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2023 Trade Deadline Thread
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Post by rhswanzey on Aug 2, 2023 21:34:44 GMT -5
Today was another very good starting performance. Their starting pitching is not failing them. Unless they are lying about the health of the three guys coming back, I really think it is ok they didn’t get a rental 5/6 starter. It is possible that person would get 2 starts then go to the bullpen. Oh, Kutter was great. But the bullpen choices today speak volumes - about availability, not an indictment of who Cora picked. It’s the Why. Sending Schreiber out for a second inning after 27 pitches and two XBH Then, up 3-2 bottom 7 on the road, with 1st and 2nd nobody out, the call here is… Bleier??? Obviously, Pivetta and Murphy aren’t available by default. Implied, Wincowski and Martin were both stay away / emergency only. I do realize that if an arm had been brought in by trade, there’s a chance you end up with more guys than you need. There’s also a chance that in the next ten games - the earliest we could optimistically see both Sale and Houck back (both not built up at all) - we have another few games directly impacted in the way that G1 and G3 Seattle were, where due to either extra innings or maybe one of the bulk guys finally just doesn’t have it, the bullpen chart gets messed up for days. There’s a very real possibility that the pitching staff falls apart in this way before either of Sale and Houck is back and built up enough to start. Also, I’m not accusing the team of lying about it persay, but two elbow related IL stints in three months is really damn concerning re: Whitlock, at least to this guy. I just think it’s worth a rule 5 bubble guy and an interesting third tier Salem/FCL guy to raise the pitching floor a bit. An extra innings game or doubleheader really screws things up. Water under the bridge now. |
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Post by FenwayFanatic on Aug 2, 2023 21:48:22 GMT -5
@fabianardaya
Mookie Betts and J.D. Martinez texted their old teammate Eduardo Rodriguez this week to see if he was going to waive his no-trade clause. Neither of them got a response before Tuesday's trade deadline, which was answer enough
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cdj
Veteran
Posts: 16,000 
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Post by cdj on Aug 2, 2023 22:45:54 GMT -5
E-Rod had a bad year off the field last year, I’m sure he just wants to be left alone and out of the spotlight. Very easy situation for him right now. Getting thrust into a pennant race in LA is definitely much different than pitching in front of 75 people at comerica- just doesn’t seem like he wants to put his family through the switch and I respect that.
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Post by Oregon Norm on Aug 2, 2023 23:20:42 GMT -5
Someone has to tell me why they need any bats at all. Haven't people been looking at what the offense is doing? They've got 6-7 guys carrying OPS+ numbers at or well above 120, and that's before Story returns. Do they not have this deluxe minor league system they've rebuilt? What am I missing here?? As for monetization and asset values, he got Turner at a ridiculous discount, a greatly undervalued Yoshida on a more than reasonable contract - to the likely dismay of the naysayers - and the lineup heavyweights are increasingly effective young guys making peanuts. I'm at a loss... You are at a loss because you don't know that Eder (SP) and Reynolds (RP) are pitchers I was saying to get in exchange for our excess of bats, where Eder in particular is a lefty who could be in the conversation for Cy Youngs when he makes it to the bigs after the TJ he is recovering from. My apologies then. First morning look small screen, etc... should have read more carefully. That does make some sense. |
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Post by julyanmorley on Aug 3, 2023 7:38:24 GMT -5
Rosenthal reporting that the Detroit GM talked to ERod a few times leading up to the trade deadline and he indicated he would waive the no trade, and then on deadline day his agent got involved and demanded 1 year/$20 million be added to his contract to do it.
He also has rival exec's saying Detroit's asking price was too high. The Dodgers apparently met it though, which makes me really want to know how those last minute Paxton discussions went.
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Post by soxfansince67 on Aug 3, 2023 7:50:59 GMT -5
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Post by bcsox on Aug 3, 2023 8:56:14 GMT -5
In retrospect and yesterday was another glaring example in a season full of them, but do we think there was any motivation for Chaim to pull a 2004 Theo deadline position and say screw it, we are going defense. This team, and Raffy has been brutal, just can’t seem to get out if their own way defensively. It is a major obstacle to their playoff run that went unaddressed at the deadline.
