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Post by rjp313jr on Apr 2, 2019 12:15:29 GMT -5
Looks like Bennett will be here for 2 years after reworking that deal. I’m surprised he did it to be honest.
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Post by texs31 on Apr 2, 2019 14:08:59 GMT -5
For additional draft info, Matt Miller (Bleacher Report) is releasing his Top 400 players for the 2019 Draft. I feel like Matt is getting more traction in the Draft Expert community. Regardless of what you feel about his rankings/grades, there is a lot of information. Positives/Negatives/Grades/Projected Rd/Potential. There is also a player comp (I tend not to look at those as I feel their usefulness is limited) for each. Up first, the RBs. His mock drafts annoy the crap out of me Any more so than others? Just scanning his recent top 15 and they seem pretty much in line with general consensus. Beyond that, most Mocks are useless anyway. |
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Post by rjp313jr on Apr 2, 2019 14:33:01 GMT -5
His mock drafts annoy the crap out of me Any more so than others? Just scanning his recent top 15 and they seem pretty much in line with general consensus. Beyond that, most Mocks are useless anyway. I’m pretty sure he’s the one that keeps calling corner a big need for the Patriots. Add: yup he is... it’s literally their lowest need |
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Post by texs31 on Apr 2, 2019 14:37:53 GMT -5
Hadn't seen that but Team Needs is another area I tend to ignore during this season.
Would agree with you on that front (not to say it would shock me if they took one bc . . . Bill Belichek).
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Post by philarhody on Apr 2, 2019 18:43:58 GMT -5
Kiper Jr. was on the Ryen Russillo Show saying he feels like Mclaurin could be sneaking into the 1st. Also Boykin.
Is the league getting smarter?
Mclaurin is awesome. Special teams and team captain. If Boykin has a clue he’s probably gonna be a beast
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Post by costpet on Apr 3, 2019 7:26:24 GMT -5
The best Mock Draft? Chances are 50% or greater that the Pats trade out of the 1st round, 25% they trade up, only 25% the use it.
BB never drafts on need, just quality.
That's why I'm not staying up until 11:30 PM just to watch them trade out of the 1st round. It's Day 2 where the real action happens.
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Post by rjp313jr on Apr 3, 2019 8:10:05 GMT -5
The best Mock Draft? Chances are 50% or greater that the Pats trade out of the 1st round, 25% they trade up, only 25% the use it. BB never drafts on need, just quality. That's why I'm not staying up until 11:30 PM just to watch them trade out of the 1st round. It's Day 2 where the real action happens. I’ll stay up because I like the draft but I’m going to quibble with you a little bit on your assessment of their draft strategy. They draft for need. They don’t simply take best player available regardless of position and sort it out later. Now we don’t always agree with them on what the needs are or how high a priority those needs are and/or they may address them later in the draft but the Patriots team build thru the draft - selecting players they think can fill certain roles for them. Those may be as simple as special teams (hence taking a long snapper in round 5) or bigger roles like taking a tackle and running back in the first last year after losing your starting left tackle and wanting to transition to more of a power football team. Do you think Wynn just happened to be the best player available last year? I could be wrong or stating the obvious but I do feel the Patriots are a definite draft for need type team, I just think Bill sees things differently than us. If they don’t draft a WR and/or TE in the top 4 rounds then I may have to change my perception... barring other trades of course |
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Post by texs31 on Apr 3, 2019 8:30:53 GMT -5
If I were to guess, I'd think he uses a system similar to the tiering system that we talk about in the NBA draft. He stacks based on the categories that we've (thanks to the Caserio interview) talked about before. Based on what we've heard/observed, he'll also look to see if he can still get 1 or more of the guys while also adding additional value by trading back.
He'll factor in need for sure. But I'd also argue that need may not be "present day". He seems to look down the road when defining need.
So do I think he drafted Wynn ONLY bc he was the bpa? No. Do I think he drafted him bc he thought he had an immediate need on the OL that Wynn would definitely fill? Also, no. But I DO think he looked at the needs across the OL for the next 2-3 years and felt that a LT or LG would very likely become a need that Wynn had a high probability of being able to fill.
