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Post by umassgrad2005 on Aug 7, 2023 10:35:53 GMT -5
Patriots may have gotten 5 or 6 starters out of this draft. Gonzalez (no doubter), White (likely future starter), Mapu (no doubter), Sow/Andrews/Mafi (likely one future starter there), Ryland and Barringer (both likely), and Demario Douglas. Insane class, injuries not withstanding. Also took the family to training camp yesterday. Tyquan looked pretty good in 11’s. Don't forget Boutte who per reports has come on the last 4-5 practices, nevermind Bolden getting first team reps and working at punt returning. Sow, Andrews and Speed haven't been generating much noise at least on daily Twitter updates. Those bums lol.
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Aug 6, 2023 13:52:07 GMT -5
Trent Brown at practice, not participating again. Anderson seen at practice for first time, but in street cloths.
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Aug 6, 2023 12:09:26 GMT -5
You need to look at production, replacements and cap situations. Historically lots of free agent deals are bad and a lot of teams get themselves in cap trouble. So those numbers get skewed.
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Aug 6, 2023 12:01:39 GMT -5
Kind of interesting how this team has been dropping games since Rosenthal mentioned Turner was almost traded to Miami. Turner for someone like Cabrera would have been a good trade long term but you can't tell players they're safe then still talk deals about them after the fact. Yes its only been 3 games but they've looked dead out there. If guys are moping about trades that didn’t even happen (not saying this is or isn't true, but it's been a theory about Verdugo's struggles as well), then they need to grow up. Not feeling in the mood for these lame excuses for a second year in a row. Absolutely, if that's the case this team needs a new culture and a bunch of new leader types. In reality this team is streaky, got red hot and was always going to cool off at some point. Let's hope it's short and they go on another tear any day now.
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Aug 6, 2023 10:18:34 GMT -5
I will say I think Luis Urias was a brilliant move and one of the better under the radar moves of the deadline. Let's give credit, where credit is do.
That being said, saying you wanted pitching then saying you didn't make a move because prices were too high isn't a good look. Especially because he was looking at non rentals, which is kinda crazy at the deadline.
Per reports he had a chance to move Turner for that controllable pitching and turned it down. You had a glut of hitters and a top prospect tearing it up at AAA. Who could have given the whole team a spark and much needed defense. Yet he doesn't pull the trigger because of his disaster of a deadline last year. You certainly don't do a fire sale like he should have last year, yet a rebalancing trade makes 100% sense.
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Aug 6, 2023 0:03:15 GMT -5
Trent reported early, passed the conditioning test, and was seen by multiple beat guys handling a post-practice sprint with ease. So to speculate on his being on the lower fields due to "conditioning," seems incongruent with the reported facts. My guesses: 1) Trent wants mid to top vet LT pay, so it's a hold-in, of sorts; 2) Bill is getting looks at others -- he knows what Trent looks like & wants a look at others. It is early in camp & there are a lot of new (and returning from injury) OL players. It's an either/or for me, at this point. Too little information to have any sort of real opinion. Edit to add: it might just be he has a "tweak" and trainers feel better safe than sorry. www.bostonherald.com/2023/08/01/patriots-ot-trent-brown-sitting-out-second-straight-practice-tuesday-8-others-missing/There's a 2nd reporter saying the exact same thing. You are either at practice or sent to the other field to work on conditioning and it's called the conditioning field. That isn't speculation as it 100% happened. He then sat out two practices which Lazar speculates might be a contract thing. You can certainly speculate why he was sent there, yet it certainly happened. I'd also point out a conditioning test is a bare minimum type thing to allow you to practice. It doesn't mean your in great shape. Now I'm just passing information along, I have no clue what is going on. All we know two days on conditioning field, followed by two days of no practice. My personal opinion is that it's not Bill wants to look at other players. Not given the reports we got from the 4 days he missed, it wasn't good.
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Aug 5, 2023 10:48:54 GMT -5
Evan Lazar is speculating Trent Brown sitting out last two practices is because he wants what Judon just got. I really hope that's wrong, Judon deserved it. Brown is lucky to have a chance to earn $11 million this year, no other team was going to give him that contract after last year. Does speculate Brown should be back for Joint Practices.
Also says chances of seeing Anderson before end of camp sound not good. Converting Sow to OT, yet he has a long way to go, likely for next year.
Reiff and McDermott haven't exactly been doing great either. McDermott better run blocker than pass blocker.
