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2015 Boston Celtics Offseason
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Post by chavopepe2 on Jul 13, 2015 5:20:34 GMT -5
Nice outings from the rooks yesterday:
Rozier: 28 minutes, 22 pts (4/9 fg, 12/13 ft), 5 asts, 2 reb, 1 st, 1 bl, 3 To
Mickey: 31 minutes, 16 pts (7/12 fg, 2/2 ft), 11 reb, 4 bl, 1 st, 3 to
Hunter: 29 minutes, 22 pts (5/15 fg, 8/10 ft), 4 reb, 1 ast, 1 bl, 0 to
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Jul 13, 2015 14:00:48 GMT -5
You really couldn't ask for more then what these 3 rookies have shown so far. Sure they all have things to work on, but what rookie doesn't? I just love how Rozier and Hunter get to the line a ton, that's something the Celtics really need.
I just wish there was more playing time available for them when the season starts. With our depth I wonder how much all three of them will play this year. They have all clearly shown that they are ready to play now and not projects like James Young. How many player can you send to the D league? Can we send all three? That would be fun to watch all three play together and grow while playing a ton of minutes.
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Post by texs31 on Jul 13, 2015 15:26:41 GMT -5
To be taken with the appropriate amount of offseason/deadline salt (and, let's face it, "discussions" could mean anything) but Bulpett is typically fairly plugged in:
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wcp3
Veteran
Posts: 3,860
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Post by wcp3 on Jul 13, 2015 16:43:23 GMT -5
You really couldn't ask for more then what these 3 rookies have shown so far. Sure they all have things to work on, but what rookie doesn't? I just love how Rozier and Hunter get to the line a ton, that's something the Celtics really need. I just wish there was more playing time available for them when the season starts. With our depth I wonder how much all three of them will play this year. They have all clearly shown that they are ready to play now and not projects like James Young. How many player can you send to the D league? Can we send all three? That would be fun to watch all three play together and grow while playing a ton of minutes. Unless there's an enormous roster shakeup and/or a bunch of injuries, all three will start out in the D-league. I suspect one of two will work their way into the rotation at some point during the season. But it will all play out in time. |
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Jul 14, 2015 0:12:17 GMT -5
To be taken with the appropriate amount of offseason/deadline salt (and, let's face it, "discussions" could mean anything) but Bulpett is typically fairly plugged in: Gallinari is a player I like and think would fit well with this team. Right now our small forwards don't shoot the 3ball that well, Gallinari would change that. As a team we could really use Gallinari shooting.
The question is at what cost? Also we no longer really have the players like Wallace or the trade exceptions to trade for him without giving up core pieces. For that reason I don't see a trade happening.
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Post by texs31 on Jul 14, 2015 8:17:37 GMT -5
Remember, though, Danny hasn't executed all of the moves yet. So Wallace and either Babb/Pressey are on the books, not Lee (a difference of 4-5 Million) and we can cut the other NG contract (Babb/Pressey) and renounce the rights to Datome (who just signed a deal overseas). Further, we haven't signed our draft picks yet so we only have their holds (100% of the pool instead of the ~120% that they usually give).
The point is that Boston could easily get to about $8Million under the cap if they need to. Point being is that the salary cap shouldn't prevent Boston/Denver from doing a deal.
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Post by texs31 on Jul 14, 2015 8:30:50 GMT -5
Bleacher Report took a stab at 5 possible trade packages for DG:
1. Avery Bradley for Gallinari - don't see this one as Ainge still loves Bradley and Rozier, while having similar skills sets, isn't the shooter that Bradley is (not that AB is great by any means)
2. Kelly Olynyk, Evan Turner, Phil Pressey and Boston's 2016 1st rounder - Denver might want KO to replace the shooting.
3. James Young, Evan Turner, Chris Babb, Phil Pressey and Dallas' Top 7 protected pick - So Denver is betting on Dallas being a late lotto team and Young improving. That being said, I don't think Boston can include both Babb/Pressey bc 1 is needed for the Lee deal.
