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7/30-8/1 Red Sox vs. Rays Series Thread
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Post by pedrofanforever45 on Aug 1, 2019 23:41:26 GMT -5
Nope. The Sox had a 5 percent chance of coming back 3-0 in 2004 too. The farm system stinks. It's going to get retooled in 2 years anyways. The Sox are stuck in the f-ing middle if they don't make the playoffs this year, which is disastrous for any sports team. So we should go for broke on a 5% bet, but the Sox are headed for disaster in 2020 and beyond so we shouldn't even worry about the future at all. Got it. Get ready for the Mookie Betts trade rumors. This team is about to get less talented in a quick hurry. The team that can't break payroll for a reliever, isn't going to make the biggest offer for Mookie Betts. If Mookie stays, he's going to have to take less and he's going to have to take the offer they give him this off-season, or bye bye Mookie. Add- The Sox most exciting thing they did this trade deadline was listen to what players they could get for Mookie this off-season.
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Post by redsoxfan2 on Aug 1, 2019 23:48:07 GMT -5
So we should go for broke on a 5% bet, but the Sox are headed for disaster in 2020 and beyond so we shouldn't even worry about the future at all. Got it. Get ready for the Mookie Betts trade rumors. This team is about to get less talented in a quick hurry. The team that can't break payroll for a reliever, isn't going to make the biggest offer for Mookie Betts. If Mookie stays, he's going to have to take less and he's going to have to take the offer they give him this off-season, or bye bye Mookie. So, do you just think the Red Sox are the Rays now...? They wanted to go under the luxury tax for 1 year to reset the penalties after going over the last few years. This means they might go back over. Again, they're the highest paid team in baseball up against it. If Mookie is traded, that's over 20 million in freed space. They'll spend it to at least near the luxury tax. The Red Sox should trade Mookie if they can't re-sign him, but something tells me he's the number 1 priority. Both sides have a number and both sides are waiting to see how he performs and what the market dictates.
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Post by pedrofanforever45 on Aug 2, 2019 0:19:51 GMT -5
Get ready for the Mookie Betts trade rumors. This team is about to get less talented in a quick hurry. The team that can't break payroll for a reliever, isn't going to make the biggest offer for Mookie Betts. If Mookie stays, he's going to have to take less and he's going to have to take the offer they give him this off-season, or bye bye Mookie. So, do you just think the Red Sox are the Rays now...? They wanted to go under the luxury tax for 1 year to reset the penalties after going over the last few years. This means they might go back over. Again, they're the highest paid team in baseball up against it. If Mookie is traded, that's over 20 million in freed space. They'll spend it to at least near the luxury tax. The Red Sox should trade Mookie if they can't re-sign him, but something tells me he's the number 1 priority. Both sides have a number and both sides are waiting to see how he performs and what the market dictates. John Henry has limits on everything. Payroll. Contracts. Everything. I have no doubts the Sox aren't afraid to trade Mookie Betts if they are uncomfortable with what he's demanding, or they wouldn't be listening to offers in the first place.
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danr
Veteran
Posts: 1,871
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Post by danr on Aug 2, 2019 0:28:51 GMT -5
The Red Sox lead the majors in runs scored. If the pitching had been reasonably strong, the Sox would be in first place.
It was not hard to see that the Sox had taken a big risk in the off season by not strengthening the bullpen. What almost none of us expected was that the starting pitching would turn out to be so bad. That is the primary reason the Sox are having the season they are. I don't think that can be blamed on anyone. No one anticipated that Sale and Porcello would suck the way they have. Everone thought Eovaldi would be a major contributor. Price has been very good at times but not all the time.
Porcello is gone after this year. We don't yet know if Eovaldi is going to be a major contributor. Since there are no starting pitchers in the minors of great caliber close to the majors, the Sox have a huge problem. They have to rebuild most of the entire pitching staff, both starters and relievers, but especially starters. I don't know how that can be accomplished in the next year. We may be facing a couple more seasons of less than championship baseball.
