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Post by jmei on Jul 31, 2015 22:10:51 GMT -5
Destroying the phone made it easier for the NFL to justify not reducing his suspension. He could have locked it in a safe and suffered no meaningful detriment.
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Post by joshv02 on Aug 1, 2015 6:56:00 GMT -5
Destroying the phone made it easier for the NFL to justify not reducing his suspension. He could have locked it in a safe and suffered no meaningful detriment. Bull****. It's pretext since they have no legal right to the cell phone. Hiding it is just as damning. It's all framing bs.
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Post by chavopepe2 on Aug 1, 2015 6:58:14 GMT -5
Destroying the phone made it easier for the NFL to justify not reducing his suspension. He could have locked it in a safe and suffered no meaningful detriment. Bull****. It's pretext since they have no legal right to the cell phone. Hiding it is just as damning. It's all framing bs. Exactly. Had he not wiped the phone Goodell would have found something else to try and justify the suspension.
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Post by jimed14 on Aug 1, 2015 10:02:05 GMT -5
If it's either an iPhone or an Android, every single thing is stored on the cloud anyway. Anything on the phone could be deleted if he didn't want it seen. This is such a strange distraction that has nothing to do with anything. It's not evidence or absence of evidence. It's meaningless.
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Post by jmei on Aug 1, 2015 10:09:15 GMT -5
Framing matters. In fact, considering how player-unfriendly the disciplinary provisions of the CBA are, public opinion (both the public at large and, more importantly, the 32 owners) might be the only real constraint on the Commissioner's authority. The Ray Rice saga suggests that the Commissioner's disciplinary decisions will significantly conform to what the public and the owners think is appropriate.
I think there is a material difference between saying "you have no legal right to the phone, therefore I will not turn it over" and "I destroyed the phone." Maybe Goodell would have upheld the suspension anyways, but the narrative would be different, and I believe the media reaction would have been more pro-Brady. It's probably not a huge difference, but even a small chance that it would help Brady's case seems enough to justify hanging onto the phone, especially since noone has been able to point to one tangible benefit he got out of destroying it.
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Post by jimed14 on Aug 1, 2015 10:12:22 GMT -5
The only narrative that really matters is that Patriots fans hate it and non-Patriots fans think he should be banned for life and have the titles stripped. The league should be impartial but it is really looks like they're acting like non-Patriots fans.
Whether he turned over the phone or destroyed it wouldn't change anything except it would give the non-Patriots fans one less thing to scream and cry about.
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Post by benogliviesbrother on Aug 1, 2015 10:56:59 GMT -5
Framing matters. In fact, considering how player-unfriendly the disciplinary provisions of the CBA are, public opinion (both the public at large and, more importantly, the 32 owners) might be the only real constraint on the Commissioner's authority. The Ray Rice saga suggests that the Commissioner's disciplinary decisions will significantly conform to what the public and the owners think is appropriate. I think there is a material difference between saying "you have no legal right to the phone, therefore I will not turn it over" and "I destroyed the phone." Maybe Goodell would have upheld the suspension anyways, but the narrative would be different, and I believe the media reaction would have been more pro-Brady. It's probably not a huge difference, but even a small chance that it would help Brady's case seems enough to justify hanging onto the phone, especially since noone has been able to point to one tangible benefit he got out of destroying it. Brady (his lawyer) did say, "you have no legal right to the phone, therefore I will not turn it over" and Brady did not say, "I destroyed the phone." He said it was broken and he gave it to his assistant for disposal. That Commissioner Goodell has chosen to distort that language has not been lost on all of the population, nor all of the media. Prominent national media have seized upon this as evidence against the NFL Office (one even counted the number of times Goodell referenced "destroyed" in his ruling — I believe the count was 17 — as proof the NFL is running a sham "investigation"). I wouldn't be surprised if in the grand scheme of things it proves a very "good thing" (there is a parable about a farmer and his son and horse that illustrates how fleeting a "good thing" can be, and generally entirely contextualized by future events) that Tom Brady disposed of his broken phone and that Commissioner Goodell chose to make it an issue. Hey, anyone read Lupica or Sally Jenkins lately?
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Post by joshv02 on Aug 1, 2015 12:18:06 GMT -5
I hate the argument that goes "well, he had every right to not turn it over, and while I don't think it matters if he turned it over or destroyed it, others may, so he shouldn't have done so."
Bull****.
This is a legal proceeding only. We aren't, or shouldn't be, debating if Brady is winning a pr battle. The or battle is easily won by an honest opinion by the nfl that said"while I would have preferred to see the phone, he had no obligation to give it to me so I won't hold it against him.". The dishonest ones are the ones I blame. Not the honest ones.
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Post by jimed14 on Aug 1, 2015 12:22:12 GMT -5
I seriously just saw a pic on my facebook newsfeed with Aaron Hernandez pretending to talk to Brady telling him to destroy the phone and everything will be fine. smh
Yeah. That's the mentality of the haters. That's close to the same thing.