4. Jared Sullinger, James Young, Evan Turner and Minnesota's Top 12 protected pick - In this deal, I suppose the "bet" is that Minny stays as a lottery team (VERY possible, if not likely) and the 1st rounder becomes 2 2nds. Otherwise, I think Sully, Young and a 1st is too much.
5. Evan Turner, Phil Pressey, Chris Babb, Minnesota AND Dallas' picks - So, again, you have the Pressey/Babb issue (small but it exists) and, more importantly, you have the fact that this might only amount to Dallas' pick (again, if we assume that Minny's turns into 2 seconds).
So I'm not sure if any of these make sense (#2 the most likely???) but I thought I'd post for discussion purposes.
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Post by jmei on Jul 14, 2015 9:34:27 GMT -5
Because Gallinari is an expiring contract, I would be hesitant to give up much for him. I might be talked into either a promising young player (Olynyk, Sullinger or Young) or one of their upcoming picks, but definitely not both or multiples of the same category.
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Post by chavopepe2 on Jul 14, 2015 9:41:21 GMT -5
Because Gallinari is an expiring contract, I would be hesitant to give up much for him. I might be talked into either a promising young player (Olynyk, Sullinger or Young) or one of their upcoming picks, but definitely not both or multiples of the same category. I think the deal that makes sense is either Sully or Olynyk plus one or two favorable 2nd rounders. It doesn't make sense to me to deal the Dallas pick or their own pick. |
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Post by texs31 on Jul 14, 2015 9:51:20 GMT -5
Yeah. The Brooklyn picks, needless to say (but I'll say it) are off limits. Dallas as well. The Minny pick could very easily be 2 second rounders so I'd consider that one I suppose. Of course, our own 1st rounder hopefully gets worse and worse as the years go by.
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Post by texs31 on Jul 14, 2015 10:00:19 GMT -5
Just to cut off any thoughts of expanding this to include Ty Lawson (whom some, mostly in the media, feel would be a Boston target), Chris Mannix is reporting he's just been busted for another DUI.
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Jul 14, 2015 11:38:22 GMT -5
Looking at this team the deal that would have made sense was to ship Wallace and a late first round pick to Denver for Gallinari. Say Memphis pick as long as its not in lottery (not likely, but you never know). I see Olynyk and Sullinger value being higher then a late first rounder. It's going to be a shame if we trade one of these two just because we got David Lee. Sure I like Lee, but he is getting up there in age. As much as I love Sullinger, from a team building point of view you have to trade him, as Olynyk is our only big that can really shoot it from long range. That being said Olynyk is a much better fit on Denver, so that's who I bet they would want.
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Jul 14, 2015 14:07:28 GMT -5
Bleacher Report took a stab at 5 possible trade packages for DG: 1. Avery Bradley for Gallinari - don't see this one as Ainge still loves Bradley and Rozier, while having similar skills sets, isn't the shooter that Bradley is (not that AB is great by any means) 2. Kelly Olynyk, Evan Turner, Phil Pressey and Boston's 2016 1st rounder - Denver might want KO to replace the shooting. 3. James Young, Evan Turner, Chris Babb, Phil Pressey and Dallas' Top 7 protected pick - So Denver is betting on Dallas being a late lotto team and Young improving. That being said, I don't think Boston can include both Babb/Pressey bc 1 is needed for the Lee deal. 4. Jared Sullinger, James Young, Evan Turner and Minnesota's Top 12 protected pick - In this deal, I suppose the "bet" is that Minny stays as a lottery team (VERY possible, if not likely) and the 1st rounder becomes 2 2nds. Otherwise, I think Sully, Young and a 1st is too much. 5. Evan Turner, Phil Pressey, Chris Babb, Minnesota AND Dallas' picks - So, again, you have the Pressey/Babb issue (small but it exists) and, more importantly, you have the fact that this might only amount to Dallas' pick (again, if we assume that Minny's turns into 2 seconds). So I'm not sure if any of these make sense (#2 the most likely???) but I thought I'd post for discussion purposes. The more I think about #1 is not that bad of an option. I love Avery Bradley and he is still only 24 years old, but he is not getting any better. I can understand an adjust with Rondo out and Smart and Turner moving in on offence. What I don't understand is how his D keep going down. Two years ago was 6th on DRPM, this year 13th. On offence he is basically a stand up 3 point shooter or he takes a mid range shot. He is a bad passer, a bad rebounder and doesn't take it to the basket at all, so he gets almost no FT's. He is also undersized. I don't think he should be starting. The more minutes he plays, the less defensive effort he seems to give. I just see a bench 3 and D player.