For that not to be the case, the Sox have to retain their star players and acquire by trade, or FA signings, some significantly better pitchers than they have now. Fortunately, they will have salary relief in the next year with Porcello gone and the fst guy off the books. That's bout $40 million right there. They also will have some other players departing, providing more salary relief.
They have to resign Betts, but he already is art $20 million so whatever increase they have to package will not significantly impact available funds. I don't think they have to spend any money on additional position players. Chavis, Holt, or Marco Hernandez can play 2nd. Chavis or Sam Travis can play first. So almost all of their available funds can be spent on pitching, either pitchers they acquire by trade, or by FA signings. That's where they should focus.
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Post by hammerhead on Aug 2, 2019 1:59:05 GMT -5
They're playing like they've had some huge mentally damaging, drop of confidence... Almost like their bosses stopped fighting the war. Hey this red sox season is like the Vietnam war. Lack of Government and public support is undermining the soldiers on the field. Well good news - we're playing the Yankees next and they did less at the deadline than we did! I'm sure they're all very sad. I'd imagine Aaron Judge is bent over at his locker, gazing at his locket portrait of Brian Cashman and wondering how he could have betrayed him so. Gary Sanchez has his arms crossed and is refusing to come out of the dugout. Dj LeMahieu sheds a single tear. I like to think our team should be held to a higher standard. They also have the confidence of an insurmountable division lead as is evident by their record. Not to mention, Cashman's an idiot and if they can't get passed Houston he should be fired. He's used to choking away a season, so him choking at the deadline is typical. I'm sure they're players are pissed.
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Post by hammerhead on Aug 2, 2019 2:10:14 GMT -5
Nope. The Sox had a 5 percent chance of coming back 3-0 in 2004 too. The farm system stinks. It's going to get retooled in 2 years anyways. The Sox are stuck in the f-ing middle if they don't make the playoffs this year, which is disastrous for any sports team. So we should go for broke on a 5% bet, but the Sox are headed for disaster in 2020 and beyond so we shouldn't even worry about the future at all. Got it. The fact that they're losing is only undermining your point. If they had just taken two off three you could say "look they're fine."
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Post by pedrofanforever45 on Aug 2, 2019 3:52:24 GMT -5
Yeah, just realized in today's game that this season has been one of the worsts as a Sox fan, right after one of the best seasons in 2018. Just to wrap things up-
-You started a 31 year old journeyman starting pitcher versus a young phenom for the Rays (no wonder why that didn't start well). -You told a kid to do something he's never done before in Darwinzon (pitch 3 games in a row), for no other reason than, you had no choice and you needed him to get a LHB in the crucial part of a game. Feel bad for the kid, hope it doesn't kill his confidence or his ability to keep throwing strikes out of the bullpen. -You keep putting in a AAAA pitcher in Brewer who doesn't belong here, because there weren't many options left and you basically had to when you were behind. He'll be on the roster tomorrow because you have no one better until Brian Johnson arrives. He's been on the roster for basically the whole year. -You pitched a hurt reliever on back to back nights in Hembree, and you haven't put him in the IL, even though you know something is wrong. -You got swept by the one team you had to beat. -The worst part is your front office quit on this team. -They played catch up all year, didn't take spring training seriously. The starting rotation has underperformed. The bullpen has minimal talent. The lineup can't figure out how to get a guy home from 3rd with less than 2 outs. Ohh and the defense and sloppy baserunning pops up every now and again.
Am I missing anything? Yeah, I'm probably going to take a week off of talking baseball. I'm not going to keep worrying about the Sox dumb problems. This was all self inflicted wounds from the Sox. I'll watch and listen to this burn to the ground with my popcorn in hand. Definitely reminded me of the times before 2004. Can't turn away because I don't watch anything else on TV, until football and basketball are on. So here's to it!!