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Post by voiceofreason on Apr 3, 2019 8:33:02 GMT -5
Looks like Bennett will be here for 2 years after reworking that deal. I’m surprised he did it to be honest. Not sure why you are surprised. He wanted a raise and he got one, looks like 1.5 million or more right? He didn't really have any leverage other than not showing up and given he is on the backside that doesn't make much sense. I think he was happy the Pats gave him something actually. |
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Post by texs31 on Apr 3, 2019 8:34:57 GMT -5
Looks like Bennett will be here for 2 years after reworking that deal. I’m surprised he did it to be honest. I'm not an expert on the CAP so I'm defaulting to Miguel on this (and, in this case, Bedard using Miguel's "capology"). Seems that the extension guarantees that he's on the team this year (skill set suggested that it was WAY more than likely but the contract, in it's previous state, was very cuttable with little-to-no guarantees). The extension changes that I think. In an article today, Bedard is looking at 2020 where NE has a crazy amount of CAP Space (even "effective CAP Space" that considers getting to 51 players using cheap salaries to fill in - NE has only 31 currently). Laying out the depth chart as is, he lists Bennett as a potential cap casualty. |
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Post by rjp313jr on Apr 3, 2019 8:39:21 GMT -5
If I were to guess, I'd think he uses a system similar to the tiering system that we talk about in the NBA draft. He stacks based on the categories that we've (thanks to the Caserio interview) talked about before. Based on what we've heard/observed, he'll also look to see if he can still get 1 or more of the guys while also adding additional value by trading back. He'll factor in need for sure. But I'd also argue that need may not be "present day". He seems to look down the road when defining need. So do I think he drafted Wynn ONLY bc he was the bpa? No. Do I think he drafted him bc he thought he had an immediate need on the OL that Wynn would definitely fill? Also, no. But I DO think he looked at the needs across the OL for the next 2-3 years and felt that a LT or LG would very likely become a need that Wynn had a high probability of being able to fill. Yes I agree he looks to the future as much as present; he knows the reality is the true impact starts in year 2 for most players. Which is why the tight end and wide receiver positions are kinda scary right now. |
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Post by voiceofreason on Apr 3, 2019 8:40:08 GMT -5
After being successful targeting trades of picks for veterans in recent drafts I am looking forward to seeing how BB fills some of these holes. I would think WR is the obvious spot but who will it be.
VanNoy, Brown and Cooks were all good deals that worked out well, I only wish they could have realized what they had in Brown early on and signed him to an ext. before his value sky rocketed.
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Post by rjp313jr on Apr 3, 2019 8:43:29 GMT -5
After being successful targeting trades of picks for veterans in recent drafts I am looking forward to seeing how BB fills some of these holes. I would think WR is the obvious spot but who will it be. VanNoy, Brown and Cooks were all good deals that worked out well, I only wish they could have realized what they had in Brown early on and signed him to an ext. before his value sky rocketed. Time will tell on Brown. He’s a guy who’s motivation was questioned then he put together a very good (not spectacular) season in a contract year. |
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Post by costpet on Apr 3, 2019 8:48:33 GMT -5
From what I've read, he rates players on the rounds they should go in. He may look at all the players and only see 16 or so players that rate a 1st round pick. If they're not there when it's his turn, he'll look to trade down for more picks. Also, he usually only has 80 or so players he would pick on his board. A really short list. The rest he's not interested in. That factors in when he's deciding to pick or trade the pick. I could see him trading his 1st for a 2nd and 5th. Loading up on 2nd and 3rd (6 picks) gives him a lot of really good choices. It also helps the cap room, too.
Delving into the mind of BB is a fun exercise. There's a lot going on in there.
