SoxProspects News
|
|
|
|
Legal
Forum Ground Rules
The views expressed by the members of this Forum do not necessarily reflect the views of SoxProspects, LLC.
© 2003-2024 SoxProspects, LLC
|
|
|
|
|
Forum Home | Search | My Profile | Messages | Members | Help |
Welcome Guest. Please Login or Register.
8/4-8/6 Red Sox vs. Blue Jays Series Thread
|
Post by redsox56 on Aug 5, 2023 22:52:43 GMT -5
You know, I really don't think Houck's velocity being down a tick in his first rehab stint after missing seven weeks after taking a liner in the face is a good reason to write him off for the season. No, but I wouldn't count on him for that same reason this season ie, might take a long time to come back from. Bryce Florie is the best example of that.
|
|
|
Post by redsox56 on Aug 5, 2023 23:04:27 GMT -5
Lose tomorrow, doesn't matter who's coming back. Pack it up, 5 games back of the third wildcard with 2 teams in front of you. They should take it slow with everyone by then.
|
|
|
Post by congusgambler33 on Aug 5, 2023 23:32:29 GMT -5
Wasn't there a question of Verdugos's maturity or character when we acquired him? Big time. But it is not to be discussed! Fangraphs’ scouting report still says they question his makeup, too.
I know, I wish he would go a bit lighter on the rouge.
|
|
|
Post by dirtywaterinla on Aug 5, 2023 23:33:07 GMT -5
I’m late to the party, but holy shit — what a dramatic day.
Genuinely curious what the hell is going on with the Verdugo situation. Cora categorizing the team as a whole stepping back when publicly it’s just Dugie in question is perplexing and deeply concerning. One player’s misstep is not worth that type of categorization.
I personally wouldn’t be shocked if Verdugo gets added to the restricted list. Something seems more deeply wrong than being late…
|
|
|
Post by congusgambler33 on Aug 5, 2023 23:42:06 GMT -5
I was hoping that the rodenhizer heat zone would have been Alex Verdugo
|
|
|
Post by notstarboard on Aug 6, 2023 1:39:49 GMT -5
Wow. The game has changed. Always was taught that even if you think it is gone or not going to be caught, you better be sure. No reason for him to go when he is in scoring position. If it hits the wall, he could still score from half way to third. What a coincidence that the manager of a team with shockingly poor fundamentals also displays shockingly poor fundamentals
|
|
|
Post by soxfansince67 on Aug 6, 2023 7:20:10 GMT -5
|
|
cdj
Veteran
Posts: 15,677
|
Post by cdj on Aug 6, 2023 8:07:33 GMT -5
I don’t think they’re losing because they don’t care as Buckley seems to imply, I think they’re losing because they can’t play defense if their life depended on it. No amount of caresies changes that. The difference in the score was once again defense. It’s not rocket science
And honestly the guy who apparently doesn’t care is the only one who *does* play good defense outside of Chang and Wong
|
|
bigmarty58
Rookie
2011 Pancreatic Cancer Survivor - One of the lucky ones
Posts: 166
|
Post by bigmarty58 on Aug 6, 2023 8:13:27 GMT -5
Leadership on all levels has let this team down. Not sure that this season will end up well. If not then ownership needs to assess if the leadership needs to be changed.
|
|
|
Post by Guidas on Aug 6, 2023 8:13:40 GMT -5
*** WARNING - 100% Speculation *** I have no knowledge or inside information. Just reading between the lines. When I read this line from Cora..... "He was ready to play but he wasn’t available,” it makes me think that Verdugo showed up drunk or high and hence wasn't in condition to play.....further speculating this could have become a growing problem that is contributing to his second half slump. If this is true then I tip my hat to Cora & Bloom for keeping things internal as best they can. I also, tip my cap to Verdugo for saying all the right things and hopefully he has learned his lesson and everyone can move forward. If it is a bigger issue, I hope he gets the help he needs. *** WARNING - 100% Speculation *** Yeah this occurred to me after I saw the video of his post-game presser… his eyes sure look a little red to me. I’m sure we won’t find out until after Verdugo leaves the team, whenever that is, at which point someone in the Globe will spill the dirt Verdugo to Jen McCaffrey yesterday : Verdugo was asked if he arrived on time at the park Saturday and said yes, but later he admitted his head has not been in the game lately. Earlier in the season, Cora benched Verdugo for not hustling on a play in Cleveland. “I got to be better and I expect more from myself,” Verdugo said. “Just to go out there and finish the next seven weeks strong. “I just expect to be more present,” he added. “I expect to be more just alert, understanding of the game, what’s going on, reading the pitchers, seeing how they’re working the hitters, just more in tune with the game and in tune with everything. I feel like I’ve been kind of battling myself a little bit. So it’s time to just kind of stop battling myself and go battle the pitcher.” Sounds like the man needs some help. God bless.