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Post by pedrofanforever45 on Aug 2, 2019 4:11:59 GMT -5
They're playing like they've had some huge mentally damaging, drop of confidence... Almost like their bosses stopped fighting the war. Hey this red sox season is like the Vietnam war. Lack of Government and public support is undermining the soldiers on the field. Well good news - we're playing the Yankees next and they did less at the deadline than we did! I'm sure they're all very sad. I'd imagine Aaron Judge is bent over at his locker, gazing at his locket portrait of Brian Cashman and wondering how he could have betrayed him so. Gary Sanchez has his arms crossed and is refusing to come out of the dugout. Dj LeMahieu sheds a single tear. It will be fun watching the Yankees lose in the playoffs. The only prize to a lost year.
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Post by tomhouse on Aug 2, 2019 5:25:27 GMT -5
Patriots preseason opener is 8/8.
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Post by philsbosoxfan on Aug 2, 2019 6:00:09 GMT -5
I'm happy with the prospect development. Being a Red Sox fan is a marathon not a race. It'll be a while before anybody catches us for team of the millennium.
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Post by redsoxfan2 on Aug 2, 2019 7:46:28 GMT -5
So, do you just think the Red Sox are the Rays now...? They wanted to go under the luxury tax for 1 year to reset the penalties after going over the last few years. This means they might go back over. Again, they're the highest paid team in baseball up against it. If Mookie is traded, that's over 20 million in freed space. They'll spend it to at least near the luxury tax. The Red Sox should trade Mookie if they can't re-sign him, but something tells me he's the number 1 priority. Both sides have a number and both sides are waiting to see how he performs and what the market dictates. John Henry has limits on everything. Payroll. Contracts. Everything. I have no doubts the Sox aren't afraid to trade Mookie Betts if they are uncomfortable with what he's demanding, or they wouldn't be listening to offers in the first place. Which my stance has been, you better not get outbid for him. If you know there's a real possibility he walks, trade him. After these last 4 games you have to come down a bit on the lack of a reliever trade. They didn't lose these because of the bullpen and now they're: 10.5 behind NYY 5.0 behind CLE 3.5 behind TB 0.5 behind OAK for 1st loser There's only 52 games remaining in the schedule. I also don't suspect that the Yankees are going to roll over for a 2nd straight series so that'll drop them farther. It's very bleak.
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Post by redsoxfan2 on Aug 2, 2019 8:06:36 GMT -5
Can someone explain to me what Sandy Leon offers and why he needed to stay here?
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Post by sarasoxer on Aug 2, 2019 9:01:57 GMT -5
If we can only get Wright back..... I'd rather have two Wongs than a Wright Both of them are doing well in the minors but they are pretty far away...
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Post by dmaineah on Aug 2, 2019 9:13:18 GMT -5
Can someone explain to me what Sandy Leon offers and why he needed to stay here? For all the same reasons JBJ is still here.
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bosox
Veteran
Posts: 2,117
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Post by bosox on Aug 2, 2019 9:22:08 GMT -5
Yeah, just realized in today's game that this season has been one of the worsts as a Sox fan, right after one of the best seasons in 2018. Just to wrap things up- -You started a 31 year old journeyman starting pitcher versus a young phenom for the Rays (no wonder why that didn't start well). -You told a kid to do something he's never done before in Darwinzon (pitch 3 games in a row), for no other reason than, you had no choice and you needed him to get a LHB in the crucial part of a game. Feel bad for the kid, hope it doesn't kill his confidence or his ability to keep throwing strikes out of the bullpen. -You keep putting in a AAAA pitcher in Brewer who doesn't belong here, because there weren't many options left and you basically had to when you were behind. He'll be on the roster tomorrow because you have no one better until Brian Johnson arrives. He's been on the roster for basically the whole year. -You pitched a hurt reliever on back to back nights in Hembree, and you haven't put him in the IL, even though you know something is wrong. -You got swept by the one team you had to beat. -The worst part is your front office quit on this team. -They played catch up all year, didn't take spring training seriously. The starting rotation has underperformed. The bullpen has minimal talent. The lineup can't figure out how to get a guy home from 3rd with less than 2 outs. Ohh and the defense and sloppy baserunning pops up every now and again. Am I missing anything? Yeah, I'm probably going to take a week off of talking baseball. I'm not going to keep worrying about the Sox dumb problems. This was all self inflicted wounds from the Sox. I'll watch and listen to this burn to the ground with my popcorn in hand. Definitely reminded me of the times before 2004. Can't turn away because I don't watch anything else on TV, until football and basketball are on. So here's to it!! For me, the worst season was probably the 2011 collapse. The 2018 was a season for the ages. It's one a fan hopes for with just about everything going right. Winning two out of three games and the two-out scoring was incredible. The frustration of this season is the inconsistency in all areas. This team has more than enough talent to make the playoffs. They just haven't been