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6/18-6/19 Red Sox vs. Rays Series Thread
wcp3
Veteran
Posts: 3,833
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Post by wcp3 on Jun 18, 2013 21:35:59 GMT -5
I told you idiots not to give up on Gomes.
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Post by Oregon Norm on Jun 18, 2013 21:36:17 GMT -5
Gomes is a steamy pile of garbage. ...and?
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Post by mattpicard on Jun 18, 2013 21:37:20 GMT -5
Gomes is a steamy pile of garbage. Gomes is a steamy pile of garbage. Agreed. Get rid of him & bring up Brentz. 14 HRs & 49 RBIs What up guys?
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wcp3
Veteran
Posts: 3,833
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Post by wcp3 on Jun 18, 2013 21:37:58 GMT -5
People on this board need to familiarize themselves with the reverse jinx.
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Post by taftreign on Jun 18, 2013 21:38:38 GMT -5
Guess Carp can stay under something heavy tonight! Gomes is great for the clubhouse and provides great leadership. I bet he shows up huge down the stretch in key spots. Doesn't have any quit in him.
Bring out he brooms tomorrow!
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Post by Guidas on Jun 18, 2013 21:39:07 GMT -5
That's one way to do it. I've been chipping on Gomes as much as anyone but he got all of that one (thank God for theMonster).
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Post by bjb406 on Jun 18, 2013 21:39:50 GMT -5
Trade for Jesse Crain. Him and Tazawa can duel for closer. Bailey was great as a set up man for us earlier this year. No excuse for Bailey sucking, but this is on Farrell in my opinion. Everyone knew we had a much bigger chance of blowing the lead if he made that change. God no. How many times have we gotten screwed trading for middle relievers they think can close? And Do you know why we always get screwed? Because it is ALWAYS a bad deal.
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Post by jfizznet on Jun 18, 2013 21:41:36 GMT -5
Bailey now 3-0. Impressive.
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Post by ray88h66 on Jun 18, 2013 21:42:08 GMT -5
What a great game baseball is. Peaks and Valleys, pull your hair out and do a victory dance, all in the same inning.
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Post by gregblossersbelly on Jun 18, 2013 21:42:13 GMT -5
Johnny "Dropkick" Gomes! Ball and The Bat!!!!!!!!!!
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Post by mattpicard on Jun 18, 2013 21:43:25 GMT -5
Trade for Jesse Crain. Him and Tazawa can duel for closer. Bailey was great as a set up man for us earlier this year. No excuse for Bailey sucking, but this is on Farrell in my opinion. Everyone knew we had a much bigger chance of blowing the lead if he made that change. God no. How many times have we gotten screwed trading for middle relievers they think can close? And Do you know why we always get screwed? Because it is ALWAYS a bad deal. Except unlike other relievers we've acquired, Crain is an extremely low-paid reliever with 4 months left on his deal. And he's a terrific set up man at the very least. And the White Sox are definitely going to move him. And he's made some critical changes to his pitching approach this season that have allowed him to dominate against lefties and righties. So unless we give up a highly valuable prospect, I don't know about a "God no." I loved Gomes punting that helmet. Classic.
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Post by godot on Jun 18, 2013 21:45:10 GMT -5
Where is Guidas to trash Gomes ? Guidas will be okay; he still has Bailey. Unfortunately, so do the Sox. Boy, they needed that game. Xtra innings just would not be good. Salty earned his salary today. Someone mentioned giving Miller a shot st closer, but the guy can get into a wild streak. You do not want a closer with this tendency. Taz has not been as dominate as of late, and don't know if Breslow can pitch that often. Although I do like him, as he throws strikes.
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Post by semperfisox on Jun 18, 2013 21:46:12 GMT -5
Gomes is still trash
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Post by marrcus on Jun 18, 2013 21:46:46 GMT -5
Two things changed tonight.