On the one hand our defensive pass rushers are crazy, adding a healthy Barmore and White to last years unit. Reports Uche looks better than last year. On the other hand this is worst case type crap, instead of getting better we have injuries, guys sitting out and whatever Anderson non football issue is. If it wasn't for the two rookies, especially Mafi the OL would be a dumpster fire. At minimum it looks like we've got the needed interior depth we lacked last year. Still OT is currently a dumpster fire.
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Aug 5, 2023 9:51:20 GMT -5
JC was waived giving up two open roster spots.
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Aug 4, 2023 23:17:46 GMT -5
Jack Jones the football player is a great young CB. JJ the person scares me. As to yesterday, I have zero issues. I'd rather he walks away and cools down than starts a fight or something like that.
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Aug 4, 2023 11:27:47 GMT -5
Is that really a fair comp? You traded him for prospects, not a major league pitcher when you need pitching. In terms of clubhouse presence, I think that's a pretty fair comp. Everyone raves about the presence that Turner has brought to this team. Cora was interviewed on MLB Network last week and talked about how amazing he has been within the clubhouse. He went further and says he's gotten to a point where he'll bring Turner in on why he makes certain in-game decisions because he believes he'll be a manager once he retires. Also on the prospects vs major league pitcher comment: Cabrera has struggled a ton this year and is not even on the MLB roster currently. So even though he may not be a "prospect" anymore, he sure isn't a slam dunk impact starter. Just to be clear, if the Marlins offered me Cabrera for Turner, I'd accept it instantly. I really like Cabrera and think he could turn into something. But I understand how much of a negative impact it would have on the clubhouse, to the point they may feel the front office was punting on the season. The Marlins have Perez in minors also and he's been lights out. That team is loaded with young pitchers. Bloom we need controllable pitchers, Devers we need pitching. You have 4 Starting level OF with good bats and top prospect killing it in AAA. Story on the way, Urais was also traded for. If the team thinks that's punting, then we likely have the wrong mix of players. I can understand being disappointed, yet that can change with the engery an electric prospect can bring and we really need an upgrade on D.
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Aug 4, 2023 10:45:42 GMT -5
For those claiming that trading Turner would have been viewed as punting on the season, are you forgetting that Trevor Story is almost back? Turner has hit well no doubt, but his game/impact is one dimensional. He's a mediocre defender and a slow base runner. So its really just his bat which limits his impact. Its also unlikely his he continues to produce at this level offensively the rest of the way. Once Story is back, Turner should also slide down in the batting order. The top 6 should be Duran, Verdugo, Devers, Story, Yoshida, Casas. I'd rather have say Rafaella in CF and Yoshida at DH with Cabrera in the rotation than Turner at DH, Yoshida in LF and the current rotation. I think it has less to do with his play on the field, and more related to how much of a hit it would be to the morale of the clubhouse. We saw how poorly the Vazquez trade was received last year, it almost felt like the team gave up after that. Moving Turner would likely have a similar effect, and arguably even a bigger one. Is that really a fair comp? You traded him for prospects, not a major league pitcher when you need pitching.
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Aug 4, 2023 10:44:22 GMT -5
2.9 bwar over his last 31 starts. SABR stats are funny to me sometimes certainly for pitchers anyway. His MLB career he has a 4.22 ERA, 4.94 FIP and 4.34 xFIP good for a .5 fWAR in 175 inninigs. He has excellent stuff with 10.08 K/9 but no control with a 5.35 BB/9. I have a hard time gauging how good Cabrera really is, if he can ever harness his control then he should be a very good pitcher. If not well he's probably a bullpen arm or out of the league in a few years. That ERA is exactly league average, which given the walks is darn good. Yeah it's a gamble, you don't get a guy with his controllable years and stuff without question marks without it costing half the farm. I take that gamble every day for a 38 year old player, especially when you have legit well above average bats to take his spot and an elite prospect cooking in AAA. If he gets back to last years 4.1 walk rate, he's a very valuable player and helps the team for years.
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Aug 4, 2023 10:38:32 GMT -5
When was the last draft class that looked this good at this time of year? All the way to Mafi greatly improving while playing LG and RG to Bolden getting some snaps on first team D across from Gonzalez. The two rookie WR, the two specialists. It's early, but the reports so far have been highly encouraging.
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Aug 4, 2023 8:57:03 GMT -5
One thing you have to keep in mind about Cabrera is that he's not good 2.9 bwar over his last 31 starts.
