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Sox and Padres Still Talking Wil Myers Deal
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Post by soxaddict on Feb 18, 2020 15:38:37 GMT -5
I’m really not that high on Quantrill anyway. I’d rather get a couple of prospects like Joey Cantillo and Hudson Head and go with Houck.
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Post by buffs4444 on Feb 18, 2020 16:10:51 GMT -5
I like the idea of getting Myers healthy, happy and the hell out of Petco. Maybe you catch lightning in a bottle playing in an atmosphere that’s more intense (I love San Diego/almost moved there, but games are different between BOS/SD or TB for that matter).
Anyway, I like the possibilities...
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Post by oldfaithful2019 on Feb 18, 2020 16:12:10 GMT -5
Myers may not be crazy about his playing time here but he would be a much better option than Lin or Aruaz (unless they carry 5 bench players to keep him around) to round out the bench.
Quantril may not be a front of the rotation prospect but he is rotation ready now, cost controlled and fills a present need.
As long as SD does not ask for one of our top 15 prospects in return, I do this deal. Maybe Hembre or Walden gets the deal done.
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Post by artfuldodger on Feb 18, 2020 16:15:45 GMT -5
I wonder if JBJ is in the mix for this trade. Margot was just traded by the Padres so CF may be a spot that the Padres are looking to fill.
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Post by thegoodthebadthesox on Feb 18, 2020 16:24:10 GMT -5
Is Myers able to play center anymore? In theory they could cut Bradley and save the same money, and then use Pillar/Myers/Verdugo platoons. No. And I wouldn't even put him in RF at Fenway. I'd rather flip him to a 3rd team with even more cash for more prospects. That would be great, but it also isn't realistic at all. What team is going to give up prospects for Myers, even if the Red Sox paid the remainder of his salary? If there were other teams interested in Myers, they'd be in on him now. I think the Red Sox are really his only market at this point.
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Post by oldfaithful2019 on Feb 18, 2020 16:26:50 GMT -5
I wonder if JBJ is in the mix for this trade. Margot was just traded by the Padres so CF may be a spot that the Padres are looking to fill. Could be and I'm sure the Sox would be all over it to shed the 11 million. Not sure Jackie is what SD would be looking to spend their saved payroll on assuming they are trying to build a 2020 contender though. Jackie as been my favorite player since his Sea Dogs days, so that would be another dagger to this fan ! I know it is only a matter of time though as Pillar is good enough still to be an everyday player and I'm convinced that is what the Sox signed him to be.
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Post by soxin8 on Feb 18, 2020 16:29:08 GMT -5
Gabriel Arias | Rank: 13 (Preseason: 25) Team: Lake Elsinore Storm (A Adv) ETA: 2021 Position: SS Age: 19 DOB: 02/27/2000 Bats: R Throws: R Height: 6' 1" Weight: 201 lb. Signed: July 2, 2016 - SD Scouting grades: Hit: 45 | Power: 50 | Run: 50 | Arm: 60 | Field: 60 | Overall: 45 Arias, one of the top prospects in the 2016-17 international class, received $1.9 million as the Padres blew past their spending pool during the signing period. At age 17, he was promoted to Class A Fort Wayne and held his own, hitting .276 in the Midwest League playoffs before turning in a strong showing in the Australian Baseball League. Arias remained with Fort Wayne for the entirety of the '18 season, and he slumped to a .654 OPS. But he remained an expert defensively, and he came on strong offensively toward the end of the season. Arias has all the tools to become a plus defender at short, where he has very good hands, footwork and control of his body. His arm strength and range make it clear he's cut out for the position long-term. He has strides to make at the plate, however. A right-handed hitter, Arias' swing can get long and his plate approach needs a bit of work. If he can refine his swing, Arias is expected to generate some power as he develops physically. He already hits the ball hard, gap-to-gap. Arias' defensive value gives him a relatively high floor, but it's the entire package on both sides of the ball that has club officials excited about the teenager's bright future. Team G AB R H 2B 3B HR RBI BB K SB AVG OBP SLG OPS LE (A+) 120 477 62 144 21 4 17 75 25 128 8 .302 .339 .470 .809
Crazy this guy is only their 13th ranked prospect, hitting .302 at high-AA with plus defense and a plus arm at short. Would be great if they could get him along with Quantrill. m.mlb.com/prospects/2019?list=sdFor comparison sake, Arias is a little over 4 months older than Jimenez and played a full season of high A last year. But agree if the Sox can only get one it should be Campusano.