Gallinari shooting would off set the loss of Bradley's shooting. Would love to see Rozier and Hunter get some minutes at SG, if not have one of them starting. Lets not forget that Rozier is a Bradley type of ball hawk on D with better size and more athletic. I see Rozier like Smart last year, not sure how they will do on offence, but you know they are going to be very good on D.
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Post by texs31 on Jul 14, 2015 14:20:10 GMT -5
Boston has traded for Perry Jones III. Not sure of the full details but it also is being reported that C's are getting a 2nd rounder. I'm guessing it's only a pick as Danny is probabaly getting rewarded for helping OKC's tax situation after they matched the Kanter offer sheet.
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Post by jmei on Jul 14, 2015 14:37:31 GMT -5
Boston has traded for Perry Jones III. Not sure of the full details but it also is being reported that C's are getting a 2nd rounder. I'm guessing it's only a pick as Danny is probabaly getting rewarded for helping OKC's tax situation after they matched the Kanter offer sheet. Yeah, that's a good read of the situation. It'll be a crowded depth chart, but Jones is super duper interesting. |
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Post by texs31 on Jul 14, 2015 14:44:46 GMT -5
Sounds like it's a highly protected pick (probably one of those Top 55 protected types that will never actually get conveyed but is required, as a minimum, by NBA rules). Meanwhile, Boston is getting Det's 2nd rounder that OKC received in the BJax trade.
Boston is also receiving cash. Bulpett offers that Jones isn't a lock to make the roster but he'll get a look. His contract is guaranteed but the cash could offset that if Boston decides to cut bait.
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Jul 14, 2015 14:52:59 GMT -5
Like the trade. Really thought we should have picked him over Fab Melo a couple years back. I just don't see the fit as currently our SF of Turner and Crowder both really can't shoot and neither can Jones.
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Post by texs31 on Jul 14, 2015 15:01:10 GMT -5
TINY sample size but he started off well last year when he was thrust into a starting (and almost staring) role when KD was out. He scored 32, 20 and 16 points in games 2-4 shooting well (including 3FGM). Then he got hurt, missed the next month and was never the same.
So while the numbers (and sample size) aren't enough to refute your comment about him being a bad shooter, I will say it provides some insight into what he could be.
He'll get a chance to show if he CAN be the scoring SWING player (using Forsberg's suggested depth chart positions). If not, he'll likely be cut.
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Post by ctfisher on Jul 14, 2015 15:07:30 GMT -5
Another example of Ainge crushing the rebuilding process. Don't think the fit really matters that much, Jones is a great athlete, 23, 6'11 and can play on the perimeter. Can't have enough raw talent in my opinion, and he played pretty well at the start of last season without Westbrook and KD. Still, that frontcourt is getting seriously crowded, and I think there has to be some kind of trade coming to free up some minutes, and personally I'd like to see Olynyk go, I've never been a big fan of his, his skill set is pretty redundant as an offense-first big who really doesn't play much d at all, and his hair has always pissed me off
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Post by jmei on Jul 14, 2015 15:07:53 GMT -5
It's definitely a crowded depth chart, but the flexibility of most of the roster (especially the guards/wings) means there are a lot of opportunities to thin it out via injury, trade, benching or D-League assignment.