1. Farrell's charge is to try and get the best from him but...Bailey is now buried.
Sorry but that's the way it is. Big picture or not I can't believe he gets the ball again (Gammo agreed I think?)until he proves himself with some clean innings.
2. Drew is going to have to sit more. WMB has to play. Iggy just gets stronger. He bailed Bailey out --as well-- with that play to 2b (still not convinced he got the runner).
So glad Gomes didn't miss that fat pitch.
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Post by Oregon Norm on Jun 18, 2013 21:49:28 GMT -5
Bailey now 3-0. Impressive. Ah yes, the wins and losses. There is some kind of karma here. I guess for all the times he won and didn't deserve it, this one is one Doubront richly deserved but had denied him by old "3 and 0". So it goes in the grand old game. Also, for those of you who are riding the schizoid train: if closers aren't that important, then why attach any importance to Bailey's rough patch? I'd like Farrell to do what he did this afternoon and use the hot hand when convenient. Thing is, he didn't have a lot of choices this evening having played all the card's except Bailey's over the course of the doubleheader. I'd suggest not attaching too much importance to the guy in the ninth. It's often a crap shoot. It wouldn't surprise me if he were to put up five or six consecutive scoreless performances. The team won, now lets see what they can do tomorrow.
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Post by James Dunne on Jun 18, 2013 21:50:09 GMT -5
God no. How many times have we gotten screwed trading for middle relievers they think can close? And Do you know why we always get screwed? Because it is ALWAYS a bad deal. Example? I can't remember a situation where they traded for a middle reliever with the intention of making him a closer, and having it blow up. There are a few times they've acquired proven closers and they've not succeeded. In 2003, they decided it was a good idea to put Grady Little at the helm of an unorthodox bullpen strategy. But I can't recall a single situation where the Red Sox have traded for a middle reliver with the intent of making him a closer, and had it blow up. The closest I can think of was when they signed Chad Fox to a $500K deal and sort of let him compete for the closer role, and 2007, when they pretended in spring training that Joel Pineiro might be a closer. Both were low-risk investments, and their failure was hardly something that hurt them long-term. Most of the failed closers the Sox have had over the years (Hanrahan, Slocum, maybe Kim and Bailey) were all closers before Boston got them. Ken Ryan was home grown, pitched well in the role for a season, then blew up.
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Post by bluechip on Jun 18, 2013 21:51:31 GMT -5
Great great game from Doubront. He did exactly what was needed from him during the second game of a doubleheader.
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Post by jrffam05 on Jun 18, 2013 21:55:39 GMT -5
God no. How many times have we gotten screwed trading for middle relievers they think can close? And Do you know why we always get screwed? Because it is ALWAYS a bad deal. Except unlike other relievers we've acquired, Crain is an extremely low-paid reliever with 4 months left on his deal. And he's a terrific set up man at the very least. And the White Sox are definitely going to move him. And he's made some critical changes to his pitching approach this season that have allowed him to dominate against lefties and righties. So unless we give up a highly valuable prospect, I don't know about a "God no." I loved Gomes punting that helmet. Classic. I was scouting fan graphs about a month back for players who would make sense at the trade deadline. Crane seemed to fit. I think a trade that might make sense towards the deadline is Crane to Sox, Drew to Pirates, Player X to White Sox. Unless the Pirates want to give us Melancon back (who I said was not smart to trade). Crane shouldn't be thought of as a closer, but a good bullpen arm to make a playoff run with, with a chance to resign like we did with Breslow. Good pitching performance today from guys we have been quite down on. Aceves might of went 7 if it wasn't for the rain, and you could have marched Doubrount back out there from the 9th and taken 2 RBI's away from Gomes.
