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2019 Celtics Offseason Thread
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Post by texs31 on May 8, 2019 20:03:21 GMT -5
And so it begins
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Post by soxfansince67 on May 8, 2019 20:40:35 GMT -5
Thoughts on whether Stevens may actually be in trouble? Horrendous performance much of the year with the skill level. Or, was it toxic Kyrie? What a mess to figure out.
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Post by Don Caballero on May 8, 2019 21:04:58 GMT -5
Thoughts on whether Stevens may actually be in trouble? Horrendous performance much of the year with the skill level. Or, was it toxic Kyrie? What a mess to figure out. Stevens is safe for another year, he earned that I think. Struggle again next season and he's gone. |
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Post by texs31 on May 8, 2019 21:22:13 GMT -5
Assuming Kyrie is gone, I feel like you have to see what it all looks like (including "non-star but likely better than this" Gordon Hayward) before a drastic decision like firing Stevens.
Big question for me is Rozier? Dont want him to leave for nothing but don't know if signing him for 15-16 is the way to go either.
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Post by umassgrad2005 on May 8, 2019 21:29:31 GMT -5
Tender Rozier a contract and see what happens.
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Post by Don Caballero on May 8, 2019 21:38:41 GMT -5
Tender Rozier a contract and see what happens. Oh God please don't, it's about time they move on from Rozier. |
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wcp3
Veteran
Posts: 3,860
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Post by wcp3 on May 8, 2019 21:46:31 GMT -5
We’re not actually talking about Stevens’ career being in jeopardy, are we? Because that ain’t even close to true.
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Post by texs31 on May 8, 2019 21:52:13 GMT -5
I believe the suggestion is to make him the QO (keep him restricted).
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Post by umassgrad2005 on May 8, 2019 23:22:37 GMT -5
Tender Rozier a contract and see what happens. Oh God please don't, it's about time they move on from Rozier. Why? |
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Post by Don Caballero on May 9, 2019 0:23:32 GMT -5
Money issues, I think there's a clear chance they could have to overpay for Terry and he has too many overlapping skills with Smart. I don't think he's getting a big contract, but any contract he gets counts towards the cap. They have a billion draft picks, Danny should use one of them to get a steady backup PG. |
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Post by Don Caballero on May 9, 2019 0:30:19 GMT -5
We’re not actually talking about Stevens’ career being in jeopardy, are we? Because that ain’t even close to true. He was quick to point out to the bad job he did this year on the post game interview which is nice. He's a smart guy, he knows it. He does need to come out next season with a clearer plan, whatever the plan was this year guys never bought it. I don't think he makes it past another tumultuous season if the team sucks as badly as they did this year, maybe some college team comes up and offers some big money and he's gone. |
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Post by umassgrad2005 on May 9, 2019 0:30:57 GMT -5
Rozier's qualifying offer is 4.3 million.
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Post by pedrofanforever45 on May 9, 2019 4:30:46 GMT -5
Rozier's qualifying offer is 4.3 million. I mean, obviously he you take him back on just the QO, but what if someone offers more than that? What do you realistically put a cap on what you're willing to spend on a player who *seriously* regressed and cost himself a ton of money this off-season? |
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Post by pedrofanforever45 on May 9, 2019 4:56:24 GMT -5
Celtics really needed to make a push in the playoffs and show the world that they are here to stay.
Now the Celtics might have to take 4 steps back, develop Brown and Tatum, build around them. This is what I'm expecting to happen. This is the plan the Celtics might be forced to be dealt with.
Danny Ainge could force a situation if he's getting antsy and put all the chips in, but that's risky given the high probability that you lost one of your best assets in Kyrie.
He's either putting all the chips on the table, or he's taking 4 steps back. I don't see a inbetween this off-season. Anthony Davis is getting traded this off-season and Danny has had a man crush on him for 6 years.
If you take 4 steps back, then AT LEAST GO SIGN A BIG MAN PLEASE?!!! Enough of the often injured big man with iffy talent. Horford has talent, just not big man talent. He's a Power Forward at best at this point. Get a Center. Go sign Nikola Vučević. Someone who can rebound the stupid basketball. If not him, find someone else. Jesus anybody who is a regular and who is a big man and who plays like a big man. At least do this for my own sanity, please?
If you put all your chips in, find 2 BETTER players right now than Kyrie. He's better with better talent around him. I'm not expecting this to happen though. I give it a 5 percent chance.
