wcp3
Veteran
Posts: 3,842
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Post by wcp3 on Apr 30, 2013 21:55:38 GMT -5
If you don't think Lester's a 2, I don't know what to tell ya.
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Post by bluechip on Apr 30, 2013 22:07:49 GMT -5
Willl Middlebrooks - Say big fella, those pitches outside the strike zone are, uh, outside the strike zone, and while you may hit some of them a long way when you're going good, you're not going good at this particular moment of your very brief MLB career. So lay off those, ok big guy? Great. Good talk. (aside to everyone else: Anyone know when Almazar will be ready?) Watching Middlebrooks bat is so unbelievably frustrating.
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Post by station13 on Apr 30, 2013 22:22:52 GMT -5
Salty is brutal and cost them tonight.
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Post by bluechip on Apr 30, 2013 22:28:57 GMT -5
Salty is brutal and cost them tonight. Lester was terrible tonight and cost them this game. How was this Salty's fault in the least?
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Post by Don Caballero on Apr 30, 2013 22:29:50 GMT -5
I think people just need to accept the fact that Lester is a #2, not an ace. Which, by the way, is still a really good pitcher. I think I could accept this if I felt it were true. Is he good enough to be considered a 2? He's the Sox 2, but I don't know, we'll see. Just throw strikes for Christ sake. Over the past 6 years, Jon Lester has thrown over 1000 innings of 3.59 ERA ball. I could ask you to find a better #3 in the MLB, but I thought this would be unfair to you.
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Post by station13 on Apr 30, 2013 22:30:19 GMT -5
I think people just need to accept the fact that Lester is a #2, not an ace. Which, by the way, is still a really good pitcher. I think I could accept this if I felt it were true. Is he good enough to be considered a 2? He's the Sox 2, but I don't know, we'll see. Just throw strikes for Christ sake. Despite his nice ERA heading into this game, he has pitch more like a mid-rotation guy. He hasn't exactly made it easy in his starts with all the walks and high pitch count.
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Post by station13 on Apr 30, 2013 22:32:12 GMT -5
Salty is brutal and cost them tonight. Lester was terrible tonight and cost them this game. How was this Salty's fault in the least? Throwing the ball to the OF? And the terrible job navigating Tazawa through the 7th? Toying around Bautista to face EE, who has been scorching lately.
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Post by bluechip on Apr 30, 2013 22:36:26 GMT -5
Lester was terrible tonight and cost them this game. How was this Salty's fault in the least? Throwing the ball to the OF? And the terrible job navigating Tazawa through the 7th? Toying around Bautista to face EE, who has been scorching lately. The the ball that went into the outfield was umpire interference. His hand hit the Ump's mask, once an out was failed to be recorded, the ball should have been ruled dead. That was on the umpire (for failing to make the correct call) not Salty. Salty gets a lot of flack and rightfully deserves much of it. Nevertheless, he is not the cause of every single defeat.
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Post by elguapo on Apr 30, 2013 22:43:47 GMT -5
Salty gets a lot of flack and rightfully deserves much of it. Nevertheless, he is not the cause of every single defeat. The problem is that he is a bad influence on younger players. He told WMB it's okay to strike out all the time if you occasionally hit home runs.
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Post by fenwaythehardway on Apr 30, 2013 23:04:04 GMT -5
Lester was terrible tonight and cost them this game. How was this Salty's fault in the least? Pitch framing! The answer to everything! That no one noticed or cared about two years ago. But it's the most important thing ever!
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Post by bentossaurus on Apr 30, 2013 23:21:54 GMT -5
Salty gets a lot of flack and rightfully deserves much of it. Nevertheless, he is not the cause of every single defeat. The problem is that he is a bad influence on younger players. He told WMB it's okay to strike out all the time if you occasionally hit home runs. Not able to find the italics button buddy? Because I hope that's not true.
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Post by mredsox89 on May 1, 2013 0:31:51 GMT -5
Lester is off to arguably the best season start of his career, and one bad outing and all of a sudden everyone turns on his production again? Come on now. Time to rehash the debate on what # starter Lester is. He's a top 2 starter on a good to great team. He's 10th in WAR over the past 3 seasons, 7th over the past 5 years. He's got a better defense behind him and a competent manager/pitching coach for the first time in a few years.
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Post by Oregon Norm on May 1, 2013 0:35:04 GMT -5
I would like to petition the site to have the Gomes - Carp combo in left be called the Gorp platoon until further notice. It just feels right.
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Post by mattpicard on May 1, 2013 0:49:43 GMT -5
Pete Abraham ?@peteabe 2h Victorino didn't want to talk about his injury. He hid in the hallway after showering and had somebody bring him his clothes to avoid media ()
Hmm. And Pete, after he's praised Shane so much so far, seems a little upset about it based on some of his other tweets.
