astros series, I think they will be shopping for a new manager and hitting coach. Sale, Pomeranz, Porcello, ERod, Price Kimbrel, Reed, Kelly, Barnes, Smith, Workman - Thornburg?, Velazquez? Scott? Johnson? The core of the team - Vazquez, Bogaerts, Devers, Benintendi, Betts, JBJ (maybe - though his oft-fading bat is a concern) Questions - Holt, Lin, Moreland, Leon, Pedey (health?), Nunez (health - and do they sign him?), Swihart, Travis, Marrero Bye bye Hanley, Fister, Hembree, Boyer, Abad, Young, Davis - and some from the questions list above We need more offense for sure - who gets added and who is cut will be interesting. The team is really close, but needs bats! Steven Wright should fit somewhere as well. I assume he and Brian Johnson will compete for the 6th starter role. Thanks for reminding me about Wright - much will depend upon how he heals - but his presence on the roster is certainly a factor to be considered
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Post by jimed14 on Oct 6, 2017 12:57:21 GMT -5
I'm blaming this thread if the Red Sox lose in the first round.
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Post by wrangler713 on Oct 6, 2017 17:58:04 GMT -5
Power we need power. I think Dave signs Hosmer to a 6 year 110 million deal. I think he ends up trading Benitendi, ERod, Groome, Mata, and Brian Johnson for Stanton.
Stone cold line up of C: Vazquez 1B: Hosmer 2B: Pedroia 3B: Devers SS: Xander OF: Stanton, JBJ, and Betts DH: Hanley
Sale, Price, Porcello, Pom, and Wright.
Kimbrel, Kelly, Smith, Workman, Barnes, Abad, and Maddox.
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Post by pedrofanforever45 on Oct 6, 2017 18:01:32 GMT -5
Power we need power. I think Dave signs Hosmer to a 6 year 110 million deal. I think he ends up trading Benitendi, ERod, Groome, Mata, and Brian Johnson for Stanton. Stone cold line up of C: Vazquez 1B: Hosmer 2B: Pedroia 3B: Devers SS: Xander OF: Stanton, JBJ, and Betts DH: Hanley Sale, Price, Porcello, Pom, and Wright. Kimbrel, Kelly, Smith, Workman, Barnes, Abad, and Maddox. God that would be horrible. All of that.
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Post by carmenfanzone on Oct 6, 2017 19:51:12 GMT -5
A few predictions, a few wishes - not considering payroll or contracts - just team needs (and those to part with) Unless they come back and win the Astros series, I think they will be shopping for a new manager and hitting coach. Sale, Pomeranz, Porcello, ERod, Price Kimbrel, Reed, Kelly, Barnes, Smith, Workman - Thornburg?, Velazquez? Scott? Johnson? The core of the team - Vazquez, Bogaerts, Devers, Benintendi, Betts, JBJ (maybe - though his oft-fading bat is a concern) Questions - Holt, Lin, Moreland, Leon, Pedey (health?), Nunez (health - and do they sign him?), Swihart, Travis, Marrero Bye bye Hanley, Fister, Hembree, Boyer, Abad, Young, Davis - and some from the questions list above We need more offense for sure - who gets added and who is cut will be interesting. The team is really close, but needs bats! Isn't Reed a free agent? I doubt they would spend the money to sign him given they will have Smith from the beginning of the year and probably Thornburg for at least part of it. Also, are you advocating cutting Hanley like they did the Panda and carrying both of their salaries as dead wight all of next year? Otherwise, who do you expect would trade for Hanley given the year he had this year? Given the fact they have already traded almost all of their top prospects or have promoted them to key spots on the big league team, they have limited ability to trade prospects for top end talent like Abreau or Stanton. The only way I see to improve would be to sign free agents and be resigned to being over the cap for the next few years. I am not sure ownership will be willing to do that. IF they are not, we are left hoping that several of their core players (Bogarts, Betts, Bradley) play more like they did in 2016 than in 2017.
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Post by larrycook on Oct 7, 2017 22:04:56 GMT -5
Power we need power. I think Dave signs Hosmer to a 6 year 110 million deal. I think he ends up trading Benitendi, ERod, Groome, Mata, and Brian Johnson for Stanton. Stone cold line up of C: Vazquez 1B: Hosmer 2B: Pedroia 3B: Devers SS: Xander OF: Stanton, JBJ, and Betts DH: Hanley Sale, Price, Porcello, Pom, and Wright. Kimbrel, Kelly, Smith, Workman, Barnes, Abad, and Maddox. Wow! That is an intriguing trade idea for Stanton. Sans abad, this is a nice line up. But we still dedperately need a veteran leader.
