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Post by greatscottcooper on Jul 6, 2023 15:02:35 GMT -5
I’m going to drop Yushinobu Yamamoto updates till the day he gets introduced by Chaim as the Red Sox new acquisition. After week 14, he leads the Pacific league in: ERA (1.81) FIP (1.61) WHIP (0.891) Oppo. BA (.204) He’s amazing. I have a large vinyl printer, I’ll make some signs and hang them from bridges everywhere along Bloom/Henry’s daily commutes. And then we go after Roki the year after next.
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ericmvan
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Post by ericmvan on Jul 7, 2023 4:16:27 GMT -5
To bring this back to 2023 ... Cora has made it clear that they are stretching out Pivetta to be a bulk guy -- exactly what I hoped for a while back. He outche 4 innings his last time out and has four days rest for the first game of the A's series. I'd expect him to go 5.
In his Sox career he has a .317 xwOBA and .321 wOBA as a starter after the first inning, as opposed to .368 / .359 in the first. He's been borderline 3/4 starter after the first. .
It's easy to see him sticking in the bulk role (eventually as the virtual 5th starter) while Houck goes to the pen
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ericmvan
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Post by ericmvan on Jul 10, 2023 19:04:34 GMT -5
Sox announced Bello, Paxton, Crawford for the Cubs series after the break. That means they expect Whitlock to pitch game 2 of the following A's series, on the day he's eligible to come off the IL, with TBD / Pivetta bulk going in game 1.
If Whitlock were not going to be ready, they would have split the two opener / bulk games: x + Pivetta in game 3, Crawford starting the A's series, and then x + Murphy.
There are so many off days after the two road series that they can start the post-ASB rotation with 5 man, 4 man, 5 man while having almost everyone throw on 5 days rest. The exceptions would be Bello on 4 days to close out the A's series and Paxton on 4 days rest in his 3rd start post-break. I really hope they do that.
Meanwhile, the Houck injury will give us a long look at Pivetta as a bulk guy. His xwOBA / wOBA (PA) breakdown by role so far, which has a way cool distribution of games and batters faced:
.283 / .187 (33) short relief (8 G)
.288 / .252 (39) long relief (4G)
.174 / .243 (33) bulk (2 G)
Note that his outing when Whitlock left after 1 inning is in the middle bucket.
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Post by carmenfanzone on Jul 10, 2023 22:16:43 GMT -5
Sox announced Bello, Paxton, Crawford for the Cubs series after the break. That means they expect Whitlock to pitch game 2 of the following A's series, on the day he's eligible to come off the IL, with TBD / Pivetta bulk going in game 1.
If Whitlock were not going to be ready, they would have split the two opener / bulk games: x + Pivetta in game 3, Crawford starting the A's series, and then x + Murphy.
There are so many off days after the two road series that they can start the post-ASB rotation with 5 man, 4 man, 5 man while having almost everyone throw on 5 days rest. The exceptions would be Bello on 4 days to close out the A's series and Paxton on 4 days rest in his 3rd start post-break. I really hope they do that.
Meanwhile, the Houck injury will give us a long look at Pivetta as a bulk guy. His xwOBA / wOBA (PA) breakdown by role so far, which has a way cool distribution of games and batters faced:
.283 / .187 (33) short relief (8 G)
.288 / .252 (39) long relief (4G)
.174 / .243 (33) bulk (2 G)
Note that his outing when Whitlock left after 1 inning is in the middle bucket.
Do we even know if Whitlock has been throwing since he was shut down? I hope you are right, but I am not sure.
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ericmvan
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Post by ericmvan on Jul 10, 2023 22:39:42 GMT -5
Sox announced Bello, Paxton, Crawford for the Cubs series after the break. That means they expect Whitlock to pitch game 2 of the following A's series, on the day he's eligible to come off the IL, with TBD / Pivetta bulk going in game 1.
If Whitlock were not going to be ready, they would have split the two opener / bulk games: x + Pivetta in game 3, Crawford starting the A's series, and then x + Murphy.
There are so many off days after the two road series that they can start the post-ASB rotation with 5 man, 4 man, 5 man while having almost everyone throw on 5 days rest. The exceptions would be Bello on 4 days to close out the A's series and Paxton on 4 days rest in his 3rd start post-break. I really hope they do that.
Meanwhile, the Houck injury will give us a long look at Pivetta as a bulk guy. His xwOBA / wOBA (PA) breakdown by role so far, which has a way cool distribution of games and batters faced:
.283 / .187 (33) short relief (8 G)
.288 / .252 (39) long relief (4G)
.174 / .243 (33) bulk (2 G)
Note that his outing when Whitlock left after 1 inning is in the middle bucket.