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Post by voiceofreason on Apr 3, 2019 9:05:06 GMT -5
After being successful targeting trades of picks for veterans in recent drafts I am looking forward to seeing how BB fills some of these holes. I would think WR is the obvious spot but who will it be. VanNoy, Brown and Cooks were all good deals that worked out well, I only wish they could have realized what they had in Brown early on and signed him to an ext. before his value sky rocketed. Time will tell on Brown. He’s a guy who’s motivation was questioned then he put together a very good (not spectacular) season in a contract year. Not to mention the Dante effect!! |
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Post by texs31 on Apr 3, 2019 9:32:29 GMT -5
From what I've read, he rates players on the rounds they should go in. He may look at all the players and only see 16 or so players that rate a 1st round pick. If they're not there when it's his turn, he'll look to trade down for more picks. Also, he usually only has 80 or so players he would pick on his board. A really short list. The rest he's not interested in. That factors in when he's deciding to pick or trade the pick. I could see him trading his 1st for a 2nd and 5th. Loading up on 2nd and 3rd (6 picks) gives him a lot of really good choices. It also helps the cap room, too. Delving into the mind of BB is a fun exercise. There's a lot going on in there. In the article posted at the beginning of this thread, that's not true. He doesn't stack the board by projected round, instead choosing to stack by projected role they'd have with the Pats. Then, obviously, across by position. I believe they also do their own mock drafts (and may even consider those from the "experts") to give them a sense of whether they need to move up to get a guy, can move back and still get a guy that is in the highest category at the time, or should stay put and pick a player. The part about a small list of players does seem to be true, based on that article. |
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Apr 3, 2019 10:44:43 GMT -5
No article is going to explain how the Patriots draft. It can give you insight, but that's it. That article also talks about how they rate guys horizontal for round and vertical by starter, potential starter, back up, depth, etc. So they rate guys by round, every team does. Frankly how couldn't you?
Example; last year I was pissed they punted so many picks. Yet the way they talked about Bentley, the way he played right away, the way he got the mic after two games. It seemed rather clear they ranked him crazy high as a starter. So instead of just taking him in the second or third they kept trading back. You can argue they still slightly overdrafted him yet it could have been much worse if the Patriots didn't list players by rounds to Target them. Something that seems to have changed because of picks like Wilson and Richards.
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Post by texs31 on Apr 3, 2019 11:36:57 GMT -5
1. Almost everytime I've referenced the article, I've used some form of the term "if we want to believe them" (admittedly not this last time).
2. This article has direct quotes from involved/informed parties
3. Lombardi clearly states that "instead of predicting rounds, [Belicheck's draft] system forced our scouts to grade every player as a (1) starter, (2) potential starter, (3) developmental player, (4) backup or (5) someone who couldn't make any NFL team" - that's a direct quote
4. The additional information gleaned by peforming and reviewing mock drafts is "how couldn't you". Once you're board is stacked, you use that information (as I said) to determine how to navigate the draft board.
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Apr 3, 2019 12:22:42 GMT -5
How does what Lombardi said mean the Patriots don't grade guys by round? He just says they don't ask the scouts to assign round grades. I take that to mean the guys making the picks like Bill just want to know how good the guys are from scouts, not where they would take them. That he or someone else will set value and a draft plan.
That article litterally says the board lists rounds with players on it. Saying could those guys listed in round four be targets? Now I can't read that board in that picture, but I'm going to assume it says that based on the article. So it seems rather foolish to act like they don't rank players by rounds or pick rounds to target guys. You can use whatever system you want to grade the player. Instead of numbers like most scouts they use starter, potential starter, back up, etc. Yet you still need to come up with a draft plan and what those grades mean to you.
Are we really going to assume the Patriots don't look at value? They really like Stanley Morgan. Rank him as a starter, so they'll take him in the first? Bill has talked about value in the draft for decades. It's why he makes so many trades to get the players he wants where he wants them in the draft. Which would litterally be impossible without a draft strategy that involves grading the player based on rounds or at minimum where you think he'll get drafted/where you value them.
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Post by texs31 on Apr 3, 2019 12:31:32 GMT -5
Your last paragraph demonstrates (not surprisingly) that you've chosen to ignore part of my posts. Feel what you like.
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Apr 3, 2019 12:53:10 GMT -5
I'm just pointing out what the article actually says. It talks about a grading system, what they ask of scouts and that the draft board list rounds with players in them.
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Post by costpet on Apr 3, 2019 15:43:36 GMT -5
What would you pay to be able sit in the Pats draft room and listen while BB and the scouts decide their next picks?
I'd pony up $3000.
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mobaz
Veteran
Posts: 3,044
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Post by mobaz on Apr 3, 2019 15:50:20 GMT -5
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Post by rjp313jr on Apr 3, 2019 16:01:14 GMT -5
What would you pay to be able sit in the Pats draft room and listen while BB and the scouts decide their next picks? I'd pony up $3000. I wouldn’t but it would be great |
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Apr 3, 2019 16:29:46 GMT -5
Michael Bennett had all charges dropped.
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