|
|
|
Post by Guidas on Aug 6, 2023 8:14:38 GMT -5
I don’t think they’re losing because they don’t care as Buckley seems to imply, I think they’re losing because they can’t play defense if their life depended on it. No amount of caresies changes that. The difference in the score was once again defense. It’s not rocket science And honestly the guy who apparently doesn’t care is the only one who *does* play good defense outside of Chang and Wong Buckley’s an agenda-driven hack.
|
|
|
Post by redsox04071318champs on Aug 6, 2023 8:17:30 GMT -5
Yeah this occurred to me after I saw the video of his post-game presser… his eyes sure look a little red to me. I’m sure we won’t find out until after Verdugo leaves the team, whenever that is, at which point someone in the Globe will spill the dirt Verdugo to Jen McCaffrey yesterday : Verdugo was asked if he arrived on time at the park Saturday and said yes, but later he admitted his head has not been in the game lately. Earlier in the season, Cora benched Verdugo for not hustling on a play in Cleveland. “I got to be better and I expect more from myself,” Verdugo said. “Just to go out there and finish the next seven weeks strong. “I just expect to be more present,” he added. “I expect to be more just alert, understanding of the game, what’s going on, reading the pitchers, seeing how they’re working the hitters, just more in tune with the game and in tune with everything. I feel like I’ve been kind of battling myself a little bit. So it’s time to just kind of stop battling myself and go battle the pitcher.” Sounds lije the man needs some help. God bless. The obvious question....why has his head not been in the game lately?
|
|
|
Post by soxfansince67 on Aug 6, 2023 8:17:51 GMT -5
For all of the keyboard warriors here who dis about every writer - you make laugh at your various " expertise". All of you journalists? Team owners or managers? It's important to read - a lot - broadly. We can all have opinions on what they write, but the constant smear jobs on them when they write something we don't agree with is sad.
|
|
|
Post by pappyman99 on Aug 6, 2023 8:23:53 GMT -5
I’m not sure why we are surprised? This team has essentially been the same as it was all season?
My fear is the deadline rumors and this with Verdugo will make bloom settle for a crap return on Verdugo in the off-season.
I mean in the end with this Verdugo news and Betts going for a possible 7 WAR season….
Bloom and ownership should honestly feel shame for that whole move (not to rehash, I’m thinking that has to be the thinking in the ownership / GM rooms right now).
|
|
|
Post by vokuhila on Aug 6, 2023 8:24:24 GMT -5
Verdugo to Jen McCaffrey yesterday : Verdugo was asked if he arrived on time at the park Saturday and said yes, but later he admitted his head has not been in the game lately. Earlier in the season, Cora benched Verdugo for not hustling on a play in Cleveland. “I got to be better and I expect more from myself,” Verdugo said. “Just to go out there and finish the next seven weeks strong. “I just expect to be more present,” he added. “I expect to be more just alert, understanding of the game, what’s going on, reading the pitchers, seeing how they’re working the hitters, just more in tune with the game and in tune with everything. I feel like I’ve been kind of battling myself a little bit. So it’s time to just kind of stop battling myself and go battle the pitcher.” Sounds lije the man needs some help. God bless. The obvious question....why has his head not been in the game lately? Pure speculation: looks like the sox are not interested in extending him + he was actively shopped at the deadline + his hitting slump...each one of those can get to you...maybe the combination of all of them did...not a good look though
|
|
|
Post by manfred on Aug 6, 2023 8:27:53 GMT -5
The obvious question....why has his head not been in the game lately? Pure speculation: looks like the sox are not interested in extending him + he was actively shopped at the deadline + his hitting slump...each one of those can get to you...maybe the combination of all of them did...not a good look though There are a lot of guys who are motivated to play harder by those things. I think it is weird that guys are all over Raffy for shortcomings even on a day when he was the offense… but people are going kind of easy on a player who has quit on the team. Was he late because of beer and chicken?