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danr
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Post by danr on Oct 7, 2017 22:21:28 GMT -5
With the new ownership in Miami I have a hard time believing they will trade Stanton.
I hope the Sox do not make a big trade and further deplete the minors. There are free agents who would fit the need and that's where they should concentrate.
I think that if they keep Hanley it has to be strictly as the DH. That way his chances of getting hurt are minimized.
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Post by kmann on Oct 8, 2017 5:58:26 GMT -5
Considering the Sox have approximately $94M in contracts they will not be able to move (i.e. Price, Porcello, Hanley, Panda), considering Kimbrel's option is a no brainer and adding Pedey's contract, that brings the total to over $120M-$125M. I know Young, Moreland, Abad's contracts are dropping off, but we also have guys who will get pay increases through arbitration (i.e. X, Bradley, Mookie, Pomeranz, etc). Is this the year management ignores the salary cap and signs a couple of big bats OR will it be a quiet winter? Maybe management hopes that a healthy David Price, a full year of Devers, and bounce back years from our every day players will be more than enough to win a World Series? I would love to add guys like JD Martinez, but it seems to me we are kind of stuck with what we got for another 2 years.
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Post by pedrofanforever45 on Oct 8, 2017 6:17:00 GMT -5
Why couldn't the Sox move Porcello?
He's on a short two year deal after this season, is 29 after this season, and is one year removed from a Cy Young campaign. That seems like the perfect kind of guy they could move to drop salary. There will be teams willing to take that contract if they miss out on Darvish, Cobb, Tanaka, and Arrieta.
Take the Phillies for example. They have 20 million committed next season or something really low like that and need rotation help. I'm sure they would take on Porcello with open arms.
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Post by sibbysisti on Oct 8, 2017 6:39:40 GMT -5
Another bat to consider, should they lose out on Abreu or J.D., is Nick Castellanos of the Tigers. Hit .276 this season with 26 HR and 101 rbi. He's only 25 with four years MLB experience. Nice ops over .800 last two years. And two more arbitration eligible seasons left.
Only problem is his fielding. It was lacking at 3b and the outfield. Could be a 1B or DH candidate.
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Post by kmann on Oct 8, 2017 7:54:35 GMT -5
Why couldn't the Sox move Porcello? He's on a short two year deal after this season, is 29 after this season, and is one year removed from a Cy Young campaign. That seems like the perfect kind of guy they could move to drop salary. There will be teams willing to take that contract if they miss out on Darvish, Cobb, Tanaka, and Arrieta. Take the Phillies for example. They have 20 million committed next season or something really low like that and need rotation help. I'm sure they would take on Porcello with open arms. I hope you are right on Porcello but I would be shocked to see another team express interest in him without the Sox paying a portion of his salary.
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Post by soxfansince67 on Oct 8, 2017 10:53:07 GMT -5
Listening to some of the local sports shows, and doing some reading, there are some calls to pull a Celtics-style "blow the team apart" approach - that the Sox are playing an outdated form of small ball, and they have to use a different approach to get beyond the "very good team but not quite" level.
I think that it is going to be a fascinating off-season...and we will have quite the discussions here, with the huge range of opinions.
The key may be not overreacting to great players having off seasons (Xander, Mookie). Also, the managerial decision (keep or fire Farrell...and if he goes, who comes in?) will be very interesting to watch.
Hoping for a huge win today that fires them up and off to more wins, no matter what.
