SoxProspects News
|
|
|
|
Legal
Forum Ground Rules
The views expressed by the members of this Forum do not necessarily reflect the views of SoxProspects, LLC.
© 2003-2024 SoxProspects, LLC
|
|
|
|
|
Forum Home | Search | My Profile | Messages | Members | Help |
Welcome Guest. Please Login or Register.
Mid-Season Acquistion Time
|
Post by fenwaythehardway on Aug 1, 2019 9:16:20 GMT -5
It is also driving me a little nuts that people are feeling (per Rob Bradford, apparently) down in the dumps that the Red Sox didn't make a move. They made a move! They got Cashner! That's more than the Yankees did at least. And getting Cashner has allowed Eovaldi to move to the bullpen. That might prove to be the most significant bullpen "addition" any team has made. How much less grief would the Red Sox be getting right now if they'd waited to get Cashner? People would be talking about how they won the deadline. The best relievers who moved were Greene and Dyson, who are both decent, but in terms of overall impact on the staff versus the price paid, would you rather have gotten one of those two instead of Cashner?
|
|
|
Post by pedrofanforever45 on Aug 1, 2019 14:17:39 GMT -5
The 2007 Boston Red Sox spent- 4 million dollars to Joel Pinero 2.5 million dollars to Hideki Okajima 3 million dollars to Mike Timlin 1.6 million dollars to J.C. Romero The 2007 Red Sox spent more money on 41 year old Mike Timlin than the 2019 Boston Red Sox spent on anyone in the entire bullpen in free agency. 13 years later. That's about as sad as it gets folks. Just putting that out there for context. You might have not needed a arm if the Sox spent more than a small market team 10 years ago in this area. 2007 results from that money spent: Joel Pinero - 5.03 ERA, sucked Hideki Okajima - lottery ticket that worked out very well Timlin - 3.42 ERA and was quite Hembree like that year J.C. Romero - so good that they released him That's $11.1M for one good relief pitcher. And for real, actual context that 2007 bullpen was dominated by Papelbon, Delcarmen, Okajima, and Javier Lopez. That's two homegrown guys, one guy they effectively paid a fortune for, and one guy they pulled off the scrap heap. This is not the "throw money at it and all your problems go away" scenario that you're implying it to be. Quite the opposite, actually. You seem to be missing (or just flat out ignoring) the cause-and-effect of this scenario. But keep trying, I know you will. It shows that if you spend money on enough guys or if you target the right guy, you make out awesome. Okajima wasn't just good. That was one of the best free agent reliever signings in Red Sox history. The point is, when you spend this little money on a bullpen, you get what you deserve here with this crappy bullpen. Just watch, the Sox will sign a reliever this off-season. No one will bring how investing on a bullpen arm is a mistake. They will instead like the signing, as if the narrative is completely changed.
|
|
|
Post by danredhawk on Aug 1, 2019 14:31:34 GMT -5
Man, Sam Dyson is freaking nails. The thing I like most about relief pitching is that its so predictable. So, I definitely wish we would have over paid for him just to make a move even though the bigger problem is the consistency of the starting pitching...
#walk #single #double #walk #2runs0outs #blownsave
|
|
|
Post by redsoxfan2 on Aug 1, 2019 14:45:51 GMT -5
Man, Sam Dyson is freaking nails. The thing I like most about relief pitching is that its so predictable. So, I definitely wish we would have over paid for him just to make a move even though the bigger problem is the consistency of the starting pitching... #walk #single #double #walk #2runs0outs #blownsave Would have fit right in.
|
|
gerry
Veteran
Enter your message here...
