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atzar
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Posts: 1,817
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Post by atzar on Nov 15, 2021 10:07:56 GMT -5
I'm thankful for the time he spent in Boston, and I'm happy that he helped us win a ring. I wish him well in Detroit.
I'm glad we aren't the ones paying him for five years though. When he's healthy, he's worth that money. I'm perfectly content to let somebody else roll those dice.
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manfred
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Post by manfred on Nov 15, 2021 10:08:31 GMT -5
Well, this sucks. Setting the money aside, the Sox are now a starter down. I guess if you factor Whitlock as a starter, they are even? But Sale, Eovaldi, Pivetta, Houck, Whitlock is a high risk/high reward staff.
I’d love to find out this money is getting directed at Scherzer or Verlander.
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Post by orion09 on Nov 15, 2021 10:10:16 GMT -5
Surprised the Sox were not willing to match 5y/77m. Not a crazy deal for a guy who a lot of people pointed out was likely to be of the best values on the market this offseason, especially since he's already pitched well in Boston.
On the other hand, the opt-out does change the upside/downside proposition and it wouldn't shock me if that were the deal-breaker for Bloom rather than the money
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Post by voiceofreason on Nov 15, 2021 10:16:08 GMT -5
I don't like it at all and will not be surprised if it is a deal we all look back on with remorse as he easily out performs the cost. It seems like a very reasonable contract that I would have considered a hometown discount, wrong again.
It seems to me that the Sox must just see something they don't like and decided not to go in that direction. Maybe it is his history of allowing hitters to know what is coming. It has been a problem for him thru the years so maybe they didn't feel it could be coached out of his game.
Not a good start to the offseason as far as I'm concerned.
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Post by redsox04071318champs on Nov 15, 2021 10:18:52 GMT -5
Well, this sucks. Setting the money aside, the Sox are now a starter down. I guess if you factor Whitlock as a starter, they are even? But Sale, Eovaldi, Pivetta, Houck, Whitlock is a high risk/high reward staff. I’d love to find out this money is getting directed at Scherzer or Verlander. I was wondering the same thing, but I still have trouble seeing Bloom, who's not willing to spend $16 million on E-Rod at his age 28 season, suddenly be willing to spend big $ on a 38 year old Scherzer who was injured toward the very end of last season or Verlander who is 39 and coming off TJS (and assuming that Bloom would be alright with losing a draft pick). I can see him signing Matz, but the options of who's more likely to be better than E-Rod is kind of limited, no? Maybe he signs one of the Giants pitchers? I guess I just don't see how they're worth spending more on than what bringing back E-Rod would have cost. I was prepared for the thought that E-Rod signs for 100 million and the bidding gets too high and they walk away. I wasn't prepared for him to leave for a 77 - 80 milllion contract that seems quite reasonable.
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vokuhila
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Post by vokuhila on Nov 15, 2021 10:20:07 GMT -5
Wow this is a scary contract if you are a Tigers fan. 5/77 was about market value, maybe even a smidge high, but the option has a good chance to really blow up in your face.
What are the Tigers actually hoping for here?
If he has two good years you get value, but he is gone after that. If he has two mediocre years you get what you paid for and he may exercise the option. If he sucks your are stuck with him.
Feels like a draw-draw-lose situation.
Sad to see him leave, but I can see why both parties weren't able to find together...can't see CB making an offer like that...can't see ERod rejecting an offer like that.
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Post by voiceofreason on Nov 15, 2021 10:22:12 GMT -5
Well, this sucks. Setting the money aside, the Sox are now a starter down. I guess if you factor Whitlock as a starter, they are even? But Sale, Eovaldi, Pivetta, Houck, Whitlock is a high risk/high reward staff. I’d love to find out this money is getting directed at Scherzer or Verlander. This makes sense. But if they don't go out and sign someone higher in the FA pecking order I'm going to be really disappointed. The rotation needs at least 1 more impact arm. I am still a Thor fan. TJ surgery doesn't scare me in the least and he is one guy who could really turn into an ace for the next 5 years.