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gerry
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Post by gerry on Oct 8, 2017 11:02:10 GMT -5
Why couldn't the Sox move Porcello? He's on a short two year deal after this season, is 29 after this season, and is one year removed from a Cy Young campaign. That seems like the perfect kind of guy they could move to drop salary. There will be teams willing to take that contract if they miss out on Darvish, Cobb, Tanaka, and Arrieta. Take the Phillies for example. They have 20 million committed next season or something really low like that and need rotation help. I'm sure they would take on Porcello with open arms. I hope you are right on Porcello but I would be shocked to see another team express interest in him without the Sox paying a portion of his salary. [b Of all this deep and rather elite pitching rotation (Sale, Price, Porcello, Pom, ERod, Fister, Wright, Velasquez, Johnson, Owens, Elias, Beeks) only a move of Porcello, IMO, would provide the financial benefit to allow signing a big bat. Freeing up $15 to 20M towards JDM would make such a move possible. The other pitchers either have "low" salaries (Sale, Pom, Erod, etc.) or are currently immovable (Price). In addition to Young, Moreland, Abad's 15+M, the potential moves of Holt (in favor of LHB Marco or Lin) and Ross (in favor of Scott, Beeks or Johnson) and letting Reed walk would free up another nearly $15M. So, with some carefully calculated risk, the money is there to upgrade the offense while maintaining excellent pitching. On the other hand, not much needs to be nor should be done. The very real injuries and needed rehabs to Vasquez, Leon, Swihart, Moreland, Hanley, Pedroia, Sandoval, Xander, Betts, Holt, Marco, Nunez, Rutledge, Price, Pom, ERod, Johnson, Elias, Johnson, Ross, Smith, Thornburg, and a slow start due to a flu epidemic, absolutely caused this team to under perform in 2017. Their return in 2018, and probably some significant tinkering with the staff, would put the WS back on the table for 2018. Going over the cap seems a no brainer for a year or two. Getting a big bat also seems a no brainer, and that process is something we can only guess at due to the complexity of finding positions to play it. Hosmer may not be a significant improvement over a healthy, Fenway-adapted Moreland, but that little bump may be enough. JDM at DH and LF, could cause a cascade of moving JBJ at the expense of elite OF defense; or relegating Hanley to a bench role with time at DH and 1B, but not if Hosmer is at 1B nor JDM at DH. I am all in for a healthy and successful 2018, and the addition of a big bat somewhere; and think Porcello and a few others would pay for it. But not Stanton at the expense of our struggling farm PLUS our guys like Beni, Erod PLUS another outrageous salary. I am glad DD and staff will have the nightmare of finding ways to augment this amazing young team without major surgery.
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Post by jimed14 on Oct 8, 2017 11:14:23 GMT -5
Listening to some of the local sports shows, and doing some reading, there are some calls to pull a Celtics-style "blow the team apart" approach - that the Sox are playing an outdated form of small ball, and they have to use a different approach to get beyond the "very good team but not quite" level. I think that it is going to be a fascinating off-season...and we will have quite the discussions here, with the huge range of opinions. The key may be not overreacting to great players having off seasons (Xander, Mookie). Also, the managerial decision (keep or fire Farrell...and if he goes, who comes in?) will be very interesting to watch. Hoping for a huge win today that fires them up and off to more wins, no matter what. They got completely screwed when the league decided to go for the juiced ball again. Probably need to transition to drafting and developing guys who are bigger than 5'10".
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Post by prangerx on Oct 8, 2017 12:19:01 GMT -5
Target JD Martinez and Jay Bruce. Their power numbers can make a huge difference. If you have to bench Hanley. than so be it. He only has a hear left without his vesting option kicking in.
Replace John Ferrall with Alex Cora. And replace the pitching coach with Jim Hickey.
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gerry
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Post by gerry on Oct 8, 2017 12:27:02 GMT -5
Listening to some of the local sports shows, and doing some reading, there are some calls to pull a Celtics-style "blow the team apart" approach - that the Sox are playing an outdated form of small ball, and they have to use a different approach to get beyond the "very good team but not quite" level. I think that it is going to be a fascinating off-season...and we will have quite the discussions here, with the huge range of opinions. The key may be not overreacting to great players having off seasons (Xander, Mookie). Also, the managerial decision (keep or fire Farrell...and if he goes, who comes in?) will be very interesting to watch. Hoping for a huge win today that fires them up and off to more wins, no matter what. They got completely screwed when the league decided to go for the juiced ball again. Probably need to transition to drafting and developing guys who are bigger than 5'10". LOL. On the other hand it seems like a healthy OF of Beni, JBJ, Mookie could and should deliver 75 or more HR with 90 -100+ 2B/3B and above average base running, including 50+ SB. Healthy, that''s an elite offense to go with their uber elite defense. Pedroia may not hit more than 20HR again, but the above 5'10" Moreland/Hosmer, Devers, XB, Hanley/JDM sure will. Really, a well managed healthy team, including pitching, with an experienced Devers and Beni, and one more big bat, will be as elite as they were projected to be as this 2017 ALE Champion season began.