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Post by jimed14 on Feb 18, 2020 16:35:55 GMT -5
No. And I wouldn't even put him in RF at Fenway. I'd rather flip him to a 3rd team with even more cash for more prospects. That would be great, but it also isn't realistic at all. What team is going to give up prospects for Myers, even if the Red Sox paid the remainder of his salary? If there were other teams interested in Myers, they'd be in on him now. I think the Red Sox are really his only market at this point. Well, Matt Kemp was traded 3 times after he wasn't good anymore because he was basically free with all the money being paid by other teams.
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Post by kman22 on Feb 18, 2020 17:08:04 GMT -5
Campusano alone had me hyped about this possible deal back when we were talking about deal Betts to the Dodgers. If you include Quantrill on top of that, it's an even bigger win as he can be a cheap #5 for you in the present tense. If he doesn't pan out, you still have Campusano.
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Post by wcsoxfan on Feb 18, 2020 17:09:48 GMT -5
That would be great, but it also isn't realistic at all. What team is going to give up prospects for Myers, even if the Red Sox paid the remainder of his salary? If there were other teams interested in Myers, they'd be in on him now. I think the Red Sox are really his only market at this point. Well, Matt Kemp was traded 3 times after he wasn't good anymore because he was basically free with all the money being paid by other teams. If the Red Sox traded for Myers with San Diego picking up half the contract ($30.5mil) and then traded Myers away while picking up half of his remaining contract ($15.25mil) then their luxury tax payroll hit would be 5.083mil/yr; higher than the hit from keeping him on their team. The receiving team would still be paying 5.083mil/yr in salary but they would have a negative luxury tax payroll number for him (I don't remember ever seeing this before), which means it would only make any sense if the receiving team was more desperate to cut their luxury tax payroll than the Red Sox, and currently that team doesn't exist. So let's assume a re-trade of Myers won't happen. One of the larger impacts is that this would either push Chavis to the bench/AAA or push Peraza to the bench. I'm assuming Myers is a 1B (as he was in 2016 and 2017) so he would platoon there which leave Peraza and Chavis as an un-ideal 2B platoon as Chavis needs reps. Myers has also been not-so-bad in LF in his career in a very small sample size (796 2/3 innings).
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Post by thegoodthebadthesox on Feb 18, 2020 17:13:09 GMT -5
That would be great, but it also isn't realistic at all. What team is going to give up prospects for Myers, even if the Red Sox paid the remainder of his salary? If there were other teams interested in Myers, they'd be in on him now. I think the Red Sox are really his only market at this point. Well, Matt Kemp was traded 3 times after he wasn't good anymore because he was basically free with all the money being paid by other teams. Yeah, but did he warrant any significant prospect returns? I mean, the Dodgers got Downs and Gray in that trade but they also gave up Puig and took on a bad contract so I'm not sure that really counts. My point is that it's not realistic to expect to get legitimate prospects back for him if they were to flip him. If a team viewed him as a positive asset on a cheap deal the Padres would probably be a little more willing to make that trade than give up prospects to eat a little less contract with the Sox.
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Post by Chris Hatfield on Feb 18, 2020 17:13:32 GMT -5
Folks, again, as stated on the previous page:
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Post by jimed14 on Feb 18, 2020 17:21:24 GMT -5
Well, Matt Kemp was traded 3 times after he wasn't good anymore because he was basically free with all the money being paid by other teams. Yeah, but did he warrant any significant prospect returns? I mean, the Dodgers got Downs and Gray in that trade but they also gave up Puig and took on a bad contract so I'm not sure that really counts. My point is that it's not realistic to expect to get legitimate prospects back for him if they were to flip him. If a team viewed him as a positive asset on a cheap deal the Padres would probably be a little more willing to make that trade than give up prospects to eat a little less contract with the Sox. I really think there would be several interested teams in Myers at league minimum or free. He is still a bounce-back candidate if you put him in a hitter friendly park. It doesn't have to be significant prospects. I just don't see the point in having him on the roster.