|
|
|
Post by redsox04071318champs on Aug 6, 2023 8:34:59 GMT -5
I donât think theyâre losing because they donât care as Buckley seems to imply, I think theyâre losing because they canât play defense if their life depended on it. No amount of caresies changes that. The difference in the score was once again defense. Itâs not rocket science And honestly the guy who apparently doesnât care is the only one who *does* play good defense outside of Chang and Wong Buckleyâs an agenda-driven hack. Buckley's columns don't really wreak of intelligence. I think, at least outside of Verdugo, they care. I dont think its lackadaisical effort. They're a poorly constructed defensive team. Other than subtracting out Kiké little has been done to remedy that. Casas has been bad at 1b. 2b has been unstable. SS, other than Chang, has been a disaster. I'm not even sure how good Story will be at SS. Devers has been almost as bad at 3b as Kiké was at SS. Yoshida is also better off as a DH. Duran is improved and I'm guessing about average? Rafaela would certainly be an improvement to say the very least. I think Verdugo has actually been pretty damn good in RF. But overall this is a pretty bad defensive team. The baserunning hasn't been good either. Too many boneheaded running plays. You cant get rid of the team when this happens so usually it's the manager who pays, with his job. The mystery to me is what happens with the offense. It's a pretty good offense. Thet have a dynamic leadoff hitter. I have no idea why Cora keeps yanking Yoshida in an out of the 2 hole. They have a good veteran righty bat in Turner, a very good power bat in Raffy, although not as great as hoped for, and an emerging lefty power bat in Casas, a good hit tool bat in Verdugo and a good Renfroe like power bat in Duvall and then eventually Story. But its like the offense can go on vacation for a week at a time, and if they don't light up the scoreboard they cant win because they're pitching plus defense cant keep the other team's run totals down. Seems like if Devers has a down week they're in trouble because they're missing a masher to pick up the slack. Right now if I'm a pitcher I only fear Devers in the lineup, although I take solace in that I can get him to chase. I would hate dealing with Duran because he's a pain. I'd be scared if he knew how to bunt his way on. He's already hitting his way on quite often and then all hell breaks loose. I'd worry about Yoshida and Turner, but that's really it. As good as the lineup can be, it can be pitched to.
|
|
|
Post by pappyman99 on Aug 6, 2023 8:35:55 GMT -5
Pure speculation: looks like the sox are not interested in extending him + he was actively shopped at the deadline + his hitting slump...each one of those can get to you...maybe the combination of all of them did...not a good look though There are a lot of guys who are motivated to play harder by those things. I think it is weird that guys are all over Raffy for shortcomings even on a day when he was the offense… but people are going kind of easy on a player who has quit on the team. Was he late because of beer and chicken? The Devers hate is kind of odd. We already knew he would be up and down defensively. Offensively just about all his rate stats are the same other than the lowest BABIP of his career, so far this season. Just because he got paid more was not going to make him a better player. His season this year is literally at his career averages, almost across the board The overall problem I’d say is we can’t move him to DH or 1B for what’s seems like at least until 2028, but that could be okay though Moving him to DH in his age 31 season was possibly always the move?
|
|
|
Post by Guidas on Aug 6, 2023 8:37:28 GMT -5
For all of the keyboard warriors here who dis about every writer - you make laugh at your various " expertise". All of you journalists? Team owners or managers? It's important to read - a lot - broadly. We can all have opinions on what they write, but the constant smear jobs on them when they write something we don't agree with is sad. I was a stringer for The NY Times, The Hartford Courant, and a few papers down here in the south in the 1990s. I also had a syndicated column for four years and did freelance writing for several magazines for more than a decade. I've done quite a bit of writing since then that I've gotten paid for it, often quite well. I'll say it again: Buckely is an agenda-driven hack. Shaughnessey is a lazy, knee-jerk writer in a sinecure who basically recycles the same 8-9 columns ad nauseum. Tony Mazarrotti is a sports-focused Karen. I'll add that your books on tomatoes are usually better written and researched than some of the work by the two above writers.
|
|
|
Post by redsox04071318champs on Aug 6, 2023 8:42:46 GMT -5
The obvious question....why has his head not been in the game lately? Pure speculation: looks like the sox are not interested in extending him + he was actively shopped at the deadline + his hitting slump...each one of those can get to you...maybe the combination of all of them did...not a good look though Good thought. That and being passed over for the all star game could drill into his head that he's not valued and respected by management or respected by fans and his peers. That could be eating at his psyche and being PH for could have been a trigger. Maybe there are deeper issues. I'd like to think he didnt show up drunk or stoned but something happened, although I don't know if it was severe as that. He was in the lineup and then scratched. My guess is he berated Cora and Cora wasn't going to take it, but again speculation. It might be awhile. Eventually it'll get out what happened. Maybe it's as simple as he arrived later than he was supposed to yet again and his preparation had been lackadaisical yet again and Cora finally had enough. I think when he gets traded for a middle reliever this winter, we'll find out.