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Aug 4, 2023 8:01:46 GMT -5
If Turner for Cabrera was on the table and you turned that down, that's like going all in. Trades like that are the creative trades I've been waiting for Bloom to make. You get the pitcher you needed and call up a top prospect to man the 4th OF spot, while greatly increasing your OF D.
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Aug 3, 2023 13:21:22 GMT -5
I wonder if Edward Cabrera was dangled in front of Chaim. There was a lot of smoke in regards to that name over the past offseason but I don’t think any of that smoke came from legit sources. A lot of it was speculation. Maybe it would have been a Verdugo and Turner package for something bigger… They just optioned him to AAA, so could have very well been him. I don't think it would have been Verdugo. Part of the reason you can trade Turner is giving the 4 OF full-time ABs and bring up a certain CF in AAA to add D. That makes sense and with getting a pitcher like Cabrera could greatly improve team. Moving two guys makes no sense. Type of deal I would have given Bloom major props if he pulled it off. Can make a case we got a lot better this year and in future.
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Aug 3, 2023 10:04:53 GMT -5
See more reports about the plays Tre Nixon is making than Thornton is eye opening. Macs best downfield throw to date to Nixon.
Thornton went like 4 practices without a catch, but Douglas, Boutte and Nixon are making playing, along with of course the Veterans. That exactly what you want from a 2nd round player in his 2nd year.
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Aug 3, 2023 9:34:39 GMT -5
Those aren't my words, Patriots beat writer on Twitter said sent down to conditioning field. For the 2nd straight day. But here they "are your words." You posted them without context, thus making them your own. Lots of players do work on the lower field. For some players it is conditioning work. For others, it is other work. It is unlikely Trent is doing conditioning work because, as noted above, he seems by many/most accounts to be in good condition (for a huge offensive tackle). For a football writer to label it the "conditioning field" (and perhaps push a negative Trent narrative through inference) is either very sloppy work or entirely disingenuous. Sounds like something the sports talk radio guys would do. No they are Evan Lazar exacts words and he's saying conditioning field because he's there in person and that's what is happening. The guy literally works for the Patriots, he's not twisting anything. You can go on Twitter and see for yourself. Just like today's reports that Brown isn't in pads and doing practice yet again, for 3rd straight day.
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Aug 2, 2023 21:32:36 GMT -5
Trent Brown 2nd straight day sent down to conditioning field. W/ Judon & Rhamondre & I think Thornton too on the lower fields. With Trent it seems it's always assumed to be conditioning but not those other guys. Yet beat guys & BB have said Trent looks good & last week ran the post practice sprints with ease. Now if you want to speculate on LT contract ... Those aren't my words, Patriots beat writer on Twitter said sent down to conditioning field. For the 2nd straight day.
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Aug 2, 2023 17:36:58 GMT -5
Trent Brown 2nd straight day sent down to conditioning field.
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Aug 2, 2023 9:01:42 GMT -5
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Aug 2, 2023 9:00:06 GMT -5
I'm not against bring him to AAA for a short stint then bring him up, but the guy has been on fire in AAA for a month. If he's not brought up quickly, then the deadline looks much different. Him and Story bashing could take the offense to crazy levels!
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Aug 2, 2023 8:54:15 GMT -5
If you want to look at guys not traded who you could end up losing for nothing and maybe should have traded them, I don't think that's Mata. Yeah he's likely a reliever, but you shouldn't be dumping a guy with his arm and strikeouts in AAA without giving him a chance. What so you can pickup a guy on waviers?
Both Walters and Murphy pitched well in bullpen really helping the team after not be great as starters. Give the guy a chance in spring training. He sucks and get claimed trying to move him to AAA so be it.
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Aug 2, 2023 8:22:59 GMT -5
I do wonder if his plan of acquiring guys with extra control versus rentals was an issue. Deadline is always more expensive, you should never really want to go after controllable pitching at the deadline. Do that in the offseason, more options and better prices.
Was he in on ERod? I have to imagine the price tanked after Dodgers deal fell threw, wanted to be on East cost. Tigers getting nothing now for a guy that is almost guaranteed to be walking.
Our guys are getting close to going on assignment, but that could still be 3-4 weeks and that's with no set backs. Given how short we've been on pitching already, you're asking for trouble wearing guys down. Nevermind another injury.
Now maybe I'm wrong, yet all the talk was about controllable pitching and this team really just needed bodies to give them some innings.
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Aug 1, 2023 18:13:02 GMT -5
It's a nice trade.
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