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Post by juanpena on Nov 15, 2021 10:28:30 GMT -5
What are the Tigers actually hoping for here? That their 68-61 record after their awful start is an indication that they have a great chance to compete in the Central next year, with E-Rod giving them a boost, along with possibly signing one of the shortstops. This is not a hopeless Tigers team trying to make a splash and sell tickets. Mize and/or Skubal could take a step forward next year, and the Tigers are showing they aren't going to concede the division to the White Sox.
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Post by FenwayFanatic on Nov 15, 2021 10:30:03 GMT -5
I am with RJP. The opt out after year 2 and the draft pick compensation makes this an easy one to pass on.
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cdj
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Posts: 14,228
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Post by cdj on Nov 15, 2021 10:31:07 GMT -5
I am with RJP. The opt out after year 2 and the draft pick compensation makes this an easy one to pass on. Yeah with the opt out you’re never really going to get surplus value out of that contract
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Post by julyanmorley on Nov 15, 2021 10:46:11 GMT -5
If he puts up a couple of 3 WAR season and then opts out, the Tigers will have done very well.
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Post by Underwater Johnson on Nov 15, 2021 10:52:24 GMT -5
Just back from a week camping in SE Nevada and things are heating up faster than I expected. Gotta say I thought Eddie would either stay in Boston for a bit of a discount/bridge or that the QO would look good to him as a second walk year in an uncertain CBA environment. In the words of Arthur Fonzerelli, I was wr- wr- wr-. Maybe he didn't like being called out in public on the regular by AC after all...
A little surprised at the 5-year duration but the AAV is in line with what a #2/3 starter is making and the opt-out makes it a bridge deal if he performs.
Another draft pick on the pile for Chaim in 2022 (along with the carry-over from not signing Fabian), so signing a QO-rejecter won't sting as much.
It'll be interesting to see what the alternative to Eddie will be. Maybe some of that money goes toward an Eovaldi extension?
Guys without QOs attached include Scherzer, Kershaw, Rodon - I'd see any of those as an upgrade over E-Rod assuming good medicals. Rodon is closer to a push but is the same age and just had a better season than E-Rod has ever had by WAR. Scherzer and Kershaw would be shorter-term, higher-AAV deals, I would assume.
Congrats, Eddie! We hardly knew ye.
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Post by Chris Hatfield on Nov 15, 2021 10:54:18 GMT -5
MLBTR predicted 5/70. Ben Clemens at FG predicted 4/80, with the mean and median crowdsource numbers something like that.
So the money alone more or less lines up as somewhere between those (4/80 > 5/77 > 5/70), but the value of the opt-out cannot be overstated. If he performs well it's a two-year deal. I really want to see the year-by-year breakdown.
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mobaz
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Post by mobaz on Nov 15, 2021 10:58:55 GMT -5
If he puts up a couple of 3 WAR season and then opts out, the Tigers will have done very well. I mean I was comfortable with him coming back at the qualifying offer, so two years at similar or less would be okay. Obviously the Tigers only get the downside of injury/ineffectiveness. But I really wonder what the Sox offered that was such a non-starter. Something like the 3/45 some here suggested? I again would have been fine with a Lester/Eovaldi 4/70ish and would have held my nose but gone for 5/80. I really thought with all the action he'd end up with a Zach Wheeler 5/100+. I'm guessing the opt-out is huge for Eddie and wonder if the Sox weren't willing in any reasonable dollar contract. Hunting out a better contract in the next CBA.
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Post by borisman on Nov 15, 2021 11:07:19 GMT -5
So we currently have 5 picks in the top 100 but are down one starter. We can still lose a higher pick than we receive in return. I'm ok with it as long the acquired player is elite. As far as ERod goes:
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Post by Chris Hatfield on Nov 15, 2021 11:11:23 GMT -5
BTW, had forgotten that E-Rod was the system's top prospect during the 2015 season. Goodness what a loaded system that was in July, with Swihart having just graduated out of the top spot:
1. E. Rodriguez 2. Y. Moncada 3. R. Devers 4. M. Margot 5. B. Johnson 6. H. Owens 7. A. Benintendi 8. M. Kopech 9. J. Guerra 10. D. Marrero ... 13. M. Chavis ... 16. T. Shaw 17. T. Buttrey 18. M. Dubon ... 34. H. Hembree 35. L. Allen ... 39. N. Ramirez ... 45. J. Beeks
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Nov 15, 2021 11:12:15 GMT -5
I don't like it one bit!