|
|
|
Post by redsox04071318champs on Aug 6, 2023 9:11:10 GMT -5
The Red Sox are good enough to make the post season. You dont sell when you have a real shot. The problem is that the Sox forever continue to beat themselves. Last year they flat out werent good enough. This year they would be if they stopped being their own worst enemy. The team baseball IQ is horrendous. They make stupid baserunning decisions. They play horrendous team defense. They dont hit in the clutch. They make questionable managerial decisions They dont get the big out. They find ways to lose winnable games consistently. The 2004 Red Sox team beat themselves with bad defense until Theo bravely fixed their "fatal flaw", defense, adding a bunch of gloves at the deadline. This year's team still has the same issues plaguing them after the deadline. They needed to win this game. They needed to put pressure on Toronto this series. Instead they're back in the basement, now behind NYY and Seattle, neither team that improved themselves at the deadline, too. This game was a kick on the balls. It'll be interesting to see how they respond. If they win tomorrow, maybe they'll hang around awhile. Maybe theyll get hot again given that they're entering the cake stretch of their schedule before it gets rough the rest of the season. Or if they lose tomorrow, then I think they're done. 5 games out isnt impossible to overcome. But when you have a team that is on the cusp of where it needs to go, then has their opportunity and then spits the bit, that tells me they dont have the balls to win. Thet lose tomorrow, yeah theyll rebound a bit against KC and Washington, but they're dead. Theyll just be playing out the string...in August yet again. Which is inexcusable when your team can spend 225 million and only has to he the 5th best team to make the playoffs. If/when they fail to make the postseason I have to think Cora will be gone. And if 2024 comes and goes with more of the same then I doubt Bloom gets extended.The next GM will benefit from Bloom's vastly improving farm system and we'll have the same GM debates over and over again. Tomorrow's game is the most crucial game of the season. Murphy is a lefty who has been surprisingly great. My guess is he, like Bernardino today, is due for a bad game and with Toronto's righty strong lineup, I dont expect good things tomorrow. Let's see how they respond to today's debacle. So aggravating. They get to 7 games over .500, piss it away, and then waste two months getting back there, peak at 9 over and then instead of continuing their momentum they drop 6 of 7 and piss things away yet again. This will be interesting if they don't make the playoffs. And despite the utter dreck and wreck of the last week, they still have ample opportunity in this near-NHL style system. But in reference to the bolded above, in late July on the podcast with Cotillo, McAdam said something that I thought was really interesting and noted it for potential future reference (paraphrasing here because I don't want to go back and re-listen): McAdam - "Cora is John Henry and Tom Werner's guy. Bloom is very much Kevin Kennedy's guy. Remember, Kennedy ran that whole search and presented Bloom to Henry and Werner as the guy. They ultimately OK'ed the hiring decision but it was very much Kennedy's big moment and hire. If push comes to shove between Bloom and Cora, it will be interesting to watch to see which one - or both - is let go." Interesting. Makes you wonder about Sam Kennedy's future, too (Kevin Kennedy was the Sox manager in 1995-6, lol) I see that Bloom is building a very promising inventory of talent that could hit during the second half of this decade? Will they trust him to do what Dombrowski did, which was to sort out the talent, determine who are the keepers and who are more expendable and convert the excess into talent that the system is lacking or consolidating the excess into higher level talent? Bloom is definitely setting the table, but can he be the guy to deliver the meal? Geez what a stupid analogy,lol. But you get the point. Will Sox management give Bloom that chance? Can he if he is given that chance? What if Cora and Bloom dont see eye to eye? My guess is that despite being Henry/Werner's guy, he'll get fired ahead of Bloom anyways. Tom Brady is Bob Kraft's favorite son, but he let Belichick low ball him and drive him away. He didnt intervene to save him and I think it'll be similar with Henry and Werner.
