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10/15 Red Sox vs. Tigers ALCS Game 3 Thread
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Post by gregblossersbelly on Oct 15, 2013 20:01:31 GMT -5
Lackey basically skipped a start. TB start was Oct 5th. If we can win this series without playing 7 games, he'll get a lot of rest for his next start. Gm 3 of World Series isn't until Oct. 26th. Game 2 would be Oct 24th. Clay could prob use the extra rest more if he pitches on Sat the 19th. Won't have to go until the next Saturday.
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Post by charliezink16 on Oct 15, 2013 21:07:47 GMT -5
Hey guys, remember when we HAD to address the bullpen at the deadline due to the fact that "Koji was going to breakdown"?
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Post by Guidas on Oct 15, 2013 22:03:43 GMT -5
Hey guys, remember when we HAD to address the bullpen at the deadline due to the fact that "Koji was going to breakdown"? Knock wood. Still need 6 more wins. Do not blaspheme the baseball gods.
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Post by huskies15 on Oct 15, 2013 22:05:32 GMT -5
This series has been a true test of the team's mental makeup. Being dominated in three games in a row by the starters for the other team and to still be up 2-1?!? Unreal. This team's propensity to strikeout has manifested itself big time however. Gotta put more balls in play.
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Post by Oregon Norm on Oct 15, 2013 23:17:55 GMT -5
How about if we all take a dose of reality pills. The three pitchers they faced are last year's Cy Young winner, this year's likely winner, and a guy with a better fair run average than either of them, Sanchez, who had just about as many wins above replacement as Scherzer. All three are strikeout pitchers with great secondary stuff, part of a group that all of us acknowledged, going in, was the best starting staff in the league. And yes, they nevertheless found a way to win the Cy guys' starts with very well timed hits, as few as they've been.
They've gained the upper hand and now they need to keep it. Going up 3-1 would be a good way to do that. There's a lot of luck involved, but there always is in a series like this. Not least, this time, because right now Cabrera can't get to the balls on the outer part of the strikezone. When he's on and healthy he kills those pitches. That makes it very difficult to get him out, so good is his plate coverage. He's still hitting mistakes in the wheelhouse which is where Buchholz f&*(s$d up. But he doesn't have the same leverage on the outside so he can be had as Tazawa showed.
As for Napoli, the HRs come with the Ks as we've seen throughout the year, and as they have throughout his career. That's ok if he can do it when they need it done and he did just that this game. On to the next one.
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redsox04071318champs
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Post by redsox04071318champs on Oct 15, 2013 23:40:22 GMT -5
Fantastic win! It feels like the Sox stole another win. They had no business winning this game, but they found a way. They got the one hit that mattered and squeezed out of some big jams. Lackey (particularly Lackey), Breslow, Tazawa, and Koji were excellent.
Hopefully the Sox can find a way to get the bats going tomorrow and they can hopefully find a way to win that doesn't involve Craig Breslow and Koji Uehara so they can be properly rested for the remainder of the series.
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danr
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Post by danr on Oct 16, 2013 1:29:26 GMT -5
Last winter we had a lengthy debate about the kind of players the Sox needed to get. Some of us argued that the Sox needed to get one or two superstar hitters to go with Ortiz because the team as then constituted could not hit the really good pitchers. Others argued that the lineup holes needed to be patched with better players, but not necessarily superstars, that having a solid lineup up and down would achieve the same results at lower cost. As it turns out I think all of us were right. What I don't think any of us expected was that the Sox actually would out pitch a team with better starting pitchers.
That is what has happened so far in this series with Detroit. Lester and Lackey were sensational. Relief pitching has been otherworldly. And because of that, the team is up 2-1 despite the fact that it can't hit good pitching.
But the team is in these playoffs because the lineup that was put together last winter, while generally unspectacular, proved to be so solid that over the course of the season it not only prevented any slumps, it also capitalized when the opponent pitching was not great, which was a lot of the time. The Sox lineup is the baseball version of Lake Wobegon. Everyone is above average.
Really good piece on ESPN by Jerry Crasnick about Napoli and his homerun.
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Post by FenwayFanatic on Oct 16, 2013 8:07:24 GMT -5
The Sox just very recently killed Moore and Price. It can hit good pitchers. Good pitchers can also shut the team down.
But I think its a stretch to say they can't hit them. Tonight should be a big game with Fister pitching.
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Post by ramireja on Oct 16, 2013 8:20:12 GMT -5
Let's not forget the Tigers had a runner on 3rd with one out in two different innings. Absolutely clutch pitching to not let either of those guys score. The Tazawa strikeout of Cabrera....just wow.
Great game. We may have to cycle back through Sanchez, Scherzer, and Verlander.....let's hope we finally get to them. This series ain't over by a long shot.
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Post by jmei on Oct 16, 2013 8:20:36 GMT -5
But the team is in these playoffs because the lineup that was put together last winter, while generally unspectacular, proved to be so solid that over the course of the season it not only prevented any slumps, it also capitalized when the opponent pitching was not great, which was a lot of the time. The Sox lineup is the baseball version of Lake Wobegon. Everyone is above average. I mean, it was the best offense in the league by a fair margin.
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Post by dfwsox on Oct 16, 2013 8:30:51 GMT -5
Great win last night. Cluth pitching by Lackey and bullpen put nails in the coffin. Taz makes me nervous though, I havent had a great feeling about him on the mound the last half of year but he stepped up as well.