Mediocrity and low ceiling teams, here we come (for a while, until maybe Tatum and Brown become CONSISTENT stars, HENCE THE WORD CONSISTENT)
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wcp3
Veteran
Posts: 3,860
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Post by wcp3 on May 9, 2019 6:08:26 GMT -5
We’re not actually talking about Stevens’ career being in jeopardy, are we? Because that ain’t even close to true. He was quick to point out to the bad job he did this year on the post game interview which is nice. He's a smart guy, he knows it. He does need to come out next season with a clearer plan, whatever the plan was this year guys never bought it. I don't think he makes it past another tumultuous season if the team sucks as badly as they did this year, maybe some college team comes up and offers some big money and he's gone. If the Celtics were a joke organization that might be the case, but they’re not. Brad’s job is very, very safe. I’ve obviously been highly critical of him all year, but I stand by my past statement that’s he’s one of the ~3 best coaches in the game. Coaches can have bad seasons, just as players can, and I think that’s all that happened this year. But Ainge knows they’re in good shape as a franchise having Stevens at the helm long term. And you can count on one hand the number of college teams that might have an opening soon and can pay more than the Celtics. They’d also have to convince him to go back to having to recruit, which I doubt Stevens wants to do again. |
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Post by texs31 on May 9, 2019 7:20:39 GMT -5
I may be oversimplifying it but Kyrie seemed to validate the sentiment at the tune of the trade that hes a #2, not a #1.
IF we accept that, the the path to a championship is to have 2 players of his level or better. The easiest path is too keep Kyrie and use your assets to get the #1 (presumably AD).
The questions then:
1. Do you believe hes #2 or is he too toxic
2. Does he want to be #2
3. Is AD a #1 (talentwise, it's obvious but #1 should be your leader. Is he?)
4. If not AD, who?
5. If not Kyrie and AD, what's your path to comparable guys.
6. How long can you wait for #5
7. Since I know the comments will come, do we think the team that was 1 game away from the Finals a sustainable contender or was that lightning in a bottle.
I'm sure there are more but that's the immediate download (Kyrie specific)
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nomar
Veteran
Posts: 11,596
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Post by nomar on May 9, 2019 7:46:08 GMT -5
Keep Tatum and Brown.
Sign Kemba Walker.
Draft Bol Bol.
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Post by texs31 on May 9, 2019 8:12:45 GMT -5
How do you sign Kemba with no cap space?
EDIT: So you could renounce EVERYONE who is a an FA (assuming Al opts out) and have room but I really don't think that's the way to go.
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mobaz
Veteran
Posts: 3,044
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Post by mobaz on May 9, 2019 9:13:28 GMT -5
Tatum needs some new voices in his game. Huge step back this year (taking too many step backs too on the nose?). Whatever he worked on last summer, do the opposite. Tatum's lack of development was maybe the 2nd biggest loss in this losing season.
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Post by Don Caballero on May 9, 2019 9:31:05 GMT -5
If the Celtics were a joke organization that might be the case, but they’re not. Brad’s job is very, very safe. I’ve obviously been highly critical of him all year, but I stand by my past statement that’s he’s one of the ~3 best coaches in the game. Coaches can have bad seasons, just as players can, and I think that’s all that happened this year. But Ainge knows they’re in good shape as a franchise having Stevens at the helm long term. And you can count on one hand the number of college teams that might have an opening soon and can pay more than the Celtics. They’d also have to convince him to go back to having to recruit, which I doubt Stevens wants to do again. Yeah you can count on one hand, but one of those teams might be Duke. Do you think that if Boston has another turmoil riddled season and get bounced in the first round in the next playoffs that both the team or the coach wouldn't consider maybe a change of scenery? Rozier's qualifying offer is 4.3 million. If Kyrie is back? I still wouldn't do it. If Kyrie is not back? Then yeah, you're right, that wouldn't be a bad idea. |
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Post by jimed14 on May 9, 2019 9:39:12 GMT -5
Agree with Don. Coach K probably isn't going to be around much longer. He's got that taking way too prescription drugs slur going on this year. I think his health is questionable. He's had 6 surgeries in the last 3 years and is 72.