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Post by wskeleton76 on May 1, 2013 4:35:15 GMT -5
Lester is off to arguably the best season start of his career, and one bad outing and all of a sudden everyone turns on his production again? Come on now. Time to rehash the debate on what # starter Lester is. He's a top 2 starter on a good to great team. He's 10th in WAR over the past 3 seasons, 7th over the past 5 years. He's got a better defense behind him and a competent manager/pitching coach for the first time in a few years. Completely agreed.
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Post by hammerhead on May 1, 2013 6:51:32 GMT -5
I would like to petition the site to have the Gomes - Carp combo in left be called the Gorp platoon until further notice. It just feels right. I personally think that Carp's nickname should be Xerox........ Because everytime I go to a sox game all I hear from the stands is Kah-py , Kah-py , hit a Homah Kah-py.
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Post by jmei on May 1, 2013 7:39:30 GMT -5
Lester is off to arguably the best season start of his career, and one bad outing and all of a sudden everyone turns on his production again? Come on now. Time to rehash the debate on what # starter Lester is. He's a top 2 starter on a good to great team. He's 10th in WAR over the past 3 seasons, 7th over the past 5 years. He's got a better defense behind him and a competent manager/pitching coach for the first time in a few years. Completely agreed. +1
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Post by brianthetaoist on May 1, 2013 8:27:11 GMT -5
Well, Lester *would* be a #2 if he had a catcher to throw to that didn't RUIN EVERYTHING! He would get eleventy billion more strikes with proper framing, guys could never hit him.
Seriously, though, I'm still a little concerned with Lester. He's not getting nearly as many swings and misses with his cutter as he used to. In 2009, when batters swung at his cutter, they missed almost 30% of the time. Last year, that was down to 23% of the time, and this year it's down to 15% in what's still a small sample. And the break on it is different, as well. In 2009, PitchFx measured it's horizontal and vertical break both at 6 inches different from his four seamer; so far this year there has been around 4 inches separation on the horizontal and only 2 inches vertical. His cutter was such a key pitch for him ... and it's just not darting in and down on right-handers like it used to. But, like I said, it's still early, we'll see.
He's still a good pitcher, but I'm not really expecting him to be dominant. Luckily, Buchholz looks to be truly dominant, but I don't know if dreams of a "double ace" situation are gonna play out.
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Post by Guidas on May 1, 2013 8:38:32 GMT -5
Pete Abraham ?@peteabe 2h Victorino didn't want to talk about his injury. He hid in the hallway after showering and had somebody bring him his clothes to avoid media () Hmm. And Pete, after he's praised Shane so much so far, seems a little upset about it based on some of his other tweets. That sounds like actions over words tell that Victorino is headed for the DL to me.
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Post by elguapo on May 1, 2013 9:42:10 GMT -5
I personally think that Carp's nickname should be Xerox........ Because everytime I go to a sox game all I hear from the stands is Kah-py , Kah-py , hit a Homah Kah-py. The wife calls Hanrahan "Hammerhead". So there ya go.
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Post by GyIantosca on May 1, 2013 15:15:39 GMT -5
It's a fact the Sox will lose games this year. Having said that, how frustrating this game was. I mean Who does Salty think he is? Tony Pena? Also Ells getting picked off unreal. If Lester just pitched a little better also. I feel bad for Tazawa but he shouldn't of walked the leadoff hitter. I wish Bard can be the old Bard with Tazawa and Uehara. Wow what a combination the 7th inning would be locked down.
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Post by mattpicard on May 1, 2013 15:55:33 GMT -5
Buster Olney mentioned on WEEI that the Sox may be looking to upgrade over Salty behind the plate. I really hope they move him. Good guy but I can't stand watching him catch or bat.
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Post by gregblossersbelly on May 1, 2013 16:01:51 GMT -5
It's a fact the Sox will lose games this year. Having said that, how frustrating this game was. I mean Who does Salty think he is? Tony Pena? Also Ells getting picked off unreal. If Lester just pitched a little better also. I feel bad for Tazawa but he shouldn't of walked the leadoff hitter. I wish Bard can be the old Bard with Tazawa and Uehara. Wow what a combination the 7th inning would be locked down. Tazawa got the first two guys out. He walked Batista with 2 outs.
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Post by jmei on May 1, 2013 16:09:51 GMT -5
Buster Olney mentioned on WEEI that the Sox may be looking to upgrade over Salty behind the plate. I really hope they move him. Good guy but I can't stand watching him catch or bat. What clear upgrades might be available via trade? Carlos Ruiz? Brian McCann?
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Post by soxfan06 on May 1, 2013 17:18:32 GMT -5
Boy, it would be nice not to have to watch Salty 3 out of ever 5 nights.
Some people may want to defend him but he is a below average player. Therefore, the Red Sox should be doing everything in their power to upgrade him.
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