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Post by soxfansince67 on Oct 8, 2017 12:52:46 GMT -5
They got completely screwed when the league decided to go for the juiced ball again. Probably need to transition to drafting and developing guys who are bigger than 5'10". LOL. On the other hand it seems like a healthy OF of Beni, JBJ, Mookie could and should deliver 75 or more HR with 90 -100+ 2B/3B and above average base running, including 50+ SB. Healthy, that''s an elite offense to go with their uber elite defense. Pedroia may not hit more than 20HR again, but the above 5'10" Moreland/Hosmer, Devers, XB, Hanley/JDM sure will. Really, a well managed healthy team, including pitching, with an experienced Devers and Beni, and one more big bat, will be as elite as they were projected to be as this 2017 ALE Champion season began. Aside from health, not sure why the Sox have so many hitters that go fishing - throughout the season, it just struck me that we were not a tough team to pitch against by just throwing sliders low and outside - Xander couldn't quit them - Mookie got into some bad habits once pitchers learned to not go fast and inside. And who knows what the secret to keeping JBJ from deep slumps may be. I know many say that hitting coaches are really not significant factors, but whether it was the type of hitters, line up construction or just bad luck, it was a tough year to string hits together - which is fatal of the team isn't hitting home runs. Time to say goodbye to Chile Davis?
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Post by kmann on Oct 9, 2017 5:58:25 GMT -5
I hope you are right on Porcello but I would be shocked to see another team express interest in him without the Sox paying a portion of his salary. [b Of all this deep and rather elite pitching rotation (Sale, Price, Porcello, Pom, ERod, Fister, Wright, Velasquez, Johnson, Owens, Elias, Beeks) only a move of Porcello, IMO, would provide the financial benefit to allow signing a big bat. Freeing up $15 to 20M towards JDM would make such a move possible. The other pitchers either have "low" salaries (Sale, Pom, Erod, etc.) or are currently immovable (Price). In addition to Young, Moreland, Abad's 15+M, the potential moves of Holt (in favor of LHB Marco or Lin) and Ross (in favor of Scott, Beeks or Johnson) and letting Reed walk would free up another nearly $15M. So, with some carefully calculated risk, the money is there to upgrade the offense while maintaining excellent pitching. On the other hand, not much needs to be nor should be done. The very real injuries and needed rehabs to Vasquez, Leon, Swihart, Moreland, Hanley, Pedroia, Sandoval, Xander, Betts, Holt, Marco, Nunez, Rutledge, Price, Pom, ERod, Johnson, Elias, Johnson, Ross, Smith, Thornburg, and a slow start due to a flu epidemic, absolutely caused this team to under perform in 2017. Their return in 2018, and probably some significant tinkering with the staff, would put the WS back on the table for 2018. Going over the cap seems a no brainer for a year or two. Getting a big bat also seems a no brainer, and that process is something we can only guess at due to the complexity of finding positions to play it. Hosmer may not be a significant improvement over a healthy, Fenway-adapted Moreland, but that little bump may be enough. JDM at DH and LF, could cause a cascade of moving JBJ at the expense of elite OF defense; or relegating Hanley to a bench role with time at DH and 1B, but not if Hosmer is at 1B nor JDM at DH. I am all in for a healthy and successful 2018, and the addition of a big bat somewhere; and think Porcello and a few others would pay for it. But not Stanton at the expense of our struggling farm PLUS our guys like Beni, Erod PLUS another outrageous salary. I am glad DD and staff will have the nightmare of finding ways to augment this amazing young team without major surgery. Holt and Ross earned less than $2M this year and Reed's pro-rated salary is approximately $2.6M, so these guys free up approximately $6M, add Young, Moreland and Abad and we are up over $20M. But X, Pomeranz, Bradley, Mookie, Kelly, Leon, Vazquez are the most notable arbitration guys. How much of that $20M of salary drop off do you think will be allocated to these arbitration guys? Agreed, moving Porcello is the key to the winter, but I am not optimistic the Sox can move him without eating a portion of his salary.
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Post by voiceofreason on Oct 9, 2017 7:01:30 GMT -5
Porcello is a wild card, is he going to be one of the pitchers that goes up and down from season to season? He could be very good next year. Many pitchers seem to be like that, He did win a CY last year so he has the stuff. Frustrating to have seen so many players take a step back this year, what can we expect in the future? When you look at the upside of a whole team that performs like these guys it is hard to know what to do, who to move. There is a whole outfield and half of an infield that could all be average or all stars next yr.
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Post by southernredsoxality on Oct 9, 2017 8:10:54 GMT -5
-Trade for Justin Bour. -Sign JD Martinez -New manager.
This is very good baseball team in need of some power and a guy who can actually manage, no need to reinvent the wheel. There's also some guys who should have bounce back years like Mookie, Hanley, and (hopefully) Xander. Benintendi should improve in his sophomore season, and having Rafa for a full year will help a lot.
Pedroia Benintendi Mookie JD Rafa Hanley Bour Xander Vazquez
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