What's wrong with two years and then he opts out given what this team just did? Are we not in win now mode? Same way I looked at David Prices deal, if he opts out then it was a great two year deal. You can certainly get surplus value in a two year contract.
I'm scared, that seems like a bargain contract, that's less than John Lackey got years ago and ERod seems like he's ready to breakout. Not easy finding guys that can handle Boston, the AL East and give you innings.
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Post by wcsoxfan on Nov 15, 2021 11:12:23 GMT -5
And let's not forget about that reported no-trade clause. I wouldn't be surprised if this was the stipulation that ended the competition from the other teams - many teams are unwilling to go there as it sets a precedent that other players will expect.
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Post by grandsalami on Nov 15, 2021 11:15:40 GMT -5
I don't like it one bit! What's wrong with two years and then he opts out given what this team just did? Are we not in win now mode? Same way I looked at David Prices deal, if he opts out then it was a great two year deal. You can certainly get surplus value in a two year contract.
I'm scared, that seems like a bargain contract, that's less than John Lackey got years ago and ERod seems like he's ready to breakout. Not easy finding guys that can handle Boston, the AL East and give you innings. I think is injury issues (not just COVID) may have played a role in them not re-signing him
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Post by Guidas on Nov 15, 2021 11:19:34 GMT -5
I don't like it one bit! What's wrong with two years, and then he opts out given what this team just did? Are we not in win now mode? Same way I looked at David Prices deal, if he opts out then it was a great two year deal. You can certainly get surplus value in a two year contract. I'm scared, that seems like a bargain contract, that's less than John Lackey got years ago and ERod seems like he's ready to breakout. Not easy finding guys that can handle Boston, the AL East and give you innings. I'm close to this, but I'll hold off further judgment until I see what the Sox end up with. My gut says they could've met this deal with the opt-out and even given him two more mil to show the love. If there is a no-trade, that makes it a tougher call. I thought Eduardo was a very good pitcher who could handle the bright lights and, on some days pitched like a #1 or #2. Going to miss him but he'll love the boundaries at the Tigers ballyard.
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Nov 15, 2021 11:20:24 GMT -5
I don't like it one bit! What's wrong with two years and then he opts out given what this team just did? Are we not in win now mode? Same way I looked at David Prices deal, if he opts out then it was a great two year deal. You can certainly get surplus value in a two year contract.
I'm scared, that seems like a bargain contract, that's less than John Lackey got years ago and ERod seems like he's ready to breakout. Not easy finding guys that can handle Boston, the AL East and give you innings. I think is injury issues (not just COVID) may have played a role in them not re-signing him What are those? He had those knee issues, yet been over three years since he had surgery and zero issues since. His health and fresh arm are a big reason I wanted him back.
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Post by Addam603 on Nov 15, 2021 11:21:37 GMT -5
I'd be interested to see the year-by-year breakdown of this deal. I would imagine that it's relatively front loaded and it also gives him the option to opt-out after two years if he does well and take advantage of a potentially beneficial new CBA.
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Post by Chris Hatfield on Nov 15, 2021 11:24:55 GMT -5
I think is injury issues (not just COVID) may have played a role in them not re-signing him What are those? He had those knee issues, yet been over three years since he had surgery and zero issues since. His health and fresh arm are a big reason I wanted him back. Got to agree. He's had two healthy seasons sandwiched around the season lost to myocarditis, which is a completely separate issue. From 2019-2021, he had the 25th-most innings in baseball despite having missed the short 2020 season. Not sure how you can consider him an injury risk at this point.
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Post by Addam603 on Nov 15, 2021 11:29:28 GMT -5
Always fun to remember that we got E-Rod for 20 innings of Andrew Miller. They were admittedly 20 very good innings, but we got 856.2 innings of anywhere from a solid #3 to Cy Young contending pitcher for half a year of a reliever. One of the best Red Sox trades in recent memory.
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Post by fanofredsox on Nov 15, 2021 11:30:56 GMT -5
I'm happy for E. Rod & the Red Sox. Blooms stock just took a tick up.
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