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Post by jmei on Aug 1, 2015 12:27:52 GMT -5
Framing matters, whether you think it should or not. The email chain released by the Patriots yesterday suggests that they know that. The erroneous initial report that the Patriots' balls were all underinflated to an extreme degree set the stage for the initial furor, just like the phone destruction narrative will set the stage for the appeal. It is not just about the legal arguments. If the NFL senses the PR tide turning against them, their willingness to settle increases.
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Post by rjp313jr on Aug 1, 2015 13:43:59 GMT -5
How about some on the field Patriots talk?
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Post by justen on Aug 1, 2015 14:20:50 GMT -5
How about some on the field Patriots talk? How do we think Blount holds up as this years every-down back? I for one am pretty excited at its potential. Easely came back from the PUP and is now practicing in full pads. Our D-Line definitely has some scary potential with a fully healthy Easely, always consistent Rob N, and a fresh monster in Malcom Brown. Chandler Jones is going to stay healthy and put up big numbers. Not to mention Jones and Branch provide pretty decent depth. I'm still pretty nervous about our secondary holding up, but I expect Allen to really step up and Fletcher to not be a complte flop. Our linebacking/Dline core should provide plenty of relief. Think we all expect another dynamic offense this year, and there's no reason not to even with the subtraction of Brady the first four games. Garoppolo is either going to build a bunch of trade value or potentially cement himself as the heir to Tom, but who knows after guys like Cassel and Mallett.
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Post by ray88h66 on Aug 1, 2015 16:20:33 GMT -5
Brady and the commish both ordered to be in court Aug 12 and Aug 19 by the judge. His orders are fun to read if you are interested. Sounds like a dad telling the kids he'll turn the car around.
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Post by benogliviesbrother on Aug 1, 2015 17:10:57 GMT -5
How about some on the field Patriots talk? How about some — got any? Otherwise why complain about what others are discussing?
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Post by benogliviesbrother on Aug 1, 2015 17:14:25 GMT -5
How about some on the field Patriots talk? How do we think Blount holds up as this years every-down back? I'm not sure we'll even run the ball at all this year, except against the Colts. I'm expecting 75 passes and 50 points per game. Anything less and there will be hell to pay during the week.
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Post by rjp313jr on Aug 2, 2015 8:52:47 GMT -5
They will run the ball. The Treys at guard are more run blocking maulers than pass blockers. I am pretty excited about them as they are much different than most of the guys we've had in the past. I don't know if Blount will be the guy, I think Gray could surprise. He was put in his place last year by BB and if he responds more mature he's the most talented guy in my opinion. He hits the hole faster than Blount but Blount will rip off the 60 yard run.
I was pumped about the Jackson and Mason picks and now they are working with the starters right away. Good sign (I hope).
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Post by rjp313jr on Aug 2, 2015 9:01:52 GMT -5
As for the D-line, there's great potential there. Jebaal Sheard could be a beast if used correctly. I realize it's silly to question BB, but the one major gripe I've had with him in recent years is his over use of Chandler Jones and Rob Ninkovich. Those guys cannot be as beffective playing 90% of the snaps. Their snap count should be around 70% and you will get more production.
Easily, I can't get excited about until he's healthy producing. He just feels like a giant tease which isn't a fair label because last year pretty much unfolded how it was supposed to for him.
Brown was a great pick but just sheer luck that he fell that far. He had no business still being there but sometimes the chips just fall a certain way due to team needs but I'm very happy he's here. Reminds me of the year Vince feel, although very different reasons. Also the position isn't that valued around the league in comparison to others.
Because of the state of the secondary, this team needs great health from the front 7. If the linebackers stay healthy this defense could be very good
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Post by ray88h66 on Aug 4, 2015 20:01:02 GMT -5
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Post by thebrassbuckle1993 on Aug 4, 2015 21:03:55 GMT -5
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wcp3
Veteran
Posts: 3,860
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Post by wcp3 on Aug 4, 2015 21:21:44 GMT -5
It's gonna be fun watching Roger squirm in court after the inevitable defamation lawsuit.
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Post by ray88h66 on Aug 4, 2015 21:25:56 GMT -5
The key point is Brady was under oath. I hope he was telling the truth. Perjury is tough to prove. Bonds and Clemens lied IMO . They weren't found guilty of perjury. But their reps are gone. I'd hate to see Brady join them.
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wcp3
Veteran
Posts: 3,860
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Post by wcp3 on Aug 5, 2015 6:32:00 GMT -5
If there was any other proof against Brady, it would've come out by now.
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Post by greatscottcooper on Aug 6, 2015 9:30:22 GMT -5
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Post by jimed14 on Aug 7, 2015 19:46:10 GMT -5
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Post by chavopepe2 on Aug 7, 2015 20:17:45 GMT -5
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