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Post by notstarboard on Aug 3, 2023 9:26:21 GMT -5
In retrospect and yesterday was another glaring example in a season full of them, but do we think there was any motivation for Chaim to pull a 2004 Theo deadline position and say screw it, we are going defense. This team, and Raffy has been brutal, just can’t seem to get out if their own way defensively. It is a major obstacle to their playoff run that went unaddressed at the deadline. Trevor Story will be back imminently and middle IF is the only spot that could have be upgraded without trading away a productive player with several years of control remaining. |
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Post by nonothing on Aug 3, 2023 9:51:09 GMT -5
You are at a loss because you don't know that Eder (SP) and Reynolds (RP) are pitchers I was saying to get in exchange for our excess of bats, where Eder in particular is a lefty who could be in the conversation for Cy Youngs when he makes it to the bigs after the TJ he is recovering from. My apologies then. First morning look small screen, etc... should have read more carefully. That does make some sense. No worries of course. Very much appreciate all you guys do. It's a lot! |
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Post by scottysmalls on Aug 3, 2023 9:56:05 GMT -5
Rosenthal reporting that the Detroit GM talked to ERod a few times leading up to the trade deadline and he indicated he would waive the no trade, and then on deadline day his agent got involved and demanded 1 year/$20 million be added to his contract to do it.
He also has rival exec's saying Detroit's asking price was too high. The Dodgers apparently met it though, which makes me really want to know how those last minute Paxton discussions went.
That's kind of weird for someone who we everyone assumes will opt out because he can do better than 3/45. Is that effectively saying his agent doesn't think he'll be able to get 4/65? I guess that's not a lock but it also doesn't seem by itself a reason to decline if you'd otherwise be willing to accept the trade. |
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Post by incandenza on Aug 3, 2023 10:27:53 GMT -5
From the links thread: McCaffrey speculates that it would have taken Casas or Duran for the Red Sox to beat the Rays' offer for Aaron Civale, which, uh, yeah... glad they didn't pay the necessary price to add a mid-rotation starter (if that's even what Civale is). |
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Post by redsoxpride34 on Aug 3, 2023 10:32:06 GMT -5
It's really not though. Duran is playing pretty much every day at this point. Maybe 6 of 7 or something but not to a degree it's "hindering his development." Also, how is there a crunch w/ pitching? Walter is in AAA w/ options, Drohan isn’t on the 40 man, and Mata has been hurt for a majority of the season and will be lucky to have any impact on the big league roster this season. Lastly, it’s entirely likely Whitlock will be working out of the pen when he’s back, Pivetta is getting more starting opportunities with the way he’s pitching and Sale/Houck are likely going to be an opener and bulk duo. With all the guys coming back you Bello, Sale, Houck, Paxton, Crawford plus Pivetta. I agree Whitlock may/should end up in the pen but if they still want him to start you effectively have 7 starters for 5 spots. I'm not expecting guys like Mata and Drohan to contribute right away but by the end of the month/into early September there's a good chance at least one of them will be ready to go. Mata was close in spring training and there was talk of him being called up within the first few months of the season. Duvall has been playing more regularly as of late and Duran has typically been the guy who's been sent to the bench. Particularly against lefty starters Duvall starts over Duran. I for one would rather let the young guys play against lefties otherwise they will never improve against them. By keeping Duvall, there is also now an inherent obligation to play him as justification. Same goes for Turner to a lesser degree. Cedanne Rafaella is crushing AAA and I would much rather see him come up down the stretch than give more starts to guys who won't be on the team next year. |
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Post by julyanmorley on Aug 3, 2023 10:33:30 GMT -5
Rosenthal says Justin Turner to Marlins was close
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Post by bloomstaxonomy on Aug 3, 2023 10:39:55 GMT -5
And that the Sox were interested in Verlander…
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Post by geostorm on Aug 3, 2023 10:40:39 GMT -5
Rosenthal says Justin Turner to Marlins was close "The Marlins felt they were close to acquiring Turner. When the proposed deal fell through, they pivoted to trades for two other hitters, Josh Bell and Jake Burger. What the Red Sox would have received in return for Turner is not known. But for president of baseball operations Chaim Bloom to again consider disrupting his clubhouse in the middle of an encouraging season, the package must have been enticing. The Marlins are deep in controllable starting pitching, precisely what Bloom was seeking to acquire at the deadline. Why would the Red Sox even consider moving Turner, who could become a free agent if he declines his $13.4 million player option for next season, when his value to them extends far beyond his 17 home runs and .837 OPS? It’s just the way modern front offices operate, gauging values of players, setting a bar for a return and generally acting if a potential trade partner exceeds that standard." |
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Post by incandenza on Aug 3, 2023 10:45:28 GMT -5
Rosenthal says Justin Turner to Marlins was close "The Marlins felt they were close to acquiring Turner. When the proposed deal fell through, they pivoted to trades for two other hitters, Josh Bell and Jake Burger. What the Red Sox would have received in return for Turner is not known. But for president of baseball operations Chaim Bloom to again consider disrupting his clubhouse in the middle of an encouraging season, the package must have been enticing. The Marlins are deep in controllable starting pitching, precisely what Bloom was seeking to acquire at the deadline. Why would the Red Sox even consider moving Turner, who could become a free agent if he declines his $13.4 million player option for next season, when his value to them extends far beyond his 17 home runs and .837 OPS? It’s just the way modern front offices operate, gauging values of players, setting a bar for a return and generally acting if a potential trade partner exceeds that standard." This is sort of a funny line. Like, yes, this is how you decide whether to make a trade or not... Were things different in the good ol' days?