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Post by hammerhead on Oct 16, 2013 10:48:53 GMT -5
It's amazing that a year + ago before Lackey's Tommy John Surgery Lackey was the most unpopular and disliked person the sox have had since Julio Lugo. Everyone was stretching their minds trying to find a way to ship Lackey out of town, hell, a lot of people were saying to just DFA him. I personally hated his face.
Yesterday I saw a pitcher who put it all out their for his team and this city. I don't mean to be so sentimental and chinzy , but....
Mr Lackey, I'm sorry , please accept my apology... It is evident how hard the guy has worked to come back from elbow surgery. Yesterday's performance was a thing of beauty.
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ericmvan
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Post by ericmvan on Oct 16, 2013 11:09:07 GMT -5
We may have to cycle back through Sanchez, Scherzer, and Verlander.....let's hope we finally get to them. The first thing Mike Napoli said about Verlander last night was "he kept us off-balance all night long," which means that he didn't throw the pitches they expected him to throw. He even singled out the fact that he threw him four straight sliders his first PA, something he had never done before. (And he could have added that in his second PA, he didn't throw any sliders). I think that comes close to confirming the theory that the Tigers have been consciously changing their pitch sequencing from their usual, thus negating all the work the smart Sox have done about what pitch to look for in a given count. That goes a huge way to explaining what we've seen so far. If this is the case, it should work less well the second set of starts. (Re Verlander, now that he's exceeded his expected K number in five straight starts, I think there's reason to believe that he really did turn back into the Real Verlander sometime in that stretch, after his off year.)
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Post by ramireja on Oct 16, 2013 11:33:22 GMT -5
It's amazing that a year + ago before Lackey's Tommy John Surgery Lackey was the most unpopular and disliked person the sox have had since Julio Lugo. Everyone was stretching their minds trying to find a way to ship Lackey out of town, hell, a lot of people were saying to just DFA him. I personally hated his face. Yesterday I saw a pitcher who put it all out their for his team and this city. I don't mean to be so sentimental and chinzy , but.... Mr Lackey, I'm sorry , please accept my apology... It is evident how hard the guy has worked to come back from elbow surgery. Yesterday's performance was a thing of beauty. Yes this is very important to remember. After the great regular season he had, I'm very happy for him that he had yesterday's start. It was beautiful like you said. Had he been mediocre again, the fan base would have turned on him and brushed aside his regular season...
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Post by adiospaydro2005 on Oct 16, 2013 11:50:57 GMT -5
We may have to cycle back through Sanchez, Scherzer, and Verlander.....let's hope we finally get to them. The first thing Mike Napoli said about Verlander last night was "he kept us off-balance all night long," which means that he didn't throw the pitches they expected him to throw. He even singled out the fact that he threw him four straight sliders his first PA, something he had never done before. (And he could have added that in his second PA, he didn't throw any sliders). I think that comes close to confirming the theory that the Tigers have been consciously changing their pitch sequencing from their usual, thus negating all the work the smart Sox have done about what pitch to look for in a given count. That goes a huge way to explaining what we've seen so far. If this is the case, it should work less well the second set of starts. (Re Verlander, now that he's exceeded his expected K number in five straight starts, I think there's reason to believe that he really did turn back into the Real Verlander sometime in that stretch, after his off year.) That's the third game in a row in which Red Sox batters have alluded to the Tigers' pitching keeping them off-balance with their pitch selection. Granted the Tigers starters have pitched extremely well, but isn't about time that the Red Sox tear up their scouting reports, focus on how the Tigers are pitching to them in the current series and adjust their approach accordingly? I am sure that the Tigers have a bunch of smart baseball/stats people which identified their tendencies and they now appear to be using these tendencies to keep the Red Sox guessing in the ALCS. The Red Sox have a bunch of equally smart basebal/stats people who should be able to upgrade Carmine or whatever current software they are using and help their players adapt to the pitch selection/counts in the ALCS.
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Post by nexus on Oct 16, 2013 12:06:08 GMT -5
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danr
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Post by danr on Oct 16, 2013 18:52:48 GMT -5
But the team is in these playoffs because the lineup that was put together last winter, while generally unspectacular, proved to be so solid that over the course of the season it not only prevented any slumps, it also capitalized when the opponent pitching was not great, which was a lot of the time. The Sox lineup is the baseball version of Lake Wobegon. Everyone is above average. I mean, it was the best offense in the league by a fair margin. I thought I made it more obvious than apparently I did that the lineup overall had great results, but the individual performances generally were unspectacular. Ortiz had a great year. Nava, Victorino, Ellsbury, and Pedroia had good seasons, but not superstar years. The rest were not impressive, but not bad, either. There were no black holes in the lineup. It was your argument last winter that filling those black holes would have good results, and you were right. However, when this lineup faces the top pitchers it has problems. So do most teams. That's why those pitchers have such good numbers. But the superstars hit those pitchers. Without superstars, teams have to have really good pitching to win. That's what Tampa has done. And right now, the Sox are doing it, also.
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ericmvan
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Post by ericmvan on Oct 17, 2013 2:57:37 GMT -5
You know, I actually saw that and read the opening paragraph, didn't have time to read the rest of it, and then forgot completely about it. Probably denial at work, too! (Who wants to hear that Verlander has recovered his old form?) Thanks for pointing it out. I now feel that I ought to re-do that analysis by opponent hitting, using 2012 (optionally plus these last five outings; adding them shouldn't change the results), and compare it to the study I did (redone with the last four, fixed-mechanics outings omitted). The differences might be really interesting.
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