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2018-19 Non-Red Sox Offseason Thread
gerry
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Post by gerry on Mar 1, 2019 12:58:57 GMT -5
Your theory is that Manny gave up in 2008 and assaulted the travel manager... because his agent told him that sort of thing will help him get a huge contract? Okay. No my theory is (or at least I think it was - 11 years ago was awhile ago so my memory is fading on this subject) that Manny did not want the Red Sox to pick up the two option years he had. I think Boras had it in Manny's head that he could get $100 million or something like that in free agency. I don't think Boras told Manny to assault the travel manager, no, but I think he made it very clear that it was not in Manny's best interests to have the Red Sox pick up those options. Manny clearly wanted out at that point and basically shot his way out. I also have a theory that Manny was on PEDs at some point that year because he wanted to put up monster numbers, especially after his injury riddled pedestrian performance of 2007 - and you might recall that Manny nearly hit .400 with the Dodgers those last two months. And yeah, my PEDs theory is 110% speculation on my part and could be totally wrong, even though I have my suspicions. m I have a very clear memory of reliable sources being angry at Boras over the course of 2008 for pushing Manny in the wrong directions, including demanding more $$$ or a release. It was at that point, in my memory, that Boras went from pain in the Sox behind to pariah. Most fans (not the talking head class) truly enjoyed Manny’s antics until that exit strategy changed everything. His team mates and coaches had considered him the hardest working member of the Sox, not lazy. His issues were not laziness or even lack of hustle. He compensated for below average defense with intelligent play of the wall and a sneaky good quick release which prevented runners from taking advantage of that below average defense. You can not defend Machado by attacking Manny. Towards the end, Manny messed up big time. Machado sabotaged Pedey’s career, has played dangerously dirty on several occasions, and has defined himself as Mr. Anti-Hustle. Sure the very young and impressionable Padres have Hosmer. But Pedey et al had Cora, Papi, a half dozen guys with Hosmer’s grit, hustle and good work habits (including Manny) and strong clubhouse leadership. As a SD fan, I hope Hosmer has more influence on Machado and team culture than Machado has on those kids, and hope springs eternal. We shall see.
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Post by rjp313jr on Mar 1, 2019 13:19:19 GMT -5
They're not going to give 4/$180 to someone who they think is "the next Sandoval" in the first place, though. Kemp, Sandoval, Ellsbury, too. Individual contracts can go bad, but single bad contracts don't kill teams as long as they're otherwise smart. And if a team thinks Bryce Harper is 4/$180M good in the short term - I mean, that's insane AAV - then it doesn't add up that they're terrified of paying him $25M down the road instead. If you're looking at basically 50% higher than the previous average contract, they're saying "we think Harper is an all-time, elite, Hall of Fame level player." 13/$330 is a way more team-friendly deal than that. It’s quite possible and likely that they think he’s elite right now but not long term and they have money to spend on productive players so they tried to do that in the short term: Harper isn’t exactly the Iron man over here not is his a picture of consistency so I think It makes a lot of sense they wouldn’t want him on the books for 13 years. And going off your logic; you must think it’s crazy Harper didn’t take that.
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Mar 1, 2019 13:30:00 GMT -5
If Harper is worth that monster 13 year deal, that type of player. How don't you take 3 years at 45 million per? He'd be back on the market after his age 28th season. If he has a few monster seasons he'd easily make a lot more. He didn't want to bet on himself and if I'm the Phillies that scares me.
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Post by James Dunne on Mar 1, 2019 14:22:09 GMT -5
If Harper is worth that monster 13 year deal, that type of player. How don't you take 3 years at 45 million per? He'd be back on the market after his age 28th season. If he has a few monster seasons he'd easily make a lot more. He didn't want to bet on himself and if I'm the Phillies that scares me. There's a real chance this is Boras spin going through the usual channels, so take it with a grain of salt... but he apparently made a big deal about not asking for an opt-out, pushing the no-trade clause, and didn't mind keeping his AAV down to be able to recruit other free agents to join him in Philly and let them know he was serious about staying there. Without saying for sure that's the god-honest 100% truth, if you'd told me beforehand that was going to be his negotiating strategy then this is something like the deal I'd have figured he'd end up with. I'd probably have guessed closer to $350, but that's kind of splitting hairs. It does seem pretty clear he'd have been able to get a structure resembling the Machado deal , with the safety of a very long deal along with the opt-out, if that's what he wanted.
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KB24
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Post by KB24 on Mar 5, 2019 13:34:23 GMT -5
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mobaz
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Post by mobaz on Mar 6, 2019 9:57:30 GMT -5
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Post by jimed14 on Mar 6, 2019 10:19:58 GMT -5
Thought it was interesting that fitbit measured that catcher as burning 4349 calories per day and they get a $25 per diem for food.