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Post by jimed14 on Feb 18, 2020 17:24:03 GMT -5
Well, Matt Kemp was traded 3 times after he wasn't good anymore because he was basically free with all the money being paid by other teams. If the Red Sox traded for Myers with San Diego picking up half the contract ($30.5mil) and then traded Myers away while picking up half of his remaining contract ($15.25mil) then their luxury tax payroll hit would be 5.083mil/yr; higher than the hit from keeping him on their team. The receiving team would still be paying 5.083mil/yr in salary but they would have a negative luxury tax payroll number for him (I don't remember ever seeing this before), which means it would only make any sense if the receiving team was more desperate to cut their luxury tax payroll than the Red Sox, and currently that team doesn't exist. So let's assume a re-trade of Myers won't happen. One of the larger impacts is that this would either push Chavis to the bench/AAA or push Peraza to the bench. I'm assuming Myers is a 1B (as he was in 2016 and 2017) so he would platoon there which leave Peraza and Chavis as an un-ideal 2B platoon as Chavis needs reps. Myers has also been not-so-bad in LF in his career in a very small sample size (796 2/3 innings). How does that math work? Why would SD's luxury tax calculation go down if the Red Sox traded him? And if it didn't go down, then Myers would count more against the CBT threshholds of different teams than the entire value of his contract. Nothing about that makes sense.
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Post by Chris Hatfield on Feb 18, 2020 17:28:06 GMT -5
I don't understand why people are trying to move Bradley in this deal. Did demainah finally win subliminally?
Also, the Padres don't need an outfielder in return. They moved Margot because they were deep there. Per Fangraphs Roster Resource, their current lineup has Pham-Grisham-Franchy left to right, with Naylor, Trammell, and Olivares all in AAA. They have depth in the outfield still.
If the point for SD is to shed Myers' contract, I'm not sure why an $11M JBJ in return would be something they'd be interested in either.
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Post by soxaddict on Feb 18, 2020 17:32:11 GMT -5
I don't understand why people are trying to move Bradley in this deal. Did demainah finally win subliminally? Also, the Padres don't need an outfielder in return. They moved Margot because they were deep there. Per Fangraphs Roster Resource, their current lineup has Pham-Grisham-Franchy left to right, with Naylor, Trammell, and Olivares all in AAA. They have depth in the outfield still. If the point for SD is to shed Myers' contract, I'm not sure why an $11M JBJ in return would be something they'd be interested in either. I don’t think they would want JBJ nor do I think we should trade him. IMO, Chavis would be one that would be moveable. He’s got more trade value that could net us more prospect return.
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Post by thegoodthebadthesox on Feb 18, 2020 17:37:47 GMT -5
Yeah, but did he warrant any significant prospect returns? I mean, the Dodgers got Downs and Gray in that trade but they also gave up Puig and took on a bad contract so I'm not sure that really counts. My point is that it's not realistic to expect to get legitimate prospects back for him if they were to flip him. If a team viewed him as a positive asset on a cheap deal the Padres would probably be a little more willing to make that trade than give up prospects to eat a little less contract with the Sox. I really think there would be several interested teams in Myers at league minimum or free. He is still a bounce-back candidate if you put him in a hitter friendly park. It doesn't have to be significant prospects. I just don't see the point in having him on the roster. I'm not going to say there absolutely wouldn't be anyone interested in him for free, I just think that if there were teams that viewed him as a good bounce-back candidate there would have already been traction with the Padres and another team. But obviously we don't get told 85% of the things that go on between front offices so maybe there have been. It just seemed like from your initial comments that you thought there was a real return to be had other than just getting him off the roster and I don't think there would be one. For me, the point of having him on the roster is because I agree he's a good bounce-back candidate and would be willing to give him that chance in a LF/1B platoon role. At what will be definitely at least half off his price, if Myers gets back to 2017 form he's a pretty decent value. Definitely worth the gamble in my eyes if we also get prospects.
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Post by Chris Hatfield on Feb 18, 2020 17:39:42 GMT -5
I don't think this is a trade where a player of any great significance goes to SD. Maybe someone at a position in the minors that's full, like Fitzgerald or Ockimey or Granberg or one of the A-ball infielders.
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Post by philsbosoxfan on Feb 18, 2020 17:42:04 GMT -5
I don't think this is a trade where a player of any great significance goes to SD. Maybe someone at a position in the minors that's full, like Fitzgerald or Ockimey or Granberg or one of the A-ball infielders. Or maybe someone from the bottom of the 40 man. ADD: With enough money eaten by the Sox, the competitive balance pick and/or IFA money might also be in play.
