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Boston Celtics 2014 Offseason Thread
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Post by ctfisher on Jun 27, 2014 14:54:07 GMT -5
Heard talk that Bradley might get shipped out in a sign and trade. I think honestly that seeing as Embiid didn't fall, this is about as well as the draft could've gone. I think Smart ended up being a little underrated, and I think he's more of a 2/combo guy than a point guard at this point. Young is definitely a 3, which we'll need in the relatively near future. I think we deal Rondo at the deadline this coming season in all likelihood, because next offseason won't be the time for us to take on a max salary, unless we can add another star. I also think that, after next year's draft, we won't be very far away from playoff contention in the east again. 3 1sts next year, along with Young and Smart, plus the other young pieces we have and cap space once wallace, humphries and Green's deals run out, and a strong draft for bigs next year, so we can finally get the rim protection we need. And the best part is that we'll still have picks to flip and potentially some expendable young players on cheap contracts if a star becomes available via trade. It wasn't exciting, but I think we're well set up for the long term, we have a good front office and I'm a Stevens' believer. Playoff contention in 2 years tops; that's how I see it. And in the meantime, enjoy tickets while they're cheap(er)
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Post by texs31 on Jun 27, 2014 16:52:38 GMT -5
Given that Philly's best new players won't play for them next year, my hopes for Philly making the playoffs (which would then give us their 1st) have gone bye-bye. That being said, depending on how deep the draft is next year, a high 2nd could be just as good.
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Post by pedroelgrande on Jun 27, 2014 18:22:06 GMT -5
The Sixers are taking tanking to a whole other level.
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Post by xxdamgoodxx on Jun 28, 2014 10:22:33 GMT -5
Seriously, the only significant player that they are adding is Noel and they will be missing Hawes and Turner for the whole season. I wouldn't be surprised if they gave Young the boot too with the Grant and McDaniels picks. They will be scary bad next year, like 13-wins bad.
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Post by sarasoxer on Jun 30, 2014 9:32:08 GMT -5
Seriously, the only significant player that they are adding is Noel and they will be missing Hawes and Turner for the whole season. I wouldn't be surprised if they gave Young the boot too with the Grant and McDaniels picks. They will be scary bad next year, like 13-wins bad. Good for them, bad for C's. Don't we have their 1st round pick (protected) next year? And won' t C's lose out in another tank season?Phil loaded up for the future in this draft and will do so again next year. Three years from now they could be THE team |
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Post by xxdamgoodxx on Jun 30, 2014 18:10:20 GMT -5
Yeah, the pick is lottery protected, so if they don't make the playoffs (99.9% chance) it turns into a second round pick in 2015, which will probably be close to the Clippers 1st anyway, and 2016. A lot has to go right for the Sixers to become THE team. They have MCW, who was very good last year and put up numbers on a bad team, but he's still not a good shooter and will have his growing pains going into his second year, Noel, who hasn't played a game yet and, although talented, is a wild card, Embiid, who has had injuries that are scary for a big man, and Saric, who is another talented, question-marks guy, and a top lottery pick next year as their future pieces. If every one of them pans out, they could very well be a contending team 5 or 6 years down the road, but there are too many variables to peg them as such (not suggesting that you were).
Ever since all the defensive, rim-protecting centers were taken off the market, I've been thinking about Larry Sanders as a buy-low guy. He's more of a 4 than a 5 because of his slender build and, if we could Greg Monroe as a moose-in-the-middle-5, Sanders could play more to his strengths as a shot-blocker at the PF position. We wouldn't be contending for a title, but we could be a 4-seed or so In the East with the assets to get a star at a wing position in the future and we would be in a good position to keep Rondo. I think the Pistons would have great interest in Olynyk as a centerpiece of a sign-and-trade. Probably not going to happen, but losing Rondo hurts the rebuild a lot and this might be enough to keep him in town and attract another star to make a contender.
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Post by texs31 on Jun 30, 2014 21:18:48 GMT -5
Instead of committing money and or assets (sign and trade for Monroe), I'm intrigued by Ed Davis. He was not extended a QO so he is unrestricted. I wouldn't go crazy for him but, even as an unrestricted guy, I gotta believe he won't cost as much as Sanders or Monroe.