Posts: 1,678
|
Post by gerry on Aug 1, 2019 14:48:38 GMT -5
The Sox will soon be able to re-acquire Johnson, Brasier and Velasquez. I wonder if a late-2019 Bullpen of Eovaldi, Barnes, Workman, Darwinzon, Taylor, Walden and maybe Brasier, Johnson, Velasquez, Houck, Wright might be considered an asset? It would seem so.
|
|
|
Post by pedrofanforever45 on Aug 1, 2019 14:59:06 GMT -5
It shows that if you spend money on enough guys or if you target the right guy, you make out awesome. Okajima wasn't just good. That was one of the best free agent reliever signings in Red Sox history. The point is, when you spend this little money on a bullpen, you get what you deserve here with this crappy bullpen. Just watch, the Sox will sign a reliever this off-season. No one will bring how investing on a bullpen arm is a mistake. They will instead like the signing, as if the narrative is completely changed. 2 homegrown talents, one reclamation project, and getting it right on 1 of 4 free agent signings...and your takeaway is spend, spend, spend. Not surprised, wouldn't expect anything less from you at this point. I'm going to find Damaineah and have a rational conversation about outfield options. The point is, if you take on enough pieces, you're bound to hit on one or a couple. The proof is in the pudding. The Sox didn't do that. They took one chance on Thornburg and called it a off-season.
|
|
|
Post by redsox04071318champs on Aug 1, 2019 15:05:38 GMT -5
Man, Sam Dyson is freaking nails. The thing I like most about relief pitching is that its so predictable. So, I definitely wish we would have over paid for him just to make a move even though the bigger problem is the consistency of the starting pitching... #walk #single #double #walk #2runs0outs #blownsave So your point is what? That he sucked yesterday or whenever? Then the Red Sox should never pick up a reliever, because, damn the last couple of years worth of track record, he might mess up a game? So what? The Red Sox trade two bad pitchers Al Nipper and Calvin Schiraldi for HOF Lee Smith, and Smith proceeds to blow the first game he pitches in a Red Sox uniform? Should they not have done the deal? Dyson would still have been a good get, bad game aside, if the price was reasonable.
|
|
|
Post by incandenza on Aug 1, 2019 15:19:50 GMT -5
2 homegrown talents, one reclamation project, and getting it right on 1 of 4 free agent signings...and your takeaway is spend, spend, spend. Not surprised, wouldn't expect anything less from you at this point. I'm going to find Damaineah and have a rational conversation about outfield options. The point is, if you take on enough pieces, you're bound to hit on one or a couple. The proof is in the pudding. The Sox didn't do that. They took one chance on Thornburg and called it a off-season. You're kind of amazing. Every single reasonable person: "The way to build a bullpen is to develop homegrown talent and try to find value deals on lower-profile free agents." You: "No you have to spend lots of money to have a good bullpen. Look at 2007." Everybody: "This demonstrates exactly the opposite of what you're saying." You: "Look, the point is if I had been making a totally different argument, I would be right." Anyway, to now take on your new argument... the four free agents combined for 0.7 fWAR (yes, WAR sucks for relievers, whatever). They spent $11 million to get that 0.7 WAR. And you'd have to admit, they had to be pretty lucky to get "one of the best free agent reliever signings in Red Sox history" in that batch. So this is your model for building a bullpen?
|
|
|
Post by danredhawk on Aug 1, 2019 15:44:03 GMT -5
Man, Sam Dyson is freaking nails. The thing I like most about relief pitching is that its so predictable. So, I definitely wish we would have over paid for him just to make a move even though the bigger problem is the consistency of the starting pitching... #walk #single #double #walk #2runs0outs #blownsave So your point is what? That he sucked yesterday or whenever? Then the Red Sox should never pick up a reliever, because, damn the last couple of years worth of track record, he might mess up a game? So what? The Red Sox trade two bad pitchers Al Nipper and Calvin Schiraldi for HOF Lee Smith, and Smith proceeds to blow the first game he pitches in a Red Sox uniform? Should they not have done the deal? Dyson would still have been a good get, bad game aside, if the price was reasonable. He sucked today. As for my point, I thought it was pretty simple. The Red Sox problem this year starts with Sale and Porcello, continues with the Eovaldi injury and extends to the mismash in the fifth starter spot that was so good last year and so bad this year... The bullpen, while low hanging fruit for a few teeth gnashers, is simply not the reason the Sox are struggling in the standings. The starters inept start to the season is what put them in a hole and their inconsistency since is why they’ve had a hard time clawing their way out and what has over exposed the pen... Regardless of what happened at the deadline their chances to make the playoff hinge entirely on the starters pitching like the frontline arms they are. No middle reliever was changing anything in a vacuum and clearly the prices were not found to be reasonable. The rumored prices for front-end bullpen help were ridiculous. I was being sarcastic earlier - the fact is relief pitching IS actually quite unpredictable! A middle reliever (Dyson) pitching will in the NL West is no guarantee of similar results in the AL East - as evidenced by him getting his lunch handed to him today by the Marlins. So, tantrums of certain posters aside, making a move for the sake of making a move regardless of price guaranteed nothing and doing nothing is hardly punting on the season. If they found a reasonable deal they would have made it... Why should the Sox have made what they felt was an unreasonable trade for an unpredictable commodity when it wouldn’t make one iota of difference if the starters don’t do their jobs first and foremost. Additionally, it doesn’t strike me as unreasonable to think things fall into place with the pen if the starters live up to their talent... If people want to rant and rave or fold up shop on the team right now - than at least place the blame where it belongs to date...