Do we even know if Whitlock has been throwing since he was shut down? I hope you are right, but I am not sure. After the reassuring MRI it was reported that he was expected to miss just one start because of the ASB. He missed one already, ano it seems safe to guess that he's throwing. He might have a rehab start on Friday in Jacksonville and if there's anything that is off, they can reshuffle the A's series.
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Post by pappyman99 on Jul 18, 2023 7:37:39 GMT -5
I know it’s spring training, but at what point is Crawford given a chance to start? He was clearly a better starter than reliever last season. Further more Cora made the statement that crawford / Wink could hold down the 5/6 spot in rotation. If so that probably puts Houck into pen full time. This has been my point for a while, but apparently Pivetta’s innings pitched will just disappear into a black hole if we don’t have in in the rotation all season long. Sale Whitlock Bello Kluber Paxton Houck Crawford Pivetta. The fan base here seems hellbent on making sure our 8th best talented starter gets the 5th spot automatically. Even though the worst case scenario would be someone gets hurt or does awful and Pivetta just takes their place then……… Well glaring mistakes and some hits in my pre-season rankings Bello Paxton Definitely start the ranking so far now for the season
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Post by carmenfanzone on Jul 18, 2023 11:03:15 GMT -5
Do we even know if Whitlock has been throwing since he was shut down? I hope you are right, but I am not sure. After the reassuring MRI it was reported that he was expected to miss just one start because of the ASB. He missed one already, ano it seems safe to guess that he's throwing. He might have a rehab start on Friday in Jacksonville and if there's anything that is off, they can reshuffle the A's series.
Or maybe he wasn't throwing and isn't pitching today. I don't think they consider Pivetta's day a bullpen game. HE just doesn't start but they are counting on him pitching starter's innings.
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Post by okin15 on Jul 18, 2023 16:08:22 GMT -5
redsox.com says not to expect Whitlock back before August or September. Only Kluber seems like he's on track to come back less than a month from now.
I hope the Sox skip the bullpen game next time through the rotation. With all the days off the rotation starting tomorrow could be: Bello (4 days rest) off (7/20) Paxton (5) Crawford (5) Pivetta (5, bulk, start, whatever) off (7/24) Bello (5) Paxton (4) off (7/27) Crawford (5) Pivetta (5) Bullpen (could push two days later, but I think they'd do it here to give everyone rest after flying west) Bello (5) Paxton (5) Crawford (4, or traded for SP) off (8/3) 10 in a row at home (hope to have Kluber or traded for SP by then) off (8/14) 16 in a row off (8/31)
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Post by bluechip on Jul 19, 2023 9:03:06 GMT -5
redsox.com says not to expect Whitlock back before August or September. Only Kluber seems like he's on track to come back less than a month from now. I hope the Sox skip the bullpen game next time through the rotation. With all the days off the rotation starting tomorrow could be: Bello (4 days rest) off (7/20) Paxton (5) Crawford (5) Pivetta (5, bulk, start, whatever) off (7/24) Bello (5) Paxton (4) off (7/27) Crawford (5) Pivetta (5) Bullpen (could push two days later, but I think they'd do it here to give everyone rest after flying west) Bello (5) Paxton (5) Crawford (4, or traded for SP) off (8/3) 10 in a row at home (hope to have Kluber or traded for SP by then) off (8/14) 16 in a row off (8/31) Was Murphy’s game really a bullpen game though? Murphy went 4 and 2/3s. If Jacques hadn’t gotten in trouble in the second, Murphy would have gone 5 innings.
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Post by Guidas on Jul 19, 2023 9:40:45 GMT -5
Buried at the end of this piece on Story: "Chris Sale (left shoulder) threw a bullpen session Tuesday." My guess is a sim game would come after a second successful bullpen, and then on to rehab games.
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Post by Guidas on Jul 19, 2023 9:42:03 GMT -5
Sox announced Bello, Paxton, Crawford for the Cubs series after the break. That means they expect Whitlock to pitch game 2 of the following A's series, on the day he's eligible to come off the IL, with TBD / Pivetta bulk going in game 1.
If Whitlock were not going to be ready, they would have split the two opener / bulk games: x + Pivetta in game 3, Crawford starting the A's series, and then x + Murphy. There are so many off days after the two road series that they can start the post-ASB rotation with 5 man, 4 man, 5 man while having almost everyone throw on 5 days rest. The exceptions would be Bello on 4 days to close out the A's series and Paxton on 4 days rest in his 3rd start post-break. I really hope they do that. Meanwhile, the Houck injury will give us a long look at Pivetta as a bulk guy. His xwOBA / wOBA (PA) breakdown by role so far, which has a way cool distribution of games and batters faced: .283 / .187 (33) short relief (8 G)
.288 / .252 (39) long relief (4G)
.174 / .243 (33) bulk (2 G) Note that his outing when Whitlock left after 1 inning is in the middle bucket.