Then again, without Love, I'm mostly leaning towards another "developmental" season.
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Post by pedroelgrande on Jun 30, 2014 22:08:34 GMT -5
The free agents that make sense right now are guys that are young and you are hoping get better. Davis seems to fit that mold.
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Post by texs31 on Jul 1, 2014 6:02:55 GMT -5
Sac and Boaton again in talks over Rondo (Windhorst).
Also (related?), Boston reached out to Isaiah Thomas.
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Post by jmei on Jul 1, 2014 7:13:56 GMT -5
I would desperately be trying to move Wallace's contract for an expiring contract. If they can do that (and Green declines his player option), they would only have $10m in guaranteed contracts next summer (to Smart, Young, Sullinger, Olynyk), plus whatever Bradley re-signs for. That'd give them cap space for two max contracts (the salary cap is projected to be in the $66m range). Even if they can't move Wallace, they can use the stretch provision on his last year and give themselves loads of cap space. There are scenarios where they can re-sign Rondo and grab another max guy (Love (if he's not traded), Marc Gasol, LaMarcus Aldridge) or a couple sub-max guys (Tyson Chandler, Omer Asik, DeAndre Jordan). That means that they don't have to trade Rondo now unless they get an offer good enough to foreclose that possibility.
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Post by texs31 on Jul 1, 2014 7:25:06 GMT -5
Keeping Rondo would make some sense. Right now, so many of their assets are based on potential (Olynyk and Sullinger have potential to be above average bigs, the picks have the potential of being lottery picks, and they have the potential of being good players).
I could see Boston going into this season hoping that a) Rondo regains health and b) some of the young guys really step up and become that desireable asset (like a Klay Thompson).
If that's the case, then Danny's job this summer will be to find a taker for Wallace and use the exception (less likely) and Bogan's expiring contract to take advantage of someone trying to clear space for one of the big FA's. Maybe they could get a young player or pick in exchange??
So far, there have been 2 key moments in the offseason (Lottery and Draft) and both have left us with as many questions as answers. I'd imagine that, at some point, we'll get a better sense of the direction that DA is going to take. Then again, he may not know until the next move is right in front of him.
In related news, Golden State was one of the first teams to reach out to Pau Gasol. I'm on board. Go get him (nullifying the W's need/interest in Love??)
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Post by texs31 on Jul 1, 2014 7:41:09 GMT -5
Salary Cap question: Does anyone know why teams keep rights (cap holds) for players that are long gone? Boston has cap holds for next year on Nenad Krstic (8.3m), Roshown McLeod (3.7m) and Steph Marbury (1.4m) as well as a host of others at 915K. I know they are easily renounced and there is no real cost unless they are making a move. But what's the point? I don't think they can use players in trade that haven't been in the league so I don't understand the logic.
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Post by rjp313jr on Jul 1, 2014 7:57:28 GMT -5
Danny needs to continue to think aggressively but be patient. Love is a top 10 player who's young; the type of guy you trade future assets for. No one else mentioned is. The deal wasn't there yo be made without destroying the ability to make additional moves so Danny smartly walked away.
I'm fine with a longterm rebuild, if that's what it takes. We have a young coach learning as he goes and we have some young talent to watch develop (Sully, Smart and Young). I don't want them to make a trade or veteran signing just to get good enough for the playoffs. I think moves now should be with the future in mind.
I don't mind bringing Hump back on a 1 year maybe 2 year deal on lower money because by all accounts he was the consummate pro and helped the young kids. Good veteran leadership is important. Him and Joel Anthony could be a good duo for Sully.
I think they should use the trade exceptions to get more draft picks, even if 3-5 years down the road as long as they are unprotected. Go ahead and help the Clippers or someone execute a sign and trade but pick up a 2018 unprotected first plus the rights to swap picks in 2017.
Trade Rondo if you can get great value back. If not, keep him and let him test free agency. He's not a max player and he won't get max money from anyone. Point guards aren't needed all over the NBA, there are more now than ever so the money won't be there. Rondo doesn't like change either so he's probably not going to uproot his family unless it's drastically different. He's comfortable here despite the noise of this last season. Plus, we get to see how Smart looks at the end of the year and maybe we won't want him back. Can always sign and trade as well.