|
|
|
Post by incandenza on Aug 1, 2019 16:20:56 GMT -5
The point is, if you take on enough pieces, you're bound to hit on one or a couple. The proof is in the pudding. The Sox didn't do that. They took one chance on Thornburg and called it a off-season. Below is every top 50 relief pitcher (unless I missed one) from last season along with their contract and a very high level view of their performance - Craig Kimbrel 3/$43M, has sucked this year - Jeurys Familia 3/$33M, has sucked this year - Zach Britton 3/$39M, has been awesome - David Robertson 3/$33M, has sucked this year - Adam Ottavino 3/$27M, has been awesome - Andrew Miller 2/$25M, bad this year (WAR of 0.2) - Joe Kelly 3/$25M, sucked this year - Kelvin Herrera 2/$18M, sucked this year - Joakim Soria 2/$15M, sucked this year - Bud Norris (minor league deal) bad this year (WAR of 0.0) - Brad Brach 1/$4.25M, sucked this year If the Red Sox had acquired every single top 50 reliever available then they would have paid ~$252M to get exactly two relievers that would have provided any benefit of any kind to the current bullpen. If you're interested in a little dose of reality (you're not but play along) one of Britton and Ottavino was guaranteed to go to the Yankees and it was always the most likely scenario that they acquire both. This is also the thing that happened so again, if you're interested in reality, there was literally no realistic name you can bring up that the Sox should have acquired in free agency to make the bullpen better. Ha. This is an incredible list of failure. It really should end this argument - e ven in retrospect there's no case to be made that the Sox could have improved their bullpen by spending on free agents. (Also, Yankee black magic is super annoying. What are the odds that the only two guys from this list who haven't spit the bit would be the two that signed with them?)
|
|
|
Post by jimed14 on Aug 1, 2019 16:25:58 GMT -5
Below is every top 50 relief pitcher (unless I missed one) from last season along with their contract and a very high level view of their performance - Craig Kimbrel 3/$43M, has sucked this year - Jeurys Familia 3/$33M, has sucked this year - Zach Britton 3/$39M, has been awesome - David Robertson 3/$33M, has sucked this year - Adam Ottavino 3/$27M, has been awesome - Andrew Miller 2/$25M, bad this year (WAR of 0.2) - Joe Kelly 3/$25M, sucked this year - Kelvin Herrera 2/$18M, sucked this year - Joakim Soria 2/$15M, sucked this year - Bud Norris (minor league deal) bad this year (WAR of 0.0) - Brad Brach 1/$4.25M, sucked this year If the Red Sox had acquired every single top 50 reliever available then they would have paid ~$252M to get exactly two relievers that would have provided any benefit of any kind to the current bullpen. If you're interested in a little dose of reality (you're not but play along) one of Britton and Ottavino was guaranteed to go to the Yankees and it was always the most likely scenario that they acquire both. This is also the thing that happened so again, if you're interested in reality, there was literally no realistic name you can bring up that the Sox should have acquired in free agency to make the bullpen better. Ha. This is an incredible list of failure. It really should end this argument - e ven in retrospect there's no case to be made that the Sox could have improved their bullpen by spending on free agents. (Also, Yankee black magic is super annoying. What are the odds that the only two guys from this list who haven't spit the bit would be the two that signed with them?) They should trade JBJ for a marginal upgrade over their 11th best relief pitcher. demainah has a new pal on the board.