getting it done. While I think the bullpen needed improvements, the starting pitching should be getting into the sixth inning which would have alleviated some of the pen issues. Sale and Price should be lights out or at least going deep into games and that's why they are making the big money. Devers has been a pleasure to watch mature this year. So much so, that you have that Papi feeling that he will come through every time in clutch situations. Bogey has emerged as a leader and what I've enjoyed the most is his performance after he's signed the big deal. Often, you see players struggle after signing a big deal but he's taken off. I worry about JD and Mookie. JD, last year and with Detroit, seemed like its was hard for pitchers to have a plan of attack against him because he covered the entire plate. This year he doesn't look as invincible and pitchers are attacking him with breaking pitches to the outside and in some cases down. Has hit bat speed slowed down so he's deciding sooner and not being able to lay off those breaking pitches?? Not sure what is going on with him. Is it the back issues he has been dealing with or is it the lack of access to his personal hitting coach as has been mentioned? Mookie has been running hot and cold this year as well. It will be interesting to see what next year brings from him with a contract year on the line. I try to watch every game but this year may allow me a month or more to get some projects done around the house ....which my wife will appreciate. Who knows, maybe the Sox will finally go on a winning streak that has alluded them all year and they can claim a wild card spot for an all or nothing game.
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Post by sarasoxer on Aug 2, 2019 9:34:47 GMT -5
Can someone explain to me what Sandy Leon offers and why he needed to stay here? For all the same reasons JBJ is still here. I feel badly for JBJ. I think after another poor season and the Sox demise, change will be at the forefront..and accepted by the fans. JBJ will be a casualty. I will feel badly for him because he is a very serious guy intent on playing well. Still there is something amiss with a guy with great hand/eye catching baseballs on the run and dive but can't match bat to ball. Given some hot streaks added in, the issue must be timing or mechanical...in addition to a curious determination to continually hit into shifts. JBJ, you are not Papi.
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ianrs
Veteran
Posts: 2,418
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Post by ianrs on Aug 2, 2019 9:53:02 GMT -5
JBJ is a big reason we won the ALCS last year, lest we forget.
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Post by redsox04071318champs on Aug 2, 2019 10:00:03 GMT -5
Yeah, just realized in today's game that this season has been one of the worsts as a Sox fan, right after one of the best seasons in 2018. Just to wrap things up- -You started a 31 year old journeyman starting pitcher versus a young phenom for the Rays (no wonder why that didn't start well). -You told a kid to do something he's never done before in Darwinzon (pitch 3 games in a row), for no other reason than, you had no choice and you needed him to get a LHB in the crucial part of a game. Feel bad for the kid, hope it doesn't kill his confidence or his ability to keep throwing strikes out of the bullpen. -You keep putting in a AAAA pitcher in Brewer who doesn't belong here, because there weren't many options left and you basically had to when you were behind. He'll be on the roster tomorrow because you have no one better until Brian Johnson arrives. He's been on the roster for basically the whole year. -You pitched a hurt reliever on back to back nights in Hembree, and you haven't put him in the IL, even though you know something is wrong. -You got swept by the one team you had to beat. -The worst part is your front office quit on this team. -They played catch up all year, didn't take spring training seriously. The starting rotation has underperformed. The bullpen has minimal talent. The lineup can't figure out how to get a guy home from 3rd with less than 2 outs. Ohh and the defense and sloppy baserunning pops up every now and again. Am I missing anything? Yeah, I'm probably going to take a week off of talking baseball. I'm not going to keep worrying about the Sox dumb problems. This was all self inflicted wounds from the Sox. I'll watch and listen to this burn to the ground with my popcorn in hand. Definitely reminded me of the times before 2004. Can't turn away because I don't watch anything else on TV, until football and basketball are on. So here's to it!! Pedro, this season has been awfully disappointing, but I think we knew the law of averages would probably hit back with a vengeance. As disappointing as this season has been, I don't think it even makes my Top 10 of "worst seasons" - well unless the Yankees win the World Series. I'm old enough to remember the Butch Hobson era, and there are others here old enough to remember the beginning of the Yaz era when the Sox were extremely awful for about eight years - I believe the Sox had a sub-.500 team from 1959 - 1966. And in your case, I can't see how 2012 wouldn't be worse, especially coming off the heels of 2011's collapse. And 2014 was pretty awful - another case of the law of averages hitting back with a vengeance. I'm just glad that the law of averages waited until AFTER the World Series to hit back with a vengeance. Would have been so much worse if it had occurred before the Sox won. If the Sox are going to win the World Series every five years or so, I can live with the Sox being disappointing/hungover the next season. It's those 86 year waits (as the Yankees win 26 championships) that make me miserable.