Bradley will probably bet on himself and try to be back on a one year deal to get to unrestricted free agency. If so, that's fine. However, I think the market for him is way overblown. Teams are getting smarter with their cap space and they know Bradley is a nice rotation player and nothing more. He's not a top 3 guy. He should be in the 5m a year range. Anything else is an overpay. The Celts should try to lock him up on a 5 year deal with a starting salary in that range. He's a great 3rd guard and maybe could be more. Can't ignore the injuries but they could work out to form a good compromise.
Assuming Bradley is back the kids need to play a lot of minutes and learn. Pressey, Smart, Bradley, Young, Johnson, KO, and Sully.
Going to be a tough year wins and losses, but I won't mind watching a young team develop as long as they work hard. You do that by setting right expectations and if Rondo can't do it then he needs to be gone so the attitude is right. Bringing in the wrong vets to take playing time and make them mediocre is bad. But not bringing in anyone to lead by example and/or create some competition can be too.
It's not easy but I'm willing to wait.
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Post by jmei on Jul 1, 2014 7:59:16 GMT -5
The Celtics have been over the cap the last half-dozen years or so, so they've had no reason to renounce any of those names. You never know when a guy might come back into the league, and under the old CBA, you could sign-and-trade retired guys as salary filler as part of a bigger trade (think Keith Bogans to the Celtics, but with an actually retired guy).
Two free agent names to watch: Ekpe Udoh and Greg Stiemsma. The Celtics desperately need a true center and rim protection, and both those guys bring some shot-blocking to the table and could be signed for cheap. They're also both young enough (Udoh is 27, Stiemsma is 28) that they might have some upside left, especially since both guys have struggled with injuries of late.
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Post by jmei on Jul 1, 2014 8:06:05 GMT -5
Bradley will probably bet on himself and try to be back on a one year deal to get to unrestricted free agency. If so, that's fine. However, I think the market for him is way overblown. Teams are getting smarter with their cap space and they know Bradley is a nice rotation player and nothing more. He's not a top 3 guy. He should be in the 5m a year range. Anything else is an overpay. The Celts should try to lock him up on a 5 year deal with a starting salary in that range. He's a great 3rd guard and maybe could be more. Can't ignore the injuries but they could work out to form a good compromise. Pretty much no RFA just takes the one-year qualifying offer. Virtually every player prioritizes the security that comes with that first long-term deal, and I would think Bradley (a guy who likes it in Boston and has a significant injury history) would as well. Reports have Philadelphia having contacted him in free agency, and he actually fits them pretty well as a very young free agent who would bring tenacity and professionalism to a team full of rookies/second-year players. They certainly have the cap space to offer him a salary above the MLE, though years may be a question (they would presumably not want to tie up future cap space that's better reserved for trying to attract a star or two). |
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Post by jmei on Jul 1, 2014 8:09:15 GMT -5
Kent Bazemore is also an intriguing name the Celtics have been tied to (Stevens reportedly called him at midnight). He's got potential as a 3-and-D kind of guy. Contending teams will be after him as well, but he might be able to carve out a bigger role (and potentially a higher salary) on a rebuilding Celtics team.
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Post by texs31 on Jul 2, 2014 8:21:50 GMT -5
Steve Bulpett is reporting that Bradley has agreed to terms. Very interested to see what the numbers are.
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Post by rjp313jr on Jul 2, 2014 8:56:59 GMT -5
4/32.... Overpay
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Post by texs31 on Jul 2, 2014 8:58:36 GMT -5
I'm a fan of AB but . . . agreed. If you were willing to go that high, I'd wait until someone else offered it and then match. But, right now, it looks like you outbid yourself.
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Post by jmei on Jul 2, 2014 8:59:14 GMT -5
It's OK, rjp, I won't gloat too much.
ADD: but yeah, I agree, it's more than I would have offered this early in the process. He took a decent step forward this year in terms of his shooting, but his defense slipped and he was injured for a good chunk of the season again. This is an upside play-- Bradley is still only 23 years old, and he still oozes potential. But I think they might have gotten him for less had they waited a few weeks, and there wasn't much risk that another team would have made a substantially larger offer.