|
|
|
Post by jimed14 on Aug 1, 2019 16:31:37 GMT -5
Oh it's clinical.
|
|
|
Post by redsoxfan2 on Aug 1, 2019 17:42:47 GMT -5
Below is every top 50 relief pitcher (unless I missed one) from last season along with their contract and a very high level view of their performance - Craig Kimbrel 3/$43M, has sucked this year - Jeurys Familia 3/$33M, has sucked this year - Zach Britton 3/$39M, has been awesome - David Robertson 3/$33M, has sucked this year - Adam Ottavino 3/$27M, has been awesome - Andrew Miller 2/$25M, bad this year (WAR of 0.2) - Joe Kelly 3/$25M, sucked this year - Kelvin Herrera 2/$18M, sucked this year - Joakim Soria 2/$15M, sucked this year - Bud Norris (minor league deal) bad this year (WAR of 0.0) - Brad Brach 1/$4.25M, sucked this year If the Red Sox had acquired every single top 50 reliever available then they would have paid ~$252M to get exactly two relievers that would have provided any benefit of any kind to the current bullpen. If you're interested in a little dose of reality (you're not but play along) one of Britton and Ottavino was guaranteed to go to the Yankees and it was always the most likely scenario that they acquire both. This is also the thing that happened so again, if you're interested in reality, there was literally no realistic name you can bring up that the Sox should have acquired in free agency to make the bullpen better. Ha. This is an incredible list of failure. It really should end this argument - e ven in retrospect there's no case to be made that the Sox could have improved their bullpen by spending on free agents. (Also, Yankee black magic is super annoying. What are the odds that the only two guys from this list who haven't spit the bit would be the two that signed with them?) Couple of things, and just quoting this to encapsulate everything. There are still some successes on that list. The one I wanted was Ottavino, but believe me, usually I'm the one that wants the wrong guy so I'm just chest thumping a bit. With that said, I'm sure Sam Dyson will be fine. I'm sure some of the guys who got traded will be fine. The trouble in trading or acquiring bullpen arms is that their sample sizes are so small and the volatility is high. As far as JBJ is concerned, he's a 1 (in fact, he's 0.9) WAR player whose value is mostly tied to his defense. He's a glorified 4OFer. I'm not sure what reliever you could get for that, but I'm sure someone with a solid track record. They could move Mookie or Benintendi to CF and can use their prospects to get an equivalent (0.9 WAR) LFer, CFer, or RFer. They didn't want to do any of that because they're near the tax and out of the division. Edit: Forgot to mention I'd give Kimbrel a break. This is what happens when you miss half the season, including Spring Training.
|
|
|
Post by redsox04071318champs on Aug 1, 2019 18:09:21 GMT -5
So your point is what? That he sucked yesterday or whenever? Then the Red Sox should never pick up a reliever, because, damn the last couple of years worth of track record, he might mess up a game? So what? The Red Sox trade two bad pitchers Al Nipper and Calvin Schiraldi for HOF Lee Smith, and Smith proceeds to blow the first game he pitches in a Red Sox uniform? Should they not have done the deal? Dyson would still have been a good get, bad game aside, if the price was reasonable. He sucked today. As for my point, I thought it was pretty simple. The Red Sox problem this year starts with Sale and Porcello, continues with the Eovaldi injury and extends to the mismash in the fifth starter spot that was so good last year and so bad this year... The bullpen, while low hanging fruit for a few teeth gnashers, is simply not the reason the Sox are struggling in the standings. The starters inept start to the season is what put them in a hole and their inconsistency since is why they’ve had a hard time clawing their way out and what has over exposed the pen... Regardless of what happened at the deadline their chances to make the playoff hinge entirely on the starters pitching like the frontline arms they are. No middle reliever was changing anything in a vacuum and clearly the prices were not found to be reasonable. The rumored prices for front-end bullpen help were ridiculous. I was being sarcastic earlier - the fact is relief pitching IS actually quite unpredictable! A middle reliever (Dyson) pitching will in the NL West is no guarantee of similar results in the AL East - as evidenced by him getting his lunch handed to him today by the Marlins. So, tantrums of certain posters aside, making a move for the sake of making a move regardless of price guaranteed nothing and doing nothing is hardly punting on the season. If