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Post by thegoodthebadthesox on Feb 18, 2020 17:44:17 GMT -5
I don't think this is a trade where a player of any great significance goes to SD. Maybe someone at a position in the minors that's full, like Fitzgerald or Ockimey or Granberg or one of the A-ball infielders. I think Ockimey actually makes a ton of sense as the chip going to SD for both sides. edit: never mind, him and Hosmer are both lefty. Thought Ockimey was righty.
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Post by oldfaithful2019 on Feb 18, 2020 17:46:46 GMT -5
I don't think this is a trade where a player of any great significance goes to SD. Maybe someone at a position in the minors that's full, like Fitzgerald or Ockimey or Granberg or one of the A-ball infielders. Or maybe someone from the bottom of the 40 man. Good point. The 40 man is full now.
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Post by wcsoxfan on Feb 18, 2020 17:47:36 GMT -5
If the Red Sox traded for Myers with San Diego picking up half the contract ($30.5mil) and then traded Myers away while picking up half of his remaining contract ($15.25mil) then their luxury tax payroll hit would be 5.083mil/yr; higher than the hit from keeping him on their team. The receiving team would still be paying 5.083mil/yr in salary but they would have a negative luxury tax payroll number for him (I don't remember ever seeing this before), which means it would only make any sense if the receiving team was more desperate to cut their luxury tax payroll than the Red Sox, and currently that team doesn't exist. So let's assume a re-trade of Myers won't happen. One of the larger impacts is that this would either push Chavis to the bench/AAA or push Peraza to the bench. I'm assuming Myers is a 1B (as he was in 2016 and 2017) so he would platoon there which leave Peraza and Chavis as an un-ideal 2B platoon as Chavis needs reps. Myers has also been not-so-bad in LF in his career in a very small sample size (796 2/3 innings). How does that math work? Why would SD's luxury tax calculation go down if the Red Sox traded him? And if it didn't go down, then Myers would count more against the CBT threshholds of different teams than the entire value of his contract. Nothing about that makes sense. SD's luxury tax calculation would not go down if the Red Sox traded away Wil Myers. The net sum of the luxury tax hits from all 3 teams in this hypothetical (SD, BOS, mystery team) would be equal to his AAV of $13.8mil. So in the example above, SD would take a $10.167mil hit per year, BOS would take a $5.083mil hit per year and the mystery team would receive a luxury tax credit of $1.45mil, which all equates to the current AAV of $13.8mil. I made a post a few years back explaining the advantages/disadvantages of small/big market teams in back-loading or front-loading contracts which may explain this a bit better: forum.soxprospects.com/thread/1392/luxury-tax-loopholes (please note - the part about options changed with the CBA) (btw - if you ever look at my old posts around that time - please note that someone else clearly stole my account to propose those Mookie for Kemp trades)
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Post by wcsoxfan on Feb 18, 2020 17:52:37 GMT -5
I don't think this is a trade where a player of any great significance goes to SD. Maybe someone at a position in the minors that's full, like Fitzgerald or Ockimey or Granberg or one of the A-ball infielders. Or maybe someone from the bottom of the 40 man. ADD: With enough money eaten by the Sox, the competitive balance pick and/or IFA money might also be in play. Do you realize what you've done?! Now the next 20 posts are going to be people guessing who the 40-man player headed back to SD will be. ....my guess is Arauz.
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Post by philsbosoxfan on Feb 18, 2020 18:08:18 GMT -5
Or maybe someone from the bottom of the 40 man. ADD: With enough money eaten by the Sox, the competitive balance pick and/or IFA money might also be in play. Do you realize what you've done?! Now the next 20 posts are going to be people guessing who the 40-man player headed back to SD will be. ....my guess is Arauz. I was guessing Martin Perez who the Sox have been holding for whatever reason. Maybe there's method to their madness.
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Post by thegoodthebadthesox on Feb 18, 2020 18:10:17 GMT -5
Do you realize what you've done?! Now the next 20 posts are going to be people guessing who the 40-man player headed back to SD will be. ....my guess is Arauz. I was guessing Martin Perez who the Sox have been holding for whatever reason. Maybe there's method to their madness. Do you mean Weber? Perez is actually potentially useful.
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