|
|
cdj
Veteran
Posts: 15,677
|
Post by cdj on Aug 6, 2023 9:14:25 GMT -5
Verdugo to Jen McCaffrey yesterday : Verdugo was asked if he arrived on time at the park Saturday and said yes, but later he admitted his head has not been in the game lately. Earlier in the season, Cora benched Verdugo for not hustling on a play in Cleveland. “I got to be better and I expect more from myself,” Verdugo said. “Just to go out there and finish the next seven weeks strong. “I just expect to be more present,” he added. “I expect to be more just alert, understanding of the game, what’s going on, reading the pitchers, seeing how they’re working the hitters, just more in tune with the game and in tune with everything. I feel like I’ve been kind of battling myself a little bit. So it’s time to just kind of stop battling myself and go battle the pitcher.” Sounds lije the man needs some help. God bless. The obvious question....why has his head not been in the game lately? Grandma died? Obviously everybody loves their grandmothers but in Mexican culture they hold a certain type of standing within the family, they are the matriarch. Mother also was diagnosed with cancer recently. I’m sure that’s not easy! This is the shit I’m talking about with this market being unfairly harsh, people just start talking reckless about players without realizing they’re human He’s a terrible person! Much easier to just ride with that so that’s what people do
|
|
|
Post by Guidas on Aug 6, 2023 9:19:57 GMT -5
This will be interesting if they don't make the playoffs. And despite the utter dreck and wreck of the last week, they still have ample opportunity in this near-NHL style system. But in reference to the bolded above, in late July on the podcast with Cotillo, McAdam said something that I thought was really interesting and noted it for potential future reference (paraphrasing here because I don't want to go back and re-listen): McAdam - "Cora is John Henry and Tom Werner's guy. Bloom is very much Kevin Kennedy's guy. Remember, Kennedy ran that whole search and presented Bloom to Henry and Werner as the guy. They ultimately OK'ed the hiring decision but it was very much Kennedy's big moment and hire. If push comes to shove between Bloom and Cora, it will be interesting to watch to see which one - or both - is let go." Interesting. Makes you wonder about Sam Kennedy's future, too (Kevin Kennedy was the Sox manager in 1995-6, lol)I see that Bloom is building a very promising inventory of talent that could hit during the second half of this decade? Will they trust him to do what Dombrowski did, which was to sort out the talent, determine who are the keepers and who are more expendable and convert the excess into talent that the system is lacking or consolidating the excess into higher level talent? Bloom is definitely setting the table, but can he be the guy to deliver the meal? Geez what a stupid analogy,lol. But you get the point. Will Sox management give Bloom that chance? Can he if he is given that chance? What if Cora and Bloom dont see eye to eye? My guess is that despite being Henry/Werner's guy, he'll get fired ahead of Bloom anyways. Tom Brady is Bob Kraft's favorite son, but he let Belichick low ball him and drive him away. He didnt intervene to save him and I think it'll be similar with Henry and Werner. This is what happens when I'm caffeine free before typing on my phone. And it's obvious I'm still damaged by the "Kevin Kennedy experience." SAD!
|
|
|
Post by Guidas on Aug 6, 2023 9:22:40 GMT -5
FIFM:
This will be interesting if they don't make the playoffs. And despite the utter dreck and wreck of the last week, they still have ample opportunity in this near-NHL style system.
But in reference to the bolded above, in late July on the podcast with Cotillo, McAdam said something that I thought was really interesting and noted it for potential future reference (paraphrasing here because I don't want to go back and re-listen): McAdam - "Cora is John Henry and Tom Werner's guy. Bloom is very much Kevin (ugh) Sam Kennedy's guy. Remember, Kennedy ran that whole search and presented Bloom to Henry and Werner as the guy. They ultimately OK'ed the hiring decision but it was very much Kennedy's big moment and hire. If push comes to shove between Bloom and Cora, it will be interesting to watch to see which one - or both - is let go."
|
|
|
Post by manfred on Aug 6, 2023 9:25:04 GMT -5
The obvious question....why has his head not been in the game lately? Grandma died? Obviously everybody loves their grandmothers but in Mexican culture they hold a certain type of standing within the family, they are the matriarch. Mother also was diagnosed with cancer recently. I’m sure that’s not easy! This is the shit I’m talking about with this market being unfairly harsh, people just start talking reckless about players without realizing they’re human He’s a terrible person! Much easier to just ride with that so that’s what people do By that logic, we should just assume something is nagging Devers when he throws. I’m sure he has problems. Take a leave of absence. But don’t dog it. I’m totally sympathetic to people going through hard things, but dogging it is not a good response.
|
|
|