they found a reasonable deal they would have made it... Why should the Sox have made what they felt was an unreasonable trade for an unpredictable commodity when it wouldn’t make one iota of difference if the starters don’t do their jobs first and foremost. Additionally, it doesn’t strike me as unreasonable to think things fall into place with the pen if the starters live up to their talent... If people want to rant and rave or fold up shop on the team right now - than at least place the blame where it belongs to date... Look, I get that if the rotation continues to suck it doesn't matter what the bullpen does. That's obvious. But if you think the Sox have a shot to win then you have to think that at some point Sale figures things out better and Price pitches better, and Porcello....well never mind. Cora said they spotted a mechanical flaw as far as Sale goes - does that fix him? Who knows? This is what I do know: Unless they emptied out their farm system they weren't going to get a starter. They weren't going to get Greinke. They don't have the $ room or the prospects Houston has. So no, they cannot improve their rotation realistically until Porcello's contract is up, beyond the Cashner deal they already made. However, they could have tried to improve their pen. Maybe it wouldn't have worked. Maybe you give up a few Alex Scherff/Travis Lakins types that are question marks for relievers that aren't closers. I think Dyson would have been the best option given that he's not going to fetch what a name like Edwin Diaz or Giles (if healthy) would fetch. He wouldn't have gotten them over the upper limit, and he had a track record of being good. He had one rotten year, a few years ago, has been good recently - until today anyways - I mean honestly, what did the Twins give up that they're going to miss? The Sox might have been able to match or beat that offer without giving up anybody of real consequence. Who really knows? And Dyson has closer experience. I remember loving the Koji acquisition, not because I said - yup there's our closer, but because I knew he had a track record of being a good reliever. Not saying Dyson is in Koji's league - he's not, but he had a good track record, and was kind of under the radar. I was hoping they'd find an under the radar guy given that they weren't going to get Diaz (who is a mess right now), Giles (injured), Velazquez and Smith (too costly to the farm system), Melancon (great under the radar option but would shove them way over the limit)
|
|
|
Post by pedrofanforever45 on Aug 1, 2019 18:21:24 GMT -5
Ha. This is an incredible list of failure. It really should end this argument - e ven in retrospect there's no case to be made that the Sox could have improved their bullpen by spending on free agents. (Also, Yankee black magic is super annoying. What are the odds that the only two guys from this list who haven't spit the bit would be the two that signed with them?) This is the point where we find out if Pedrofan's refusal to acknowledge reality is quirky or clinical. It's not the reality. What about Hudson who has been worth the contract? What about Holland? THE SOX DIDN'T EVEN NEED TO TARGET THE BIG ARMS AND THEY WOULD HAVE BEEN BETTER OFF? GET IT?
|
|
|
Post by pedrofanforever45 on Aug 1, 2019 18:21:50 GMT -5
GO RED SOX!!! EVERYTHING THEY DO IS RIGHT!!!
|
|
|
Post by pedrofanforever45 on Aug 1, 2019 18:27:43 GMT -5
The point is, if you take on enough pieces, you're bound to hit on one or a couple. The proof is in the pudding. The Sox didn't do that. They took one chance on Thornburg and called it a off-season. You're kind of amazing. Every single reasonable person: "The way to build a bullpen is to develop homegrown talent and try to find value deals on lower-profile free agents." You: "No you have to spend lots of money to have a good bullpen. Look at 2007." Everybody: "This demonstrates exactly the opposite of what you're saying." You: "Look, the point is if I had been making a totally different argument, I would be right." Anyway, to now take on your new argument... the four free agents combined for 0.7 fWAR (yes, WAR sucks for relievers, whatever). They spent $11 million to get that 0.7 WAR. And you'd have to admit, they had to be pretty lucky to get "one of the best free agent reliever signings in Red Sox history" in that batch. So this is your model for building a bullpen? YOU NEED TO DEVELOP BOTH ARMS AND SPEND MONEY ON MULTIPLE ARMS TO BUILD DEPTH. ESPECIALLY IF YOU'RE THE RED SOX. I CAN'T BELIEVE THIS IS EVEN A CONVERSATION. 11 million dollars? That sounds like cherry picking Okajima out of the picture and also sounds like it's a win for 11 million dollars, which *isn't* bad.