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Post by jmei on Jun 18, 2013 22:04:01 GMT -5
Bailey has had a few bad outings in a row, but his peripherals are still solid (3.22 ERA, 3.60 xFIP). He's almost certainly not the best reliever in the bullpen (Uehara and Tazawa are probably better), but having your best reliever not in the closer role is probably better anyways (assuming you want someone in the traditional closer role). I'm still in favor of giving Bailey a long leash to work out any problems he might have-- his stuff is still as good as its ever been, but he needs to work on his command, and I'm willing to let him work it out in the "closer" role. For better or for worse, bullpen hierarchies are still important to managers, players, and fans, and I'd rather maintain a stable bullpen structure until a player shows over a longer sample size that his performance is no longer up to the task.
Also: the Red Sox bullpen is still pretty stacked, especially in terms of the top five of Bailey, Uehara, Tazawa, Miller, and Breslow. And even behind them, they have some combination of Morales, Wilson, Mortensen, Aceves, and the AAAA guys (Beato, De La Torre, Carter) for the last two spots. Plus, there's the possibility that guys like De La Rosa, Webster, and Chris Martin can help this team during the stretch run. Honestly, I can think of a bunch of spots on the team that I would address before the bullpen (starting pitching, third base, catcher, outfield, for instance).
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Post by pedroelgrande on Jun 18, 2013 22:11:09 GMT -5
Felix Stinking Doubront and Jonny Stinking Gomes. U mad haters?
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Post by bjb406 on Jun 18, 2013 23:53:22 GMT -5
God no. How many times have we gotten screwed trading for middle relievers they think can close? And Do you know why we always get screwed? Because it is ALWAYS a bad deal. Example? I dont mean just guys who had no closer experience, I mean anyone who is not an elite reliever, but they thought would at least compete for the role, regardless if they had done it before, and I was talking about Bailey, Melancon, and Hanrahan just in the last year and a half. For those guys we gave up Reddick, Head, Alcantara, Lowrie, Weiland, Pimental, Sands, and Dejesus (we also received Brock Holt). And none of those guys have been the best reliever on our team at any point. My point is relievers are both incredibly volatile, and not nearly as valuable as starters or everyday players, so it is stupid to repeatedly pay out the ass for a reliever over an over again. Our bullpen is already really deep, so we should just go forward with the guys we have, and in the future only build our bullpen with prospects who fail as starters (Bard, Miller, etc.), or guys who can be had cheaply (okajima, uehara, Breslow, etc.).
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Post by Legion of Bloom on Jun 19, 2013 0:17:49 GMT -5
So let me get this straight, Doubront is allowed to throw 100+ in 5-6 inning outings, but when he's dominating he can't get 1 more inning? I don't understand the logic. Also, Bailey has been pretty awful since he has returned from the DL and was inserted at closer. At this point, I wouldn't mind bringing Papelbon back if it meant taking on his contract and giving up C- talent.
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Post by pasadenasox on Jun 19, 2013 1:07:38 GMT -5
I totally agree with jmei.
Still not sold on Gomes, but I'm happy when he comes up big.
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Post by adiospaydro2005 on Jun 19, 2013 6:52:43 GMT -5
So let me get this straight, Doubront is allowed to throw 100+ in 5-6 inning outings, but when he's dominating he can't get 1 more inning? I don't understand the logic. Also, Bailey has been pretty awful since he has returned from the DL and was inserted at closer. At this point, I wouldn't mind bringing Papelbon back if it meant taking on his contract and giving up C- talent. Phillies are negotiating a large TV contract. Neither Lee nor Papelbon is going anywhere. It might be better to focus on putting Aceves in the bullpen on a more permanent basis as a middle reliever. At least that way he might be ready to pitch by the middle to late innings once he fights through traffic.
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Post by bjb406 on Jun 19, 2013 7:10:18 GMT -5
So let me get this straight, Doubront is allowed to throw 100+ in 5-6 inning outings, but when he's dominating he can't get 1 more inning? I don't understand the logic. Also, Bailey has been pretty awful since he has returned from the DL and was inserted at closer. At this point, I wouldn't mind bringing Papelbon back if it meant taking on his contract and giving up C- talent. neither would I, but get the feeling it would cost more.
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