Do we even know if Whitlock has been throwing since he was shut down? I hope you are right, but I am not sure. In the Story piece, it said Whitlock "played catch" on Monday.
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radiohix
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Post by radiohix on Aug 1, 2023 12:54:06 GMT -5
I’m going to drop Yushinobu Yamamoto updates till the day he gets introduced by Chaim as the Red Sox new acquisition. After week 14, he leads the Pacific league in: ERA (1.81) FIP (1.61) WHIP (0.891) Oppo. BA (.204) He’s amazing. BY FAR the best available pitching FA…and he’s only 25 year old.
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ericmvan
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Post by ericmvan on Aug 1, 2023 18:31:45 GMT -5
Not that I've ever been right about the upcoming rotation ...
Crawford is starting Wednesday on 4 days rest. They can't be unaware of how much he's struggled with that, so here's hoping that they've tweaked his between-starts regimen and that it works.
Against the Jays they can start Paxton on 5 days and Pivetta and Bello on 4.
They can avoid Crawford pitching on 4 by having Murphy as bulk just twice, with both in the lovely week where they play the Royals and Tigers. First and last games of the bunch, in my very likely wrong version.
Sale would start on the 11th vs. the Tigers and maybe go 3 or 4.
They then have an off day, 3 games against the Nats, and then the key stretch starts, 18th to 9/1, at Yanks, at Astros, vs. Dodgers, vs. Astros.
If they get Houck or, preferably Whitlock back by August 20 they can go to a strong 6-man rotation. You have 3 guys with extensive injury histories and one guy who struggles on 4-day rest, and you have Whitlock or Houck as your 6th best starter ... it sure seems like the way to go.
Key questions:
How quickly can Sale get back to his formidable form?
How quickly can Whitlock come back, and how good will he be?
With all the short outings, how does the bullpen hold up?
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Post by costpet on Aug 2, 2023 7:47:20 GMT -5
Something crazy to think about: In order to ease Sale back in, why not use him in a closer role for a few games. Switch off with Jansen every other day. He was our closer back in 2018 to close out the World Series. He can let it all hang out for an inning and gain his strength back. We might win a couple of extra games doing it.
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ematz1423
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Post by ematz1423 on Aug 2, 2023 7:58:36 GMT -5
Something crazy to think about: In order to ease Sale back in, why not use him in a closer role for a few games. Switch off with Jansen every other day. He was our closer back in 2018 to close out the World Series. He can let it all hang out for an inning and gain his strength back. We might win a couple of extra games doing it. They let Sale pitch two innings and more so yet 40 pitches last night from what I read. If he can get built up to 60-70 pitches in the next couple rehab starts I'd say he's ready to come back as an opener and throw 3-4 innings for the big league squad. That being said let's knock on wood he makes it back up with no setbacks. Really could use his arm even if just for 4 innings a week.
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Post by FenwayFanatic on Aug 2, 2023 13:39:00 GMT -5
I think its going to be very intriguing to see what happens with Houck and Whitlock.
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Post by incandenza on Aug 3, 2023 10:34:02 GMT -5
From the links thread: Jennings provides a little more detail on the projected return of the injured starters than I've seen elsewhere: So by Aug. 14th or so the rotation could be:
Sale/Houck Paxton Bello Pivetta Crawford
...and then they'd have the luxury of taking their time with Whitlock, but he shouldn't take too much longer in any case. As much as I like Whitlock as a starter long termm, it kind of makes sense to me to bring him back in a relief role, so long as the above guys are all healthy.
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Post by manfred on Aug 3, 2023 10:39:19 GMT -5
From the links thread: Jennings provides a little more detail on the projected return of the injured starters than I've seen elsewhere: So by Aug. 14th or so the rotation could be:
Sale/Houck Paxton Bello Pivetta Crawford
...and then they'd have the luxury of taking their time with Whitlock, but he shouldn't take too much longer in any case. As much as I like Whitlock as a starter long termm, it kind of makes sense to me to bring him back in a relief role, so long as the above guys are all healthy.
They will need to be full strength by August 18th. That marks the start of a brutal 2-week stretch. Yankees, Dodgers, and 7 games against the Astros.