|
|
|
Post by redsoxfan2 on Aug 1, 2019 18:29:35 GMT -5
You're kind of amazing. Every single reasonable person: "The way to build a bullpen is to develop homegrown talent and try to find value deals on lower-profile free agents." You: "No you have to spend lots of money to have a good bullpen. Look at 2007." Everybody: "This demonstrates exactly the opposite of what you're saying." You: "Look, the point is if I had been making a totally different argument, I would be right." Anyway, to now take on your new argument... the four free agents combined for 0.7 fWAR (yes, WAR sucks for relievers, whatever). They spent $11 million to get that 0.7 WAR. And you'd have to admit, they had to be pretty lucky to get "one of the best free agent reliever signings in Red Sox history" in that batch. So this is your model for building a bullpen? YOU NEED TO DEVELOP BOTH ARMS AND SPEND MONEY ON MULTIPLE ARMS TO BUILD DEPTH. ESPECIALLY IF YOU'RE THE RED SOX. 11 million dollars? That sounds like cherry picking Okajima out of the picture and also sounds like it's a win for 11 million dollars, which *isn't* bad. WHY ARE WE YELLING?
|
|
|
Post by redsoxfan2 on Aug 1, 2019 19:04:11 GMT -5
YOU NEED TO DEVELOP BOTH ARMS AND SPEND MONEY ON MULTIPLE ARMS TO BUILD DEPTH. ESPECIALLY IF YOU'RE THE RED SOX. I CAN'T BELIEVE THIS IS EVEN A CONVERSATION. Oh great, another abstract statement that doesn't have anything to do with reality. Clinical it is.... There's a fair point in there. Would $11 million for Okajima that year be worth it? Bring in 10 guys and if 1 works it pays for itself.
|
|
|
Post by danredhawk on Aug 1, 2019 19:08:30 GMT -5
He sucked today. As for my point, I thought it was pretty simple. The Red Sox problem this year starts with Sale and Porcello, continues with the Eovaldi injury and extends to the mismash in the fifth starter spot that was so good last year and so bad this year... The bullpen, while low hanging fruit for a few teeth gnashers, is simply not the reason the Sox are struggling in the standings. The starters inept start to the season is what put them in a hole and their inconsistency since is why they’ve had a hard time clawing their way out and what has over exposed the pen... Regardless of what happened at the deadline their chances to make the playoff hinge entirely on the starters pitching like the frontline arms they are. No middle reliever was changing anything in a vacuum and clearly the prices were not found to be reasonable. The rumored prices for front-end bullpen help were ridiculous. I was being sarcastic earlier - the fact is relief pitching IS actually quite unpredictable! A middle reliever (Dyson) pitching will in the NL West is no guarantee of similar results in the AL East - as evidenced by him getting his lunch handed to him today by the Marlins. So, tantrums of certain posters aside, making a move for the sake of making a move regardless of price guaranteed nothing and doing nothing is hardly punting on the season. If they found a reasonable deal they would have made it... Why should the Sox have made what they felt was an unreasonable trade for an unpredictable commodity when it wouldn’t make one iota of difference if the starters don’t do their jobs first and foremost. Additionally, it doesn’t strike me as unreasonable to think things fall into place with the pen if the starters live up to their talent... If people want to rant and rave or fold up shop on the team right now - than at least place the blame where it belongs to date... The Sox might have been able to match or beat that offer without giving up anybody <b>Who really knows?