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Post by sarasoxer on Aug 2, 2019 10:04:12 GMT -5
JBJ is a big reason we won the ALCS last year, lest we forget. I just think management and the fans will look to rectify the results from 2019. That means change. People 'on the bubble' are most vulnerable. Leon, JBJ, Porcello...are in the front row...mixed metaphor.
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dd
Veteran
Posts: 979
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Post by dd on Aug 2, 2019 10:04:49 GMT -5
For all the same reasons JBJ is still here. I feel badly for JBJ. I think after another poor season and the Sox demise, change will be at the forefront..and accepted by the fans. JBJ will be a casualty. I will feel badly for him because he is a very serious guy intent on playing well. Still there is something amiss with a guy with great hand/eye catching baseballs on the run and dive but can't match bat to ball. Given some hot streaks added in, the issue must be timing or mechanical...in addition to a curious determination to continually hit into shifts. JBJ, you are not Papi. I'm a huge fan of JBJ and have been since his minor league days. It's sad, but it's probably time for him to go. It will kill me to see him in another uniform.
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Post by jimed14 on Aug 2, 2019 10:06:27 GMT -5
If they don't win, I'm gonna make other Red Sox fans as miserable as possible.
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Post by manfred on Aug 2, 2019 10:11:37 GMT -5
Man, I’m glad this isn’t the marinersprospect board or something. There might be fatalities! Has this season been disappointing? Sure. But maybe that’s because, I don’t know, we won the World Series in historic fashion last year?
The speed with which Boston fans turn on guys is probably not so good for free agent retention. JBJ remains one of my favorite Sox players: he’s limited, yes, but he is a great fielder, a good baserunner, smart, and rakes during his hot streaks.
Anyway, let’s not throw the baby out with the bath water. Personally, I would rather lose Mookie to free agency than trade him. He can leave me, but I never want to get rid of him. Is that good team building? No, I’m sure not. But I want more than just a winner... I want to like the team I root for.
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Post by redsoxfan2 on Aug 2, 2019 10:20:46 GMT -5
JBJ is a big reason we won the ALCS last year, lest we forget. Yes, he was. He didn't really hit well. He just drove the ball every time he connected which usually had runners on. It was great what he did, but it's as much a future indicator of success as Steve Pearce.
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Post by Smittyw on Aug 2, 2019 10:21:21 GMT -5
If only we'd had Daniel Hudson for this series, everything would have been different...
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Post by humanbeingbean on Aug 2, 2019 10:24:42 GMT -5
JBJ has never been worth negative fWAR in any of his full seasons, and has put up fWARs of 1.9, 5.3, 2.2, 2.2, and 0.7 (and counting) beginning in 2015. I don't understand the scapegoating of JBJ (by some) on this board. He's by no means an uber-center fielder or someone to build a team around, but he's an undebatably positive asset. There's far more to a complete baseball player than batting average or hitting consistency. He's streaky. But he's always a positive contributor year in and year out. Equating him to Sandy Leon is ridiculous.
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