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Post by scottysmalls on Aug 3, 2023 10:43:41 GMT -5
From the links thread: Jennings provides a little more detail on the projected return of the injured starters than I've seen elsewhere: So by Aug. 14th or so the rotation could be:
Sale/Houck Paxton Bello Pivetta Crawford
...and then they'd have the luxury of taking their time with Whitlock, but he shouldn't take too much longer in any case. As much as I like Whitlock as a starter long termm, it kind of makes sense to me to bring him back in a relief role, so long as the above guys are all healthy.
Is it crazy to want Sale to pitch in Boston on Sunday rather than another rehab start? Even if he can only go three innings
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ematz1423
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Post by ematz1423 on Aug 3, 2023 10:50:03 GMT -5
From the links thread: Jennings provides a little more detail on the projected return of the injured starters than I've seen elsewhere: So by Aug. 14th or so the rotation could be:
Sale/Houck Paxton Bello Pivetta Crawford
...and then they'd have the luxury of taking their time with Whitlock, but he shouldn't take too much longer in any case. As much as I like Whitlock as a starter long termm, it kind of makes sense to me to bring him back in a relief role, so long as the above guys are all healthy.
I agree on the long term thing but for the remainder of the season keep him in the pen. Look at yesterday, up 3-2 going into the 7th a guy like Whitlock comes in instead of throwing out a tired Schreiber and maybe we're ecstatic about a W instead of frustrated with a bad L. I have a hard time envisioning a rusty Whitlock as a starter being better than anyone of those 5/6 you outlined as the potential rotation for Aug 14th.
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Post by manfred on Aug 3, 2023 11:02:55 GMT -5
From the links thread: Jennings provides a little more detail on the projected return of the injured starters than I've seen elsewhere: So by Aug. 14th or so the rotation could be:
Sale/Houck Paxton Bello Pivetta Crawford
...and then they'd have the luxury of taking their time with Whitlock, but he shouldn't take too much longer in any case. As much as I like Whitlock as a starter long termm, it kind of makes sense to me to bring him back in a relief role, so long as the above guys are all healthy.
Is it crazy to want Sale to pitch in Boston on Sunday rather than another rehab start? Even if he can only go three innings Honestly, I’m not sure how Sale-as-opener helps much. Bernardino has been really good in that role, and either way you are still taxing the pen. They need more from Sale if he is going to be a difference maker.
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Post by scottysmalls on Aug 3, 2023 11:05:37 GMT -5
Is it crazy to want Sale to pitch in Boston on Sunday rather than another rehab start? Even if he can only go three innings Honestly, I’m not sure how Sale-as-opener helps much. Bernardino has been really good in that role, and either way you are still taxing the pen. They need more from Sale if he is going to be a difference maker. It helps because he wouldn't replace Bernardino on the team he'd replace Jacques or Bleier or Llovera. So you throw him for a few at the beginning of the game then later on you can bring in Bernardino instead of one of those guys.
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ematz1423
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Post by ematz1423 on Aug 3, 2023 11:07:46 GMT -5
Honestly, I’m not sure how Sale-as-opener helps much. Bernardino has been really good in that role, and either way you are still taxing the pen. They need more from Sale if he is going to be a difference maker. It helps because he wouldn't replace Bernardino on the team he'd replace Jacques or Bleier or Llovera. So you throw him for a few at the beginning of the game then later on you can bring in Bernardino instead of one of those guys. Exactly, Sale as an "opener" doesn't mean he starts pitches 1 maybe 2 innings like Bernandino. He goes 3-4 to start with and builds up towards maybe more. It also helps because then you don't have to turn to Bleier in a high leverage situation like they had to yesterday, it opens Bernandino to be in that role instead.
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Post by redsox04071318champs on Aug 3, 2023 13:05:56 GMT -5
Honestly, I’m not sure how Sale-as-opener helps much. Bernardino has been really good in that role, and either way you are still taxing the pen. They need more from Sale if he is going to be a difference maker. It helps because he wouldn't replace Bernardino on the team he'd replace Jacques or Bleier or Llovera. So you throw him for a few at the beginning of the game then later on you can bring in Bernardino instead of one of those guys. Yeah, but...haven't Jacques and Bleier in late high leverage situations been a lot of fun ....oy
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Post by soxinnj on Aug 5, 2023 19:49:48 GMT -5
I know he’s a journeyman, but any clue if Barraclough could help us instead of constantly going with an opener and then a bulk guy and killing the bullpen. Some days you need 6 pitchers to get through a game…if one stinks that day, it crushes you.
I know his numbers have been great at Worcester, but what does his stuff look like? I’d rather see him go 5 or 6 then an opener, a guy for 3/4 and another guy for 1/2.
Thoughts?
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