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Post by rjp313jr on Jul 2, 2014 9:32:04 GMT -5
Jmei... It's all good, doesn't change what you said. They had the right to match anything and they paid top dollar for what he might do. Just a poor decision. I'll stop short of saying bad but it's poor, especially during an offseason where you didn't need to rush anything. I just don't see paying a #4-6 rotation guy that amount of money. If the stars were in place and the team was using their bird rights and going over the cap then pay whatever you need to keep the guy, but in the rebuild those dollars can haunt you 2-3 years from now.
Is the cap expected to change drastically over the terms of this contract?
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Post by ctfisher on Jul 2, 2014 9:52:30 GMT -5
Yea the cap is going up in a big way whenever they renegotiate the national TV deal. Also, they probably aren't thinking too much about free agency at this point. The Nets are being blown up right now, we'll probably have 2 top-10 picks in next years draft, plus the clippers pick, which means either we'll add a couple of good young players or we'll have some pretty good assets for any trade. I think next offseason is going to be the one where we figure out exactly what the long term plan is going to be. Either Rondo will be gone and we'll probably have even more picks, or we'll have kept him around, which will probably mean that Ainge is looking to use those picks to make a deal. At this stage, I think this offseason is already pretty much over for us, with a mostly full roster and no cap space. I think bogans gets dealt to help some other team free up cap space and we'll probably get a pick or 2 out of it, or maybe someone like Jimmy butler from the bulls if they really need the cap space. Do we still have the amnesty clause? Cause if we do, I wouldn't mind getting a pick or 2 and butler from chicago, taking boozers contract and amnestying him and sending bogans back so they can max out their cap space for melo/whoever. We should use that trade exception now when its probably most valuable and try to get some assets out of the teams looking for stars, given that we're clearly not going to be players in free agency
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Post by rjp313jr on Jul 2, 2014 10:11:50 GMT -5
Yea the cap is going up in a big way whenever they renegotiate the national TV deal. Also, they probably aren't thinking too much about free agency at this point. The Nets are being blown up right now, we'll probably have 2 top-10 picks in next years draft, plus the clippers pick, which means either we'll add a couple of good young players or we'll have some pretty good assets for any trade. I think next offseason is going to be the one where we figure out exactly what the long term plan is going to be. Either Rondo will be gone and we'll probably have even more picks, or we'll have kept him around, which will probably mean that Ainge is looking to use those picks to make a deal. At this stage, I think this offseason is already pretty much over for us, with a mostly full roster and no cap space. I think bogans gets dealt to help some other team free up cap space and we'll probably get a pick or 2 out of it, or maybe someone like Jimmy butler from the bulls if they really need the cap space. Do we still have the amnesty clause? Cause if we do, I wouldn't mind getting a pick or 2 and butler from chicago, taking boozers contract and amnestying him and sending bogans back so they can max out their cap space for melo/whoever. We should use that trade exception now when its probably most valuable and try to get some assets out of the teams looking for stars, given that we're clearly not going to be players in free agency A couple things: 1. We don't have the Nets pick in the 2015 draft. Teams can't trade first rounders in back to back drafts. Call it the Isaiah rule. So we don't much care what they do until the following year and the one 2 years later (2016 & 2018). I believe in 2017 we have the right to swap picks so that matters too. The 2015-16 season has them committed over 62m on Lopez, Williams and Johnson so that team is looking rough. Just hope the East doesn't still suck ass. 2. Amnesty clauses can only be used on guys you dinged prior to the current CBA. Celts never used it but have no one to you it on. The Bulls could use if on Boozer but only the Bulls. If he's traded the next team cannot. 3. Trade exception expired July 12 so it needs to be used before then. |
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Post by texs31 on Jul 2, 2014 10:12:28 GMT -5
Apparantly the Union is already talking lockout during 16/17 season.
BTW Based on what Jodie Meeks got (3/19), maybe this shouldn't be THAT shocking to us. Better player today AND much more upside for the future.
Unrelated - what do people think about Meyers Leonard. Portland is interested in Josh McRoberts and Spencer Hawes but don't have a ton to offer. I know he's big and was a high pick (late riser in the draft process) but, outside of stats, I have no idea how much of a bust he is (or just is on a longer learning curve).
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Post by rjp313jr on Jul 2, 2014 10:16:22 GMT -5
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