As for the report, it's (unsurprisingly) coming from the Marlins' side, and it's not hard for me to imagine that the Marlins might have thought Bloom was closer to agreeing to something here than he actually was. But who knows.
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Post by Smittyw on Aug 3, 2023 10:47:41 GMT -5
Rosenthal says Justin Turner to Marlins was close "The Marlins felt they were close to acquiring Turner. When the proposed deal fell through, they pivoted to trades for two other hitters, Josh Bell and Jake Burger. What the Red Sox would have received in return for Turner is not known. But for president of baseball operations Chaim Bloom to again consider disrupting his clubhouse in the middle of an encouraging season, the package must have been enticing. The Marlins are deep in controllable starting pitching, precisely what Bloom was seeking to acquire at the deadline. Why would the Red Sox even consider moving Turner, who could become a free agent if he declines his $13.4 million player option for next season, when his value to them extends far beyond his 17 home runs and .837 OPS? It’s just the way modern front offices operate, gauging values of players, setting a bar for a return and generally acting if a potential trade partner exceeds that standard." "Why would the Red Sox even consider moving Turner..." "The Marlins are deep in controllable starting pitching" A mystery indeed. |
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Post by FenwayFanatic on Aug 3, 2023 10:48:28 GMT -5
Teams were usually more clearly buyers or sellers I think is his point.
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Post by bloomstaxonomy on Aug 3, 2023 10:48:58 GMT -5
I wonder if Edward Cabrera was dangled in front of Chaim. There was a lot of smoke in regards to that name over the past offseason but I don’t think any of that smoke came from legit sources. A lot of it was speculation. Maybe it would have been a Verdugo and Turner package for something bigger…
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Post by geostorm on Aug 3, 2023 10:48:58 GMT -5
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Post by julyanmorley on Aug 3, 2023 10:52:52 GMT -5
I'm not taking the Verlander thing too seriously. The Red Sox always check to see what the price is. The deal doesn't really fit, though. Verlander may not have even waived his no trade clause for us, he would have put us over the cap and Chaim would never in a million years match what was the winning bid
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Post by manfred on Aug 3, 2023 10:54:09 GMT -5
Teams were usually more clearly buyers or sellers I think is his point. The multiple WC has totally changed that. If there were no WC, obviously the Sox would be in dump mode. But now teams are really in ambiguous positions. |
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Post by julyanmorley on Aug 3, 2023 10:57:09 GMT -5
As for the report, it's (unsurprisingly) coming from the Marlins' side, and it's not hard for me to imagine that the Marlins might have thought Bloom was closer to agreeing to something here than he actually was. But who knows.
The leak is a little damaging to the Red Sox given prior comments about Turner being off the table. I wonder if there is some petty grudge from someone in Miami. |
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Post by FenwayFanatic on Aug 3, 2023 10:57:42 GMT -5
The Red Sox trading Nomar was the main example I thought of in the past when the Red Sox traded from one area to another, not really clearly buying or selling, and it working.
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Post by bloomstaxonomy on Aug 3, 2023 10:58:41 GMT -5
Only makes sense if the Mets were on the hook for nearly the entirety of the remainder of this year’s salary. We can afford to pay Verlander whatever his salary is next year. They ended up sending something like $50mil to the Astros so it wouldn’t be surprising if that stipulation was agreeable to them. Wonder what the Sox prospect equivalent of what the Mets received is. One of Anthony/Rafaela and then somebody like Romero/Gonzalez/Jordan? Not sure. |
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