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Post by ctfisher on Jul 14, 2015 15:10:19 GMT -5
TINY sample size but he started off well last year when he was thrust into a starting (and almost staring) role when KD was out. He scored 32, 20 and 16 points in games 2-4 shooting well (including 3FGM). Then he got hurt, missed the next month and was never the same. So while the numbers (and sample size) aren't enough to refute your comment about him being a bad shooter, I will say it provides some insight into what he could be. He'll get a chance to show if he CAN be the scoring SWING player (using Forsberg's suggested depth chart positions). If not, he'll likely be cut. Don't think he ends up cut regardless- I think there's a little too much talent there, bet they could at least pick up a 2nd rounder for him. On the shooting question, I remember him having a good-looking shot with some range in college, so at the very least, he could play the 4, put the ball on the deck and be a threat from 20ish feet in, which amounts to a relatively useful player in my book |
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Post by texs31 on Jul 14, 2015 15:23:06 GMT -5
Yeah, I think this is a low risk, med-to-high reward shot at filling the role some thought Danilo Gallinari might fill (scoring Swing Player).
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wcp3
Veteran
Posts: 3,860
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Post by wcp3 on Jul 14, 2015 16:09:16 GMT -5
TINY sample size but he started off well last year when he was thrust into a starting (and almost staring) role when KD was out. He scored 32, 20 and 16 points in games 2-4 shooting well (including 3FGM). Then he got hurt, missed the next month and was never the same. So while the numbers (and sample size) aren't enough to refute your comment about him being a bad shooter, I will say it provides some insight into what he could be. He'll get a chance to show if he CAN be the scoring SWING player (using Forsberg's suggested depth chart positions). If not, he'll likely be cut. He was never the same partially because Brooks was a dreadful coach who found a way to ruin young players' confidence. Not a huge Jones fan, but I think he's a heck of a lot better than what he showed in OKC (obviously). Curious to see what kind of player he becomes under a real coach with a real system. |
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Post by texs31 on Jul 14, 2015 16:27:17 GMT -5
C's are working on a deal with Mickey. I'm assuming they'd guarantee the first year (but maybe not). Even so, I really think they like him. So what we'll have after all reported moves (for now, I'll assume both Babb and Pressey are gone - one in the Lee trade, one released) and using the 4-position system that Forsberg referred to:
Ball Handlers (4): Marcus Smart, Isaiah Thomas, Evan Turner, Terry Rozier
Wings (3): Avery Bradley, James Young, R.J. Hunter
Swings (3): Jae Crowder, Jonas Jerebko, Perry Jones III
Bigs (6): Amir Johnson, Kelly Olynyk, Jared Sullinger, Tyler Zeller, David Lee, Jordan Mickey (though I believe he was listed as a Swing in Forsberg's previous breakdown
So that's 16 players under contract (the working assumption is that Marcus Thornton will not sign an NBA deal this year and either head overseas or go to the D-League. Gotta believe we'll see more (then again, as pointed out above, doubt we'll dump a contract just so we can keep Jordan Mickey).
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Post by rjp313jr on Jul 15, 2015 9:44:13 GMT -5
The Williams buyout could be the best thing ever for Boston or bad luck. It all depends on the impact he will have in Dallas. Perhaps he just made a lottery team a playoff team or maybe he just bumped them into the late lotto. Losing him makes the Nets worse which is very nice but I worry they are still a playoff team in the East. Hopefully, the Knicks did enough to jump into the playoffs. Here are the playoff teams in the East, as I see them today, in no particular order:
1. Atl
2. Clev
3. Chi
4. Wash
5. Tor
6. Mil
7. Boston
Then you got Miami/BK/NYK/IND
I don't know but hopefully Brookkyn won't be in that spot. Regardless, it needs to be a top 5 pick for it to really matter the way it needs to matter. Are they that bad to be top 5? They still have Joe Johnson and Lopez. The talk of the Johnson trades is nonsense, he's borderline unreadable.
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