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Post by 0ap0 on Mar 6, 2019 11:34:59 GMT -5
Thought it was interesting that fitbit measured that catcher as burning 4349 calories per day and they get a $25 per diem for food. I mean, $25 will get you over 85,000 calories worth of crisco from Amazon Fresh, so it's got to be all good, right? (The math is real; the post is a joke; pay the kids.)
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Post by James Dunne on Mar 6, 2019 11:43:54 GMT -5
Thought it was interesting that fitbit measured that catcher as burning 4349 calories per day This is a relatively unimportant aside, but Ivan Rodriguez catching all the games he did in the Arlington, TX heat is really remarkable. He started 557 games as catcher from 1996 to 1999.
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Post by rjp313jr on Mar 6, 2019 11:49:56 GMT -5
Thought it was interesting that fitbit measured that catcher as burning 4349 calories per day This is a relatively unimportant aside, but Ivan Rodriguez catching all the games he did in the Arlington, TX heat is really remarkable. He started 557 games as catcher from 1996 to 1999. Yea I wonder how he body was able to handle that... 💉💉💉
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Post by fenwaythehardway on Mar 6, 2019 11:50:48 GMT -5
Thought it was interesting that fitbit measured that catcher as burning 4349 calories per day and they get a $25 per diem for food. I mean, $25 will get you over 85,000 calories worth of crisco from Amazon Fresh, so it's got to be all good, right? (The math is real; the post is a joke; pay the kids.) Yeah but we're mostly just talking about anonymous minor league filler anyway. Why invest anything in those guys? Not like Max Muncy hit 35 home runs last year or anything. (Also it's very good and cool that at his age, it's likely that Muncy will provide his most valuable years to the richest team in baseball essentially for free.)
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Post by jchang on Mar 6, 2019 12:00:00 GMT -5
Thought it was interesting that fitbit measured that catcher as burning 4349 calories per day and they get a $25 per diem for food. I mean, $25 will get you over 85,000 calories worth of crisco from Amazon Fresh, so it's got to be all good, right? (The math is real; the post is a joke; pay the kids.) It is quite possible to buy sufficient food, quantity and quality, at the supermarket at $25 per day. However, 1) minor league players probably did not go to their team location with a full kitchen equipment set, 2) are not interested cooking for themselves, 3) road games. When I was young working age, I did target moderate priced all-you-can-eat places (and eating for the day in one meal). But, given the importance of nutrition in growing prospects, it might be a good idea for teams to arrange the proper mix of protein, etc. There was a basketball player (with New Orleans?) who had his personal nutritionist, but he had the big contract to afford this.
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Post by fenwaythehardway on Mar 6, 2019 12:00:06 GMT -5
This is a relatively unimportant aside, but Ivan Rodriguez catching all the games he did in the Arlington, TX heat is really remarkable. He started 557 games as catcher from 1996 to 1999. Yea I wonder how he body was able to handle that... 💉💉💉 Yeah man I've been hitting the gym really hard lately so I can, uhh... stand up to that summer heat that's coming.
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Post by rjp313jr on Mar 6, 2019 12:12:34 GMT -5
Yea I wonder how he body was able to handle that... 💉💉💉 Yeah man I've been hitting the gym really hard lately so I can, uhh... stand up to that summer heat that's coming. Right because being in physical shape doesn’t help your body recover from something that’s physically taxing... uhhh oh wait - plus, steroids help the body recover and not wear down over the course of a season.
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mobaz
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Post by mobaz on Mar 6, 2019 13:24:13 GMT -5
I mean, $25 will get you over 85,000 calories worth of crisco from Amazon Fresh, so it's got to be all good, right? (The math is real; the post is a joke; pay the kids.) It is quite possible to buy sufficient food, quantity and quality, at the supermarket at $25 per day. However, 1) minor league players probably did not go to their team location with a full kitchen equipment set, 2) are not interested cooking for themselves, 3) road games. When I was young working age, I did target moderate priced all-you-can-eat places (and eating for the day in one meal). But, given the importance of nutrition in growing prospects, it might be a good idea for teams to arrange the proper mix of protein, etc. There was a basketball player (with New Orleans?) who had his personal nutritionist, but he had the big contract to afford this. They also probably need to pay for things in there life that are not food. Like clothes and housing. And insurance and taxes.