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Post by umassgrad2005 on May 9, 2019 12:06:19 GMT -5
Rozier's qualifying offer is 4.3 million. I mean, obviously he you take him back on just the QO, but what if someone offers more than that? What do you realistically put a cap on what you're willing to spend on a player who *seriously* regressed and cost himself a ton of money this off-season? I make the offer and see how things play out. If I had my way, if Irving leaves let him play on that deal and see how he does. Could be the best thing for both team and player. If he turns into Scary Terry as a starter again he'll get paid. He likely won't receive any good offers this year, not considering he turned down 12 million per extension last year because he wanted 20 million. |
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Post by umassgrad2005 on May 9, 2019 12:45:07 GMT -5
I may be oversimplifying it but Kyrie seemed to validate the sentiment at the tune of the trade that hes a #2, not a #1. IF we accept that, the the path to a championship is to have 2 players of his level or better. The easiest path is too keep Kyrie and use your assets to get the #1 (presumably AD). The questions then: 1. Do you believe hes #2 or is he too toxic 2. Does he want to be #2 3. Is AD a #1 (talentwise, it's obvious but #1 should be your leader. Is he?) 4. If not AD, who? 5. If not Kyrie and AD, what's your path to comparable guys. 6. How long can you wait for #5 7. Since I know the comments will come, do we think the team that was 1 game away from the Finals a sustainable contender or was that lightning in a bottle. I'm sure there are more but that's the immediate download (Kyrie specific) Interesting because from the moment he requested trade from the Cavs I took all his comments to be he thought he was a #1 and he needed to get out from LeBrons shadow. Talent wise he's probably a #1, he just doesn't play team ball, never has and really thinks he's better than he is. I know RJP loves the guy, but I'm with Pedro I think he has some major issues. He's still young so maybe he can grow. Yet if he demands another star player to resign he hasn't changed. Frankly he needs a non-players coach. He needs a Doc Rivers to rip into him on a nightly basis like he did with Rondo. That's the thing with Davis, he seems just like Irving. He's better, has more talent. Yet he never made player around him better and didn't come close to winning enough given the talent around him. I don't like that pairing one bit. My hope would be Davis could change under Stevens, buy in. Yet Iving could make that hard. Way too early for that, yet I focus on building around the young core. I'd also consider bringing Thomas back if Irving leaves. Vet minimum type deal for a bench role to see if he has anything left. Loved his leadership. The real question to me, is will Hayward ever regain any explosion to his game? Like was that him 100% or does he just need more time? If he's done, which is likely crazy hard to tell, a trade might back sense if Irving leaves. That would give you max cap space. You'd have to at least try it if Durant is really leaving right? I don't think it was luck at all. Horford, Tatum, Brown, and Rozier all played a lot better without Irving because they played team ball and great D. They had great chemistry. This year everyone of them took a step back with Irving healthy. Add a big time bench scorer, a guy like Lou Williams or guy like Randle and they are legit. I believe in Tatum and Brown still has massive upside. They just need the opportunity to grow their games, that didn't happen with Irving. Get back to defensive first and team ball. |
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Post by voiceofreason on May 9, 2019 13:17:12 GMT -5
Stevens got the C's back to the playoffs sooner than anyone expected with a bunch of nobodies. Then in 2017 they make it to the ECF with a decent group of players. Then in 2018 he gets them back to the ECF with a different group minus their supposed 2 best players. He has proven he is a very very good coach. What he hasn't proven is if he can coach a guy who thinks he is better than he is and destroys a locker room with his immaturity.
Stevens isn't going anywhere and nor should he. Danny needs to have a father/son talk,lecture with Kyrie then go get AD. Either that or they start over and I don't think that is happening. Then again that father/son talk might not go so well.
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Post by umassgrad2005 on May 9, 2019 14:00:54 GMT -5
The real question to me, is will Hayward ever regain any explosion to his game? Like was that him 100% or does he just need more time? If he's done, which is likely crazy hard to tell, a trade might back sense if Irving leaves. That would give you max cap space. You'd have to at least try it if Durant is really leaving right? Could you trade Hayward at this point? If it's possible, what do you think that trade would look like? I don't see why you couldn't to a rebuilding team. Picks and/or young players. The cost really depends on how many teams would be willing. Which is kinda hard right now to know. Yet it's one more year, then it's a huge expiring deal. A smart rebuilding team could get value twice for him. He's also a solid Veteran that was one of the few people to keep his mouth shut all year. Rebuilding teams wouldn't mind him, he could help the young guys. If you want to get creative you could trade him for Conley. A guy that seems to fit our style and culture better than Irving. If they trade Conley to another team and rebuild that would be a good trade partner to dump him. Say our two late first round picks, or our first this year and next year. You only do this though if you can get a stud free agent though. No one will think the optics are bad dumping Hayward for a Durant for example. Lot's of options, going to be an interesting off-season. |
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