</b> Look, I know that you’re always looking for ways the Sox can get marginally better or even one strikeout better over the course of the season. And I agree in the abstract. But that’s not really how this works, because so much is unpredictable and unknown... Your last two posts boil down two a couple of phrases... In your first post - “if the price was reasonable” and the bolded above in your second. We really have no idea what was discussed, who the Giants would want from Boston, how it compares to what the Twins offered or why they valued what the Twins offered. And we have no idea at the time how any of the pieces moved will perform down the stretch (Eric Gagne, anyone?). Last year people were screaming for Herrara - he was the perfect fit! You set your trade deadline agenda, you hear out all the deals and if there are no good deals to make or you don’t win any auctions than such is life... Now, reasonable minds can disagree and debate what may have happened or what they wished had happened all they want. I’ll be honest, and no offense intended, it just doesn’t interest me at all to debate the semantics and hypotheticals of marginal bullpen improvements that didn’t happen. I’m sure a lot of people would love to have that discussion, though - the problem is someone else is dominating the thread as if he is certain of what did happen and what could have happened and exactly what it all means. I’d imagine that is where the pushback from many posters is coming from - along with a complete unwillingness to listen, consider or accept alternative ideas or realities. I’m certain that’s why I mocked Dyson’s performance today... I’m sure there are a number of posters who would have loved to make the right deal for the pen. I doubt it didn’t happen because they refused to try. The Sox should not have been willing to pay ANY price for relief nor should they desperately view ANY option as a must have upgrade. Dombrowski has done very well keeping prospects he likes - so if he didn’t want to let with certain players perhaps it’s good that he didn’t. I’m sure he would have happily made a good or fair deal... It just didn’t happen, no reason for anyone to go off the deep end...again...
|
|
|
Post by jimed14 on Aug 1, 2019 19:29:25 GMT -5
YOU NEED TO DEVELOP BOTH ARMS AND SPEND MONEY ON MULTIPLE ARMS TO BUILD DEPTH. ESPECIALLY IF YOU'RE THE RED SOX. 11 million dollars? That sounds like cherry picking Okajima out of the picture and also sounds like it's a win for 11 million dollars, which *isn't* bad. WHY ARE WE YELLING? Because he has lost his mind.
|
|
|
Post by fenwaythehardway on Aug 1, 2019 20:20:44 GMT -5
Because he has lost his mind. The funny thing is I basically agree that the Red Sox should have added another reliever, but I dunno, I can just give them a C+/B- for their trade season and move on with my life.
|
|
|
Post by pedrofanforever45 on Aug 1, 2019 20:28:24 GMT -5
It's not the reality. What about Hudson who has been worth the contract? What about Holland? THE SOX DIDN'T EVEN NEED TO TARGET THE BIG ARMS AND THEY WOULD HAVE BEEN BETTER OFF? GET IT? You expected DD to go after Daniel Hudson with the expectation that he'd be a legit contributor while also having to DFA either Workman or Hembree in the process? You and God were the only two that saw that coming. Greg Holland - $3.25M and a 4.54 ERA In this bullsh*t exercise in revisionist history where you get to cherry pick two names out of 100 to prove your point and you still can't pick a decent reliever? Hilarious. I expected DD to get someone and not rely on Darwinzon Hernandez in his 3rd game in a row in high leverage. That would be more ideal. Ohh Holland isn't very good, but you know who he's better than this year? Steve Pearce. Took all of 5 minutes for Sam Travis to replace him. Called that one in the off-season and called that crap when it came out too. There was a million directions DD could have gone. How about beating the White Sox offer for Alex Colome? How about taking on a reliever contract? Try something other than you know, spending money on a guy who just had TOS in Tyler Thornburg.
|
|
|
Post by beavertontim on Aug 1, 2019 20:52:29 GMT -5
You would think that this GM was a rookie with no track record. Sure he has made a few mistakes. What GM has not. The bullpen is tired because our starters have underperformed. On paper we had starters 7 deep heading into the season. A Healthy Eovaldi, a Sale pitching to his historic average, and a Price pitching to his historic average and this team is competing with the Yankees for the division lead with the same bullpen.
|
|
|
Post by redsoxfan2 on Aug 1, 2019 20:54:51 GMT -5
If Dombrowski didn't believe in this team like he sounds like, why didn't he sell? Just in case? If people were calling on Taylor, Barnes, Workman they should have moved them.
|
|
|