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Post by jimed14 on Mar 6, 2019 13:36:25 GMT -5
I mean, $25 will get you over 85,000 calories worth of crisco from Amazon Fresh, so it's got to be all good, right? (The math is real; the post is a joke; pay the kids.) It is quite possible to buy sufficient food, quantity and quality, at the supermarket at $25 per day. However, 1) minor league players probably did not go to their team location with a full kitchen equipment set, 2) are not interested cooking for themselves, 3) road games. When I was young working age, I did target moderate priced all-you-can-eat places (and eating for the day in one meal). But, given the importance of nutrition in growing prospects, it might be a good idea for teams to arrange the proper mix of protein, etc. There was a basketball player (with New Orleans?) who had his personal nutritionist, but he had the big contract to afford this. It really is unbelievable to me that teams worth billions of dollars force their players to live like this instead of literally handing them a few more crumbs of food for free. Every single minor league player should be able to eat a professional athlete's optimal diet to support their development without additional stress. Bunch of cheap a-holes running baseball, just like every other industry though. Those 7th and 8th catchers are to be treated like human trafficking victims. I'm not sure if it's just fun for them to do that to people or they really are worried about spending an extra thousand a day on food, as if they're stealing gold plated toilets from their great great great grandchildren.
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Post by incandenza on Mar 6, 2019 13:51:30 GMT -5
It is quite possible to buy sufficient food, quantity and quality, at the supermarket at $25 per day. However, 1) minor league players probably did not go to their team location with a full kitchen equipment set, 2) are not interested cooking for themselves, 3) road games. When I was young working age, I did target moderate priced all-you-can-eat places (and eating for the day in one meal). But, given the importance of nutrition in growing prospects, it might be a good idea for teams to arrange the proper mix of protein, etc. There was a basketball player (with New Orleans?) who had his personal nutritionist, but he had the big contract to afford this. It really is unbelievable to me that teams worth billions of dollars force their players to live like this instead of literally handing them a few more crumbs of food for free. Every single minor league player should be able to eat a professional athlete's optimal diet to support their development without additional stress. Bunch of cheap a-holes running baseball, just like every other industry though. Those 7th and 8th catchers are to be treated like human trafficking victims. I'm not sure if it's just fun for them to do that to people or they really are worried about spending an extra thousand a day on food, as if they're stealing gold plated toilets from their great great great grandchildren. Not only is the moral argument blindingly obvious, but it's surely in the best interests of teams to ensure their minor leagues have a healthy diet and are able to cultivate good dietary habits. It would be like a farmer who skimped on fertilizer or something - penny-wise and pound-foolish. It's also amazing to think that minor leaguers are among the few thousand best in the world at what they do, and they live on poverty wages. Not to mention the opportunity cost they pay - while they spend their teens and twenties doing baseball they're missing out on all the other possibilities to develop their other abilities, get an education, etc.
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Post by James Dunne on Mar 7, 2019 16:10:14 GMT -5
Terribly sad news.
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Post by redsox04071318champs on Mar 7, 2019 16:37:32 GMT -5
That's awful. Young Roger Clemens was almost like a Tom Seaver prototype. Same type of pitcher. And in his 3rd season in the majors he won the Cy Young, like Seaver, and led his team to the World Series just like Seaver and the Sox almost won, which would have matched Seaver. And the irony is that Seaver was on that 1986 team. His role in stabilizing that rotation, even at age 42, was understated. They struggled through Jeff Sellers, Rob Woodward, Mike Brown, and some forgettable others - and that doesn't include Al Nipper, who took a regular turn in the rotation despite an ERA of 5.38 when ERAs weren't that high back then. It was a shame Seaver got injured in late Sept and couldn't pitch against the Mets in the World Series. Perhaps the outcome would have been different. Certainly would have been interesting to see him get the ball in relief during Game 7 had he been healthy and McNamara had an innovative bone in his body. What struck me most about Seaver is how Bruce Hurst would gush that he and Clemens were attending the "University of Seaver" when they were teammates. That says it all about him. So sad that he's not doing well.
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Post by redsox04071318champs on Mar 7, 2019 16:41:30 GMT -5
Josh Fields was DFA by the Dodgers. I doubt anybody trades for him at his salary, but he'll be a FA soon. He's become a decent pitcher. Has trouble with the gopher ball, but he's decent. Not saying the Sox shouldn't definitely be all over him, but given what's left on the market and the lack of depth they have they should at least consider it.
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Post by rjp313jr on Mar 7, 2019 16:49:18 GMT -5
Josh Fields was DFA by the Dodgers. I doubt anybody trades for him at his salary, but he'll be a FA soon. He's become a decent pitcher. Has trouble with the gopher ball, but he's decent. Not saying the Sox shouldn't definitely be all over him, but given what's left on the market and the lack of depth they have they should at least consider it. One would have to think the FO doesn’t believe they have a lack of depth.
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Post by bluechip on Mar 7, 2019 23:01:59 GMT -5
I’d take fields.
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Post by vermontsox1 on Mar 19, 2019 9:18:21 GMT -5
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Post by mredsox89 on Mar 19, 2019 9:20:15 GMT -5
Good lord on the Trout contract.
Guess we have a realistic benchmark for Mookie
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Post by jimed14 on Mar 19, 2019 9:25:50 GMT -5
Honestly seems like a bargain